Amtrak service to Suburban Station

The much bigger idea in the article is through routing...the station name is small potatoes. Provided were talking about the biz journal article

Penn Center just brings back images of 1976 Philadelphia with its vast swarths of concrete plazas... which we're trying to get away from (Dilworth Park opens Sept 4).

Clearfield wrote:

ExCon90 wrote:And yes, the free transfer still exists, and I think SEPTA is still trying to figure out how to integrate it into NPT.

Per SEPTA's approved tariff, the free transfer exists only as long as there is a separate agreement in force between SEPTA and Amtrak.

If that agreement expires or is terminated by either side, SEPTA won't need to worry about how to integrate it into NPT.

SEPTA certainly needs to worry about how to get Amtrak customers past the fare gates. Has this problem ever been posed at the NPT sessions? If Amtrak loses the link, I'd think they'd push back on other access points (or shared rail terms) such that it would not be worthwhile for SEPTA to break their agreement.

Launcher wrote:SEPTA certainly needs to worry about how to get Amtrak customers past the fare gates. Has this problem ever been posed at the NPT sessions? If Amtrak loses the link, I'd think they'd push back on other access points (or shared rail terms) such that it would not be worthwhile for SEPTA to break their agreement.

Had SEPTA included optical scanning as a payment option (they were banking on NFC chips in all cell phones by the time NPT rolled out, and iPhones still don't have them), SEPTA faregates and conductors could scan the AMTRAK ticket barcode or QR code and link to AMTRAK's reservation system to validate the code and generate a payment (AMTRAK to SEPTA) voucher.

How do trains get from upper level 30th St. to NEC towards NYC? I don't recall a connection into Zoo in that direction, only towards Paoli/Harrisburg.

Jon

Probably the same way SEPTA's Trenton line gets there?

Clearfield wrote:

Launcher wrote:SEPTA certainly needs to worry about how to get Amtrak customers past the fare gates. Has this problem ever been posed at the NPT sessions? If Amtrak loses the link, I'd think they'd push back on other access points (or shared rail terms) such that it would not be worthwhile for SEPTA to break their agreement.

Had SEPTA included optical scanning as a payment option (they were banking on NFC chips in all cell phones by the time NPT rolled out, and iPhones still don't have them), SEPTA faregates and conductors could scan the AMTRAK ticket barcode or QR code and link to AMTRAK's reservation system to validate the code and generate a payment (AMTRAK to SEPTA) voucher.

Does amtrak pay for such transfers now or is it a blanket monthly fee or is it quid pro quo part of being a partnership on the shared and mostly Amtrak-maintained infrastructure?

Launcher wrote:Does amtrak pay for such transfers now or is it a blanket monthly fee or is it quid pro quo part of being a partnership on the shared and mostly Amtrak-maintained infrastructure?

There is a separate contract between AMTRAK and SEPTA to cover this,

jonnhrr wrote:How do trains get from upper level 30th St. to NEC towards NYC? I don't recall a connection into Zoo in that direction, only towards Paoli/Harrisburg.

Jon

Trains from 30th St. UL to Paoli normally leave from Track 4, with Track 3, to its left, used by trains for North Philadelphia and east. To the left of that is Powelton Ave. Coach Yard, then Tracks 2 and 1. Beyond the end of Powelton Ave. yard, Tracks 3 and 2 come together and descend below the level of Track 4 and curve to the right underneath Track 4, which veers left overhead toward Overbrook. On Saturdays and Sundays there are hourly simultaneous departures at xx:49 from 30th St. for Trenton (on 3) and Malvern or Thorndale (on 4). In theory, if both trains leave at the same moment, there should be a neck-and-neck movement of both trains until the Trenton ducks down and runs underneath the Malvern train overhead. Don't know how often it happens that precisely in real life.

Hilarious fantasy piece by "Transit Expert" Bob Previdi. Where exactly does this assertion that the CCCT is 40% underutilized originate? Not during rush hour, Bubba. The lunatic idea of even "two to four" long, slow, lumbering Amtrak sets slowly meandering through six or seven poorly-dispatched Septa interlockings during peak hour service is unrealistic, and possibly insane. Where they gonna turn at... Vine?

There already exists ample train service between Market East/Suburban and 30th St. If they want to promote Amtrak access to Center City, why not utilize & promote the existing Septa train service & improve ease-of-transfer at 30th St? For example: Fast, modern elevators, escalators that function, & comprehensible signage.

I would probably say that 30th to Suburban is underutilized; certainly one 6 track station and an 8 track station with 1 mile of 4 tracks in between could accommodate more trains (and has) if those trains terminate/originate at a stub track at Suburban. Suburban is absolutely underutilized and it kind of has to be unless you want to terminate SEPTA services there, which I wouldn't want; I even think Cynwyd should return to through-to-Roberts Yard service. Certain Amtrak services terminating and originating there makes sense if it isn't through-Philadelphia service; the Clockers would have been ideal for such. NJT Atlantic City Service probably makes the most sense.

It could help to offset payments a bit to Amtrak for trackage rights. I certainly wouldn't want them coming into Market East though.

Clearfield wrote:

Launcher wrote:Does amtrak pay for such transfers now or is it a blanket monthly fee or is it quid pro quo part of being a partnership on the shared and mostly Amtrak-maintained infrastructure?

There is a separate contract between AMTRAK and SEPTA to cover this,

septa is the only one interested in ending the agreement

SCB2525 wrote:NJT Atlantic City Service probably makes the most sense.

Diesels can't run in the tunnel.

Buy more ALP-45DPs.

I would be interested as to what AC service running into Suburban and even Market East would do to that line's ridership.

SCB2525 wrote:Buy more ALP-45DPs.

I would be interested as to what AC service running into Suburban and even Market East would do to that line's ridership.

SCB: Remember ALP45DP's cost $9 million dollars each and to use them on AC trains only accessing Suburban Station using 11KV AC
or maybe Market East and Temple U to change ends at Roberts Yard would be ludicrous to NJT...The former RDG trunk line is busy
enough between Market East and RY just handling SEPTA RRD trains and you would have the power draw problem N of the phase gap
near Temple U that has limits on locomotive use - one of the main reasons few push-pull trains are used on the RDG side...

With that note a ALP45DP - hauled train would have to use the catenary in the tunnel and then switch back on or off the catenary
before the phase gap is reached going N or right after passing the PG going S towards ME...If there are problems switching between
power modes a move like this could cause more problems then they are worth...AC trains should stay serving 30th Street Lower...

MACTRAXX