Sprinter ACS-64 Electric Loco: Siemens.

HBLR wrote:

Tadman wrote:hblr WTF are you talking about?

Can we get a dose of Nasadowsk to straighten us out? (And where is Phil these days?)

I was stating that if a locomotive, or any electric drive had the right components it could indeed play music. However, it would mean that each axle would only be good for traction between specific speeds, hence why i said useless for motive power.

Im still lost, and the above post didn't help......... - all I know is that the locos make all kinds of sounds, from inverters to traction motor blowers to air compressors, to wheel slip to rail singing. BUT, if they stop making noise, thats a problem!

basic railroading rule - quiet = bad

BTW, the "Mod Note" up there needs to go into the RR.net post of fame.........And the referenced youtube vid is now going to play in my head each time I see "those types" of posts from "those types" of posters...........

Tadman wrote: Mod Note: Citing the case of RR.net v. NJT Forum, we're going to allow minor humorous transgressions but no ad hominem attacks. That means no "you suck" or other personal degradation, but we will allow a modicum of snide remarks. Snide remarks are the "locker room method" of letting one know their comments are more than a bit off base. I've changed the image to reflect a no-personal-attacks policy. Hugh, take it away... Also see TreNECnyp's equally inane explanation of inverter technology and Oport's immediate reply: http://tiny.cc/x02xd {/mod note}

Tad managed to put into words what I've been trying to accomplish. That said, and not to contradict Tad, let's not turn the Amtrak forum into the NJT forum. Certainly some latitude is allowed, as Tad notes and as demonstrated above, and Tad has primary mod duties here and I trust his judgement. What I've always loved about this site, even pre-site admin duty, was the uniqueness of each forum's characters and personalities as definied by members and moderators. Do not construe this as a type of "moral relativism" as reviled by Pope Benedikt; as I've said in the past, my objective is not to sanitize railroad.net. It can't be all huggy-huggy joy-joy here, but we can carry it too far with personal attacks.

That said, House rules!

Now, let's stop talking about locomotive harmonic(a)s and get back on topic, please.

Just to add the HHP doesn't really have much bombardier to it other than the body and the two computers in the cab and cab setup. All of the traction motors, inverters transformers and AGATE control is Alstom components. From my experience there's too much french words in these manuals and on the components makes me think something was lost in translation.

The "Bombardier" we're talking about electric locomotive-wise, and traction-wise, had not yet acquired competitor Adtranz (nee ASEA and ABB) at the time the Acela and HHP purchases were made from the consortium of Bombardier and Alstom.

Adtranz and Siemens were the two "also-rans" in the competition for NE Corrider HST trainsets.

The above two sent their trains on tour, and I saw them both in Chicago Union Station.

The Canadian Export Development Bank, or whatever it's called, threw in some "loonies" and helped make the Bombardier/Alstom bid more competitive.

In any event, "le tortoise" (AKA "American Flyer") wound up winning the NEC HST race.

Understood. The point I'm trying to make is it looks like everyone is trying to blame bombardier for the issues with the hhp and acela meanwhile its got more alstom to it. I personally believe its both companies fault for the shortcomings of both hhp and acela locos. We can see that alstom can make a successfull product when left alone seeing how well the remans (Aem7 AC) turned out. We also can see how now with the resources of abb/adtranz bombardier can make a good product as also, the alp46. Previously all bombardier really dealt with was coaches and subway cars.

The issue was not Alstom or repairs but Bombardier and Amtraks percetion on how Bombardier handled it.
Amtrak soured on Bombardier and is now looking at other succesfull builders to see if they measure up.

