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  • Delaware and Raritan River Railroad-General Discussion

  • Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New Jersey
Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New Jersey

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 #1598631  by steve coraggio
 
Bracdude 181,

Thank you for replying back quickly. I have some familairity with the Amboy Secondary and Jamesburg where wye is and single track in Jamesburg that goes to Freehold Boro, NJ
I presume that is just an idea or is stared and what about negotiations with CSAO? That would eliminate SA 31 going all the way to the Southern Secondary normally on Thursday afternoons and returns Friday early A.M. Presume SA 31 out of Browns Yard would go to Red bank along the NJ Transit North Jersey Coast Line, drop cars for and return to Browns Yard?. CSAO still runs trains along the Amboy Secondary into Jamesburg and works businesses in the surrounding area . Not sure of there is a spot to park engines in Jamesburg. Steve Coraggio
 #1598632  by CharlieL
 
They have a grant from the state for about $4.5 mil to refurb Freehold to Farmingdale. I would think that will happen quite quickly after they take over operations on the FIT and the Southern Secondary.

Target date for the takeover from CRSA is June 19, this year.
 #1598636  by Bracdude181
 
@CharlieL They have picked up customers in their other areas, but not by much. Plus, everyone they have picked up either already had a siding or just transloads off them. They do still get large trains from time to time up there, especially when several customers get shipments at the same time. (This typically happens at least once a month)

Another thing is, the other areas where C&D operates are mostly out in the boondocks. There isn’t many rail transportation options out there. So for the people closest to them it’s either get carloads off C&D or truck your products in from elsewhere. Because areas like Washington are so far out in the countryside, C&D is the only economical option for anyone who deals with a large amount of bulk products.

In Central NJ there are more options. Raritan Central is right across the bay, Conrail hasn’t completely forsaken Dayton or Hightstown yet, both NS and CSX do heavy transloading near Port Newark, etc.

Believe or not, there are people in the area who actually truck their goods to Morrisville PA (John Blewitt Inc for example) and deal with that area of Conrail rather than over here. Some even transload out of South Jersey. (GEE, I WONDER WHY)
 #1598637  by Bracdude181
 
@CharlieL Last I heard they want to get started on that within the first 2 years of operation. Personally I think they should focus on getting Lakewood to Lakehurst open first. That eliminates the hell that is Cross Street and allows NJSL to FINALLY get going.

Steve, there is a good chance SA31 will be abolished once the Delaware and Raritan River Railroad begins operation. Considerations for splitting the remaining work between SA-3 and SA-22 have been considered. However, I’ve also heard that SA31 will instead be kept around so they can transfer to Jamesburg and to Red Bank, while also doing Dayton and Hightstown. It’s too early to tell right now.

Also, even though the takeover means the end of Conrail providing local freight service on these two lines, it may not mean the end of Conrail trains period…

See, Conrail has retained operating rights over both lines. Correct me if I’m wrong, but does this mean they could do the NJSL transfer at Lakehurst rather than them having deal with C&D, meaning they have to go through two separate railroads just to get their cars to and from Oak Island?
 #1598641  by CharlieL
 
No, they NEED to FINISH it in the first 2 years of operation. The grant has a 3-year life. Almost one year is gone. The grant is for Freehold-Farmingdale, with some repairs to the Southern. Phase 2, which I suspect will also require a grant, is in the future and will probably include upgrades to the Southern..
 #1598645  by Bracdude181
 
They have to regardless because of how bad the Southern is now. The trains are barely staying on the tracks. If nothing is done soon I fear the next derailment pictures I take will be of an engine and cars either completely on their side or at the bottom of a river!
 #1598649  by jdh823
 
Bracdude, overall reading all of your posts, almost everything is negative and pessimistic about the Chesapeake & Delaware?

Why's that? What is so bad about them? I'd say give them a shot before you blindly attack them because they've done pretty good with the D&D.

I'm sure I'd Woodhaven doesn't like their service they probably won't be fitted much for rail service after all. Give these guys a chance. They can turn this around.
 #1598654  by Bracdude181
 
@jdh823 Moat of the pre-filing posts i made were negative because I was under the impression that Dover and Delaware was gonna be running this area. Wasn’t too happy about that because they are god awful.

