jtr1962 wrote:The only proposed extensions that I'm aware of are to the Javits Center and then possibly across the Hudson to New Jersey. That extension would undoubtably be underground.trains are much more fuel efficient.. we should push this as it will get the tree-huggers on the side of trains.. also, have you ever followed an old deisel bus in traffic?
I'm not aware of any plans to extend the 7 from Flushing although such an extension would certainly be welcome since it would mean fewer buses in Queens plus shorter commutes for many people.
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#7 Subway West Side Extension Hudson Yards Javits Center
- Discussion relating to the past and present operations of the NYC Subway, PATH, and Staten Island Railway (SIRT).
Moderator: GirlOnTheTrain
Agreed. Besides extending the 7, I could think of a long list of subway projects in Queens which are sorely needed, giving that northeastern Queens is largely underserved by the subway. Here's a short list:
1) Jewel Avenue spur running from Continental Ave/Forest Hills to the Bayside stop on the LIRR. In practice this line would most likely be an extension of the R train.
2) Extend the F from 179th Street to city limits.
3) Extend either the E from Archer Avenue or the A from Ozone Park to city limits.
4) Extend the N west along Ditmars Blvd to LaGuardia airport, thus covering more of northwestern Queens and connecting the airport in one shot.
5) The area between the 7 and L in southwestern Queens also seems underserved, but this would require either a whole new line or a spur from the 7 starting at Hunters Point. I'm not sure if the population density is there to justify it.
I bet all these projects in total would cost less that the SAS since you won't be building around as much existing infrastructure as in Manhattan. 1 and 2 plus the 7 extension would get rid of a lot of bus traffic.
1) Jewel Avenue spur running from Continental Ave/Forest Hills to the Bayside stop on the LIRR. In practice this line would most likely be an extension of the R train.
2) Extend the F from 179th Street to city limits.
3) Extend either the E from Archer Avenue or the A from Ozone Park to city limits.
4) Extend the N west along Ditmars Blvd to LaGuardia airport, thus covering more of northwestern Queens and connecting the airport in one shot.
5) The area between the 7 and L in southwestern Queens also seems underserved, but this would require either a whole new line or a spur from the 7 starting at Hunters Point. I'm not sure if the population density is there to justify it.
I bet all these projects in total would cost less that the SAS since you won't be building around as much existing infrastructure as in Manhattan. 1 and 2 plus the 7 extension would get rid of a lot of bus traffic.
Paul1705 wrote:The Convention Center extension is supposed to have one intermediate station at 41st Street and Tenth Avenue.Update:
According to the Daily News today (29 Sep 2006), the city/MTA is only going to build a shell at 41st St, not a complete station. They will only complete this station IF potential ridership warrents it. As you may guess, proponents of the 7-Line extension are not pleased.
In addition, the city is to sell bonds to finance this expansion. IF not enough financing via bonds occurs, then they will place this extension on the back-burner...
Bloomie is becoming more and more weasely in his old age...
say goodbye to the 42nd street lower level.. the original "7 killer".
jtr1962, can you expand on the NJ extension? i have never, EVER heard of that being an option. the cost for a new tunnel under the hudson would be enormous.
jtr1962, can you expand on the NJ extension? i have never, EVER heard of that being an option. the cost for a new tunnel under the hudson would be enormous.
devbeep2 wrote:say goodbye to the 42nd street lower level.. the original "7 killer".That was pipe dream talk a while back. Nothing too serious ever came of it. Taking NYCT across state lines opens up a can of worms that would stink to high heaven.
jtr1962, can you expand on the NJ extension? i have never, EVER heard of that being an option. the cost for a new tunnel under the hudson would be enormous.
jlr3266 wrote:And yet, people are still willing to put up websites supporting it:devbeep2 wrote:say goodbye to the 42nd street lower level.. the original "7 killer".That was pipe dream talk a while back. Nothing too serious ever came of it. Taking NYCT across state lines opens up a can of worms that would stink to high heaven.
jtr1962, can you expand on the NJ extension? i have never, EVER heard of that being an option. the cost for a new tunnel under the hudson would be enormous.