But we didn't get a answer to the DC voltage on the Polish railway electrification. The two pantographs are necessary because, the lower the voltage, the higher the amperage drawn.
Basically, because DC cannot be stepped down with a transformer, you can't have those sky-high catenary voltages with DC. 3,000 volts, or 3,300 volts in the Russian system, has been about the limit for DC because the space between the wheels limits the size (and thus the thickness of the insulation) of traction motors. Of course, with modern AC motors and inverter technology, there may be room for higher DC catenary voltages if you can build inverters that will accept such high inputs. Traditionally, locomotives used with 3,000 volt DC have actually been wired up as two 1,500 locomotives in series, in the same carbody. This was true with the GE postwar "Little Joes" originally built for Russia and used by the Milwaukee Road. The CSS&SB purchased a few, and adapted them to run on its 1,500 vold system by changing the internal connection between the two "halves" from series to parallel, so that the voltage wasn't halved. But at 1,500 volts, those Little Joes really taxed the capacity of the South Shore's power system.

keyboardkat wrote:But we didn't get a answer to the DC voltage on the Polish railway electrification. The two pantographs are necessary because, the lower the voltage, the higher the amperage drawn.
Basically, because DC cannot be stepped down with a transformer, you can't have those sky-high catenary voltages with DC. 3,000 volts, or 3,300 volts in the Russian system, has been about the limit for DC because the space between the wheels limits the size (and thus the thickness of the insulation) of traction motors. Of course, with modern AC motors and inverter technology, there may be room for higher DC catenary voltages if you can build inverters that will accept such high inputs. Traditionally, locomotives used with 3,000 volt DC have actually been wired up as two 1,500 locomotives in series, in the same carbody. This was true with the GE postwar "Little Joes" originally built for Russia and used by the Milwaukee Road. The CSS&SB purchased a few, and adapted them to run on its 1,500 vold system by changing the internal connection between the two "halves" from series to parallel, so that the voltage wasn't halved. But at 1,500 volts, those Little Joes really taxed the capacity of the South Shore's power system.

Also, the advent of kilovolt-capable DC-to-DC converters may soon make it possible for traction railroads to use distribution voltages greater than 3 kV with DC motors. Traditional brushed DC motors and DC control systems are on their way out for railroads, but don't count out a comeback once the technology matures again.

One of the great advantages that the Siemens motors will give Amtrak is in parts availability. The HHP's have parts from about 50 different companies. There is actually a dispute between Bombardier and Alstom now that is preventing Amtrak from receiving ARU. Also, many of those companies no longer exist so Amtrak needs to outsource the part to another vendor that charges an arm and a leg. The Siemens motor will have a minimum of 70% of the motor as Siemens parts. This will allow Amtrak to get parts needed for repairs quicker, therefore increasing availability of motors for the NEC. Siemens is actually working with Amtrak in placing parts storerooms throughout the NEC based on where certain repairs can be made. At the moment parts are in locations where the work to replace it can't even be done. Unless it's a cracked windshield(and sometimes not even then), you better get it to DC.

We cant fix cracked windshields in Sunnyside! Send it to DC!

ApproachMedium wrote:We cant fix cracked windshields in Sunnyside! Send it to DC!

That does seem to be a problem. DC is the toilet bowl of repairs for the NEC.

Well hey we cant help that the PCBs and ESA both killed our real engine house we had. Good thing though is that old engine house was outside and quite outdated but this one we have now is a joke. For the amount of locomotives that come through sunnyside every night we should really have a two track house with full cranes, lifts and drop tables but that wont happen anytime soon.

Amtrakguy wrote:

ApproachMedium wrote:We cant fix cracked windshields in Sunnyside! Send it to DC!

That does seem to be a problem. DC is the toilet bowl of repairs for the NEC.

Huh? DC does much better work on its locomotives the NY or Boston can ever do, and this is coming from someone who runs the equipment daily.

I have to agree with budd. We can't do many repairs in sunnyside so we send stuff to DC. DC has some of the finest people on the corridor when it comes to mechanical repairs. They really know their stuff down there and are always willing to help us out up in NY when we need the help.

ESA had nothing to do with taking down the old engine house. Just everything else!