Since a new company which may have different people pulling the strings is gonna be calling the shots down here, I will give them a chance. That being said, they have a lot of work to do. Especially on the Southern, which is practically the twilight zone compared to their other lines.
 #1598656  by Bracdude181
 
@CharlieL Oh yes…That

I actually took a look at it last Thursday. Why did they fix it with rail that’s so warped and bent?! Then the rail that was cracked? They sheared the broken end off and just bolted another section to it. Not exactly sure how long that’s gonna hold up since that particular stick was already cracked and broken in one spot. Who’s to say it’s not cracked elsewhere?
 #1598659  by jdh823
 
Bracdude181 wrote: Mon May 30, 2022 4:08 pm @CharlieL Last I heard they want to get started on that within the first 2 years of operation. Personally I think they should focus on getting Lakewood to Lakehurst open first. That eliminates the hell that is Cross Street and allows NJSL to FINALLY get going.
No way. Number 1 priority should be to get that gap between freehold-Farmingdale done so they can go to only 1 interchange instead of 2, and they won't need extra power on both sides.
 #1598666  by Bracdude181
 
@jdh823 This is gonna be a long post.

Well for starters they do some questionable things up there. Like putting cheap locks on their replay cases. You know, the ones you can buy at Home Depot for $15 that you pick with a screwdriver or hairpin? Yeah. They put those on boxes that hold thousands of dollars worth of equipment inside. Can’t wait to see them be put on the boxes in Lakewood come to find the copper wires, batteries, and signal rectifiers missing the day after! They also have a really bad habit of going 25 MPH on track where the cars are substantially rocking due at 10 MPH… They also re-did the crossing circuits for 15 MPH (for 10 MPH track?) so when a 25 MPH train comes flying down the tracks the lights come on only 7-10 seconds before the train reaches the road. I’ve seen quite a few cars nearly get hit because of that!

Their tariffs? Not only are they the higher than both CSX and NS (last I checked) and most NJ short lines, but they have one that sticks out. $1000 for any car higher than Plate C, wider than 10 foot six, and weighing over 263,000 pounds. First off, they are the ONLY company I’ve seen that does this. Second, why is this charge even here? I get charging for something beyond the loading gauge, but many modern freight cars are bigger and can be loaded beyond what’s specified in the tariff…

They seem to get a number of complaints from NJT about how RP-1 goes down their tracks. Most recent one I heard was a complaint that they dropped cars off in Dover Yard then shoved back towards Lake Junction (presumably to work the Rockaway Branch?) which held a few trains up. Other complaints have included the presence of flat spots on 2005 and 2006s wheels and issues with PTC.

Service? Well in the sense of actually getting their cars to the customer without issues, they are slightly better than Conrail. Although I have heard that a few of their customers have complained. Mainly Royal Distribution who C&D only runs to as needed now. Have also heard the Rockaway Branch customers aren’t happy that RW-1 got abolished and now RP-1 does it. RW-1 served them three times a week, now C&D only goes up to Dover and Totowa as needed. Berrys Plastics complained a lot too from what I’ve heard, which may have played a role in them shutting their Phillipsburg plant down, maybe not.

Maintenance? They rebuilt Washington Yard, (which they had to because it was almost unusable) and added Plate F capacity to most of their network………that’s about it. Everything else is like Conrail. Left to rot or held together with duct tape. Their crossings constantly fail, their engines smoke like a volcano and leak oil everywhere, bridges that noticeably bend under the weight of trains, tracks that haven’t been tamped and have spikes falling out, etc.

It’s literally Conrail North Jersey only it’s a smaller watered down version with higher prices and nearly all of the same problems.

And before anyone goes “Oh its only a small company they are trying their best!”

Why does the Pine Creek Railroad, a non for profit operation with a far more limited budget and resources have better maintenance?

Why doesn’t Seashore Lines have engines that smoke and leak oil everywhere? They’ve even smaller than C&D and don’t make as much money. Same for SMS. They have some of the oldest and most outdated engines you can possibly operate and they don’t smoke or leak oil.

Why has SRNJ, another small company, completely rebuilt some of their lines? If they can rebuild the Salem Branch with heavy welded rail and redo the roadbed and replace thousands of ties, why can’t C&D do it to the Washington Secondary which all their trains go down to access all their customers?

Yes I know all these different companies have their own problems and situations they deal with. But it still begs the question of why they, with fewer resources and money at their disposal, can do what Dover and Delaware doesn’t.

As for Dover and Rockaway, with the exception of RW-1 being abolished they seem better off. Still the same pricey tariffs but at least the service and maintenance is better. They’ve been doing more transloading too 👍

Back to Delaware and Raritan River, they really do have a chance to turn this area into a major rail network like it was before Conrail Shared Assets. But for the love of god, ONLY if they don’t run it like they run Dover and Delaware! Otherwise the Southern and Freehold Industrial will continue on the downward spiral into hell they’ve been on for the last 19 years now.
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