http://subwaytosecaucus.com/
Anyway, the first time I remember reading about this NJ extension had to be in the mid-1980s, when some governing body came up with the utterly disasterous plan to contract the subway system under the guise of 'speeding up' service - exactly how it was sold in the papers - speed up service by closing stations - Well, OK, except these stations were to be closed because signficant segments of many routes (mostly elevated, in the outer boros) were to be closed; I believe the criteria was, if the line wasn't jammed packed during rush hour, close segments until you arrive at the station where the line becomes jam-packed). In addition a handful of pie-in-the-sky extensions, most notably the 7 to Jersey, were mentioned, but everyone realized that was just a joke.
This plan, which pretty quickly crashed and burned (leaving a bad taste in everyone's mouth), was fairly well publized at the time, but I haven't been able to turn up a on-line copy (well, I didn't look that hard).
Actually:
I'm surprised no one has thought of it, but if they could somehow convince the city of not converting the old High Line (West Side Elevated) into an urban trail of some sort, that would make sense to be used as part of a 7-line extention past the Javits Center that could run at least to 14th street and 10th avenue if it could be connected to the line that is currently being proposed underground (with if it could be worked somehow perhaps an intermediate stop at 23rd street west of 10th avenue) and then somewhere after 14th street going downtown back underground, if possible connecting with the 7th avenue line somewhere before Chambers street and continuing to South Ferry or even into Brooklyn.
Any thoughts on that, and whether it could even be possible to somehow do? If it could, it could help give west side riders some relief going downtown.
At the same time, has there also been thought of beyond 10th avenue perhaps if at all possible having an uptown extension of the 7 train going perhaps up 10th Avenue to Lincoln Center and terminating there or at 72nd and Broadway (next to or under the Broadway-7th avenue line)? That might be a stretch, but again something that could perhaps be explored.
ETA: I didn't see the post above about scrapping a 10th avenue-42nd street station when I wrote what I did.
I'm surprised no one has thought of it, but if they could somehow convince the city of not converting the old High Line (West Side Elevated) into an urban trail of some sort, that would make sense to be used as part of a 7-line extention past the Javits Center that could run at least to 14th street and 10th avenue if it could be connected to the line that is currently being proposed underground (with if it could be worked somehow perhaps an intermediate stop at 23rd street west of 10th avenue) and then somewhere after 14th street going downtown back underground, if possible connecting with the 7th avenue line somewhere before Chambers street and continuing to South Ferry or even into Brooklyn.
Any thoughts on that, and whether it could even be possible to somehow do? If it could, it could help give west side riders some relief going downtown.
At the same time, has there also been thought of beyond 10th avenue perhaps if at all possible having an uptown extension of the 7 train going perhaps up 10th Avenue to Lincoln Center and terminating there or at 72nd and Broadway (next to or under the Broadway-7th avenue line)? That might be a stretch, but again something that could perhaps be explored.
ETA: I didn't see the post above about scrapping a 10th avenue-42nd street station when I wrote what I did.
Wallyhorse wrote:I'm surprised no one has thought of it, but if they could somehow convince the city of not converting the old High Line (West Side Elevated) into an urban trail of some sort, that would make sense to be used as part of a 7-line extention past the Javits Center that could run at least to 14th street and 10th avenue if it could be connected to the line that is currently being proposed underground (with if it could be worked somehow perhaps an intermediate stop at 23rd street west of 10th avenue) and then somewhere after 14th street going downtown back underground, if possible connecting with the 7th avenue line somewhere before Chambers street and continuing to South Ferry or even into Brooklyn.Oh ba-be, has that idea been discussed over the past two years, on this message board, SubChat, and a host of other rail-based boards.
Tell the truth, I believe the preferred Idea was instead of the 7 line south, routing the 14th line (L) from 14th street a few blocks to a ramp to the High Line, then use that to get to Javits (with some rerouting of the north part of the Highline for a 10th Ave terminal at Javits).
Since construction on the linear park began awhile ago, I believe we can safely dismiss this concept.
