Sandusky OH to Hackettstown NJ

ns3010 wrote:This is true. But how much time do they need between LH to Hackettstown? Unless I'm forgetting something, all there is between there is M&M Mars.

As for the double track issue, I was talking about for the entire length. Through Netcong and Hackettstown are impossible, although there are a few places west of Mount Olive that would be great for a passing siding.

And as you said, the long blocks. Again, unless I'm forgetting places (I rarely ride to Hackettstown, and actually on NJT at all...), the blocks are between MORRIS JCT. and ROXBURY, ROXBURY and Love Lane (I don't think it has a name?), Love Lane and OLIVE, and OLIVE and COOK. So on that entire section of double track, that's what, 4 blocks? Like you said, not a lot...

Seven blocks.

njmidland wrote:Sadly, the main reason service to Hackettstown is limited is because there just isn't enough demand. It is a long ride to just about anywhere. I do use it on occasion, but I can drive to Netcong and still not hit a lot of traffic, still have free parking and have more options for train frequencies.

When Andover opens I suspect it will cut Hackettstown ridership in half.

Hackettstown demand is rising. Last year, when that extra morning train (1024 at 10:20) was added, it was pretty empty the first couple of times I used it. The last time I used it (6 weeks ago) the train left Hackettstown with 15 passengers. The ride itself is no longer than the one from Bay Head or Port Jervis, or the Upper Harlem line. Not only should service be increased, it should be extended to Washington.

As for Andover service, I suspect they will simply take all the trains which end/originate at Lake Hopatcong and extend them to Andover. Most Boonton diesels terminate at Dover westbound, these can simply be extended west thru to Andover.

ns3010 wrote:This is true. But how much time do they need between LH to Hackettstown? Unless I'm forgetting something, all there is between there is M&M Mars.

Travel time is about 22-25 minutes (depending on how long the train stops at the employee stop in Port Morris). It is impossible for more than one train to operate between this this point and Hackettstown as there are no sidings anywhere. I don't think anyone is asking for a service level with which this would become an issue.

There is room for a siding (and the remains of one) immediately west of Hackettstown.

blockline4180 wrote:I'm pretty sure NS no longer serves M&M Mars.. I hsven't seen the green boxcars in a long time.

Thought I saw one back in the summer, but maybe not... IDK...

NYS&W142Fan wrote:s far as double track, at one time the whole line from LH to Washington was double tracked until the Cutoff was built. It was then reduced to single track. Most if not all the RofW is wide enough to allow for double track, but why would they want to do that with a line that has limited Freight Service and limited commuter service.

Like you said, it would be an unnecessary waste of money.
Also, the space where the second track used to be is now an access road, and that would be lost with the addition of the second track.

jimzim66 wrote:Seven blocks

Thanks. That's why I'm not the one who works for NJT

Port Jervis wrote:The ride itself is no longer than the one from Bay Head or Port Jervis, or the Upper Harlem line. Not only should service be increased, it should be extended to Washington.

When I took 854 back in the summer (from MO), I believe it arrived in Hoboken in just under two hours (too lazy to go look it up now), and same with the 2300 trains
If service were to be extended to Washington, it would require the purchase from NS, as well as substantial track upgrades. The track isn't in the greatest condition, and the crossings do not have full protection.

Port Jervis wrote:Travel time is about 22-25 minutes (depending on how long the train stops at the employee stop in Port Morris). It is impossible for more than one train to operate between this this point and Hackettstown as there are no sidings anywhere. I don't think anyone is asking for a service level with which this would become an issue.

There is room for a siding (and the remains of one) immediately west of Hackettstown.

I am aware, as I have ridden over this stretch of track numerous times.
I was talking about H-02. I don't know if their trip may or may not take any longer than it takes NJT.
Yes, but a passing siding west of Hackettstown would do absolutely no good, because it would not allow any trains to pass. Unless NJT were to change ends there, which would allow H-02 to pass them.
We were talking about possible locations for passing sidings east of there.

The remains of the Siding in Hackettstown was once a passing Siding. Then about 15-20 years ago they pulled the switch on the West end and used it as a siding for Plastic company who received hoppers of pellets. As for the Station, there is enough room to put in a passing siding until you get to the buildings and fence from Tickners, there I don't think there is room. I also heard something about possibly moving the Station back to where it once was, the lot where Hackettstown Ford was. I guess they are looking for additional parking capacity. As a kid I remember several sidings in Hackettstown on both sides of the track. The section where Tickners now sits there was a Freight house, a second Spur, the siding that served the old building at Tickners and also went across Rt46 to Bergan Tool and one that went behind Tickners to serve the Lumber Company there. So at one time it was a busy place.

NYS&W142Fan wrote:The remains of the Siding in Hackettstown was once a passing Siding. Then about 15-20 years ago they pulled the switch on the West end and used it as a siding for Plastic company who received hoppers of pellets. As for the Station, there is enough room to put in a passing siding until you get to the buildings and fence from Tickners, there I don't think there is room. I also heard something about possibly moving the Station back to where it once was, the lot where Hackettstown Ford was. I guess they are looking for additional parking capacity. As a kid I remember several sidings in Hackettstown on both sides of the track. The section where Tickners now sits there was a Freight house, a second Spur, the siding that served the old building at Tickners and also went across Rt46 to Bergan Tool and one that went behind Tickners to serve the Lumber Company there. So at one time it was a busy place.

That's a good idea, the station is really on the outskirts of H-town. Good for parking, bad for pedestrians.

The Hackettstown station was built all new in 1994 when service was extended from Netcong. The old station was toward downtown just south of Main Street, now the site of Hackettstown Ford's lot. It was demolished in the mid 1960s.

Port Jervis wrote:
That's a good idea, the station is really on the outskirts of H-town. Good for parking, bad for pedestrians.

It's not THAT FAR from the outskirts of town. You can still walk there and get some exercise.

It's actually much closer to Centenary College and have seen some students use the station of late.

blockline4180 wrote:

Port Jervis wrote:
That's a good idea, the station is really on the outskirts of H-town. Good for parking, bad for pedestrians.

It's not THAT FAR from the outskirts of town. You can still walk there and get some exercise.

It's actually much closer to Centenary College and have seen some students use the station of late.

True, but it sucks to be on the train as it meanders through H-town, right past your destination, only for you to have to walk back. There have been times where I've wanted to say "Stop and let me out right here!".

Port Jervis wrote: True, but it sucks to be on the train as it meanders through H-town, right past your destination, only for you to have to walk back. There have been times where I've wanted to say "Stop and let me out right here!".

Me thinks you doth complaineth too much. From maps, the distance from the old station (just north of Madison St) to the current shelter is about 700 ft.

The length of the Princeton Junction platform alone (and others on the NEC), is over 1000 ft, with some trains being that long.

JS

On a side note, you could take PATH from 33rd st near NYP to hoboken terminal, or get off at newark penn, take the broad st connector (light rail) to newark broad & take a train from there... Might save you some bucks & let you see the sights a bit.

- A

Amtrak: $181.00
NJ Transit: $11.75

I doubt it would save that much and with or without luggage would certainly be much more hassle. Fare from Hoboken is $8.75 plus the PATH $1.75. Total $10.50.

Fare from NWK North Broad is $7.25 plus the PATH $1.75 (which requires a change at Journal Square), plus NJT light rail $1.35. Total $10.35.

Not worth it to save between $1.25 and $1.40.

Also if you can get someone to pick you up, just consider using Dover (end of the electric service from NYC). Its less than 20 miles from Hackettstown and has much more frequent service.

R36 Combine Coach wrote:Too bad the Cutoff hasn't been reopened and no LD Amtrak service is running on it

How would that help matters? The Cutoff route does not go through Hackettstown; that's the DL&W's Old Road. Amtrak wouldn't stop at Hackettstown if service to NEPA were to go via the Old Road (which basically doesn't exist anymore west of Washington and east of Manuka Chunk), and assuming any Amtrak service out that direction.

njmidland wrote:Sadly, the main reason service to Hackettstown is limited is because there just isn't enough demand. It is a long ride to just about anywhere. I do use it on occasion, but I can drive to Netcong and still not hit a lot of traffic, still have free parking and have more options for train frequencies.

When Andover opens I suspect it will cut Hackettstown ridership in half.

WADR, you seem to contradict yourself. If demand out of Hackettstown is depressed, that's induced due to bad service (infrequent, and slow average speed due to too many stops); you acknowledged this by mentioning the greater frequency at Netcong. And how would service to Andover affect Hackettstown in any way?

PullmanCo wrote:WADR, you seem to contradict yourself. If demand out of Hackettstown is depressed, that's induced due to bad service (infrequent, and slow average speed due to too many stops); you acknowledged this by mentioning the greater frequency at Netcong. And how would service to Andover affect Hackettstown in any way?

From what I see, a number of the people that do get on a Hackettstown come from places like Allamuchy, Tranquility, and Hope. For a lot of these people Andover will be a shorter drive and I suspect the running time between Andover and say Lake Hopatcong will be shorter than Hackettstown to Andover.

njmidland wrote:
From what I see, a number of the people that do get on a Hackettstown come from places like Allamuchy, Tranquility, and Hope. For a lot of these people Andover will be a shorter drive and I suspect the running time between Andover and say Lake Hopatcong will be shorter than Hackettstown to Andover.

Well, I live in Washington and whenever I take the train I will still use Hackettstown and not Andover when it opens.