Pictures of the constructions:
http://www.thehighline.org/gallery/construction?page=1
I think the most urgent Queens extension is definately to NE Queens. Send the 7 along the Whitestone Expressway and Cross Island Parkway to Bay Terrace. The first segment could be to Whitestone, then do Bay Terrace later.
After that would be Archer to Laurelton, as LIRR service along that stretch isn't the greatest.
Then after that, Hillside Av line atleast to the Queens Village bus terminal/supermarket at Springfield
If necesary, another Archer extension along the main line to atleast Queens Village.
As for the 7 in Manhattan, send it downtown after the Javits. Hey, it's not going anywhere else(Jersey aint happening. That's what PATH is for).
After that would be Archer to Laurelton, as LIRR service along that stretch isn't the greatest.
Then after that, Hillside Av line atleast to the Queens Village bus terminal/supermarket at Springfield
If necesary, another Archer extension along the main line to atleast Queens Village.
As for the 7 in Manhattan, send it downtown after the Javits. Hey, it's not going anywhere else(Jersey aint happening. That's what PATH is for).
Those are all definitely needed:
If you're going to extend to Queens Village, pehaps such an extension could go even further and go all the way (if possible) to Belmont Park. That could be done by perhaps having the Archer Avenue branch of the "E" and "J" (or one of the two) continue along Jamaica avenue to the Queens Village LIRR station, then across (I think) Francis Lewis Blvd. to Hempstead Avenue, ending as close to Belmont Park as possible if not even perhaps extending if possible a little bit into Nassau County.
If you're going to extend to Queens Village, pehaps such an extension could go even further and go all the way (if possible) to Belmont Park. That could be done by perhaps having the Archer Avenue branch of the "E" and "J" (or one of the two) continue along Jamaica avenue to the Queens Village LIRR station, then across (I think) Francis Lewis Blvd. to Hempstead Avenue, ending as close to Belmont Park as possible if not even perhaps extending if possible a little bit into Nassau County.
Running into Nassau is not going to happen, not even for 10 feet. I say split the Archer. Run one service along the main line/Jamaica Av to either Belmont or Floral Park(Belmont might not happen b/c I think it is in Nassau), and the other to Laurelton
NIMBYKiller:
Belmont Park is literally the border between Queens and Nassau County. The Grandstand of Belmont is in Queens, the clubhouse is in Nassau County, or at least that's what I've always been told.
Being able to extend the Jamaica Line to Belmont Park would be huge, as that would help make Belmont Park being able to be used as a park-and-ride facility for both the Subway and LIRR (which has a grossly underused station at Belmont that could handle a lot of people and IIRC did during the strike late last year) for those coming from Nassau/Suffolk counties.
Belmont Park is literally the border between Queens and Nassau County. The Grandstand of Belmont is in Queens, the clubhouse is in Nassau County, or at least that's what I've always been told.
Being able to extend the Jamaica Line to Belmont Park would be huge, as that would help make Belmont Park being able to be used as a park-and-ride facility for both the Subway and LIRR (which has a grossly underused station at Belmont that could handle a lot of people and IIRC did during the strike late last year) for those coming from Nassau/Suffolk counties.
Belmont can't be used as a park and ride during the morning rush because westbound trains have to cross over the main line, fouling the entire line. Eastbound is a little easier to implement b/c the trains are already on the southernmost track.
I just saw NBC 4 at 11PM Tonight and there was an announcement that the 7 Line Extension is going to happen now and it will take about 5 yrs to extend it to a newly expanded/remodeled Javits Center. Anyone else see the report on NBC 4?
Too bad that NYP will not be served. Will the PA Bus Terminal have a station as well? The place is also scheduled to undergo a renovation that will modernize it and add an office tower (don't know how many stories) The work for the PA Bus Terminal is supposed to be completed around 2012. What other stations will be built/served by an expanded 7 Line?
Too bad that NYP will not be served. Will the PA Bus Terminal have a station as well? The place is also scheduled to undergo a renovation that will modernize it and add an office tower (don't know how many stories) The work for the PA Bus Terminal is supposed to be completed around 2012. What other stations will be built/served by an expanded 7 Line?
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