Amtrak Downeaster Discussion Thread

[charlesriverbranch]

Why does Amtrak want to reduce the number of seats on the trains? That strikes me as extremely counterproductive. These trains are popular and often sell out.

[MEC407]

According to someone I know who is a reliable and credible source, the Amtrak employees who operate the Downeaster are disappointed that NNEPRA chose not to accept Amtrak's offer of sending Horizon cars up here.

The primary reason for their disappointment, according to my source, is that the Amfleet cars are increasingly unreliable. They cited various problems and malfunctions, such as doors that won't open and roofs that leak whenever it rains.

Here's what I don't understand: if the Amfleets are that problematic, why would Amtrak want them for the Northeast Corridor? Or to put it another way: if the Horizons are so much more reliable than the Amfleets, wouldn't it make more sense to send the Horizons to the Northeast Corridor?

My source says that Amfleet problems are increasingly responsible for Downeaster delays. If that's the case, why in the world would Amtrak want to use those same cars on a high-intensity corridor where delays are much less tolerable?

[Gilbert B Norman]

Mr. Maine Central, how many hands qualified on Horizons has Amtrak at their Boston maintenance facility?

How much inventory of parts for Horizons have they there? Flying in qualified Electricians and Machinists hand carrying the needed parts from I'd dare say Chicago gets rather costly - and fast!

[NH2060]

Here's what I don't understand: if the Amfleets are that problematic, why would Amtrak want them for the Northeast Corridor? Or to put it another way: if the Horizons are so much more reliable than the Amfleets, wouldn't it make more sense to send the Horizons to the Northeast Corridor?

My source says that Amfleet problems are increasingly responsible for Downeaster delays. If that's the case, why in the world would Amtrak want to use those same cars on a high-intensity corridor where delays are much less tolerable?

Well there are already hundreds of Amfleets in use on the NEC - so there’s fleet and parts commonality- and they *have* to be used until the Airo trainsets arrive in 2026-2027 so any issues with the NEC cars would have to be addressed head-on anyway. So if the Downeaster cars were to be transferred to the NEC they would have to be repaired at some point. I suspect these particular cars (or enough of them) perhaps have not been able to make the trip to Southampton Yard yet (?).

I have to wonder if NNEPRA rejected the Horizons simply because they feared the cars might deter Downeaster riders thinking they would be riding in an MBTA style commuter train vs. a proper intercity train that the traveling public is used to riding. It wouldn’t make sense at all to us here, but it is a theory nonetheless.

Mr. Maine Central, how many hands qualified on Horizons has Amtrak at their Boston maintenance facility?

How much inventory of parts for Horizons have they there? Flying in qualified Electricians and Machinists hand carrying the needed parts from I'd dare say Chicago gets rather costly - and fast!

I would think any transfer of a significant number of Horizon cars would involved training the shop crews in South Boston and transferring the needed parts from the Chicago shops. The same would likely need to be done at the New Orleans facility for the upcoming “Gulf Coast corridor” train service to Mobile if Horizons are going to be used on those trains.

[Gilbert B Norman]

I would think any transfer of a significant number of Horizon cars would involved training the shop crews in South Boston and transferring the needed parts from the Chicago shops. The same would likely need to be done at the New Orleans facility for the upcoming “Gulf Coast corridor” train service to Mobile if Horizons are going to be used on those trains.

You do have a point, Mr. 2060. If Horizons were to be permanently assigned to Boston for use on the Downeaster, there would need be training for the existing shop forces there and parts inventoried. The training of course would be a one time expense.

Hopefully, now that Amtrak has the loot from IIJA21, and they surely recognize privately that Amfleets will be around for well another 15 years (really, anybody believe the propagandists' 2028 date?), get them patched up for at least these regional agencies paying for the service.

Now regarding the Mobile service, has it been finalized that Horizons will be assigned to that service rather than Superliners, with which their small NO facility has trained forces and a small pool of "protects"?

[west point]

Please excuse my ignorance. Are not the Downeaster trains mainly maintained at Brunswick instead of south Boston? Thought that locos are rotated thru to Albany for 90 day inspections. Amfleet cars sent to Wilmington or Bear for major work? Horizons major work to Beech? Longer in time, costs, & distance for Beech. If Horizons regular maintained at Brunswick then parts necessary will go there? Spreading out Horizons for maintenance does not make sense.

[CNJGeep]

Horizon cars have manual doors and are effectively useless for the Regionals, which need all door train line function to handle the huge passenger volume.

[charlesriverbranch]

Horizon cars look superficially similar to some of the cars the MBTA runs. What are the differences?

[markhb]

Please excuse my ignorance. Are not the Downeaster trains mainly maintained at Brunswick instead of south Boston? Thought that locos are rotated thru to Albany for 90 day inspections. Amfleet cars sent to Wilmington or Bear for major work? Horizons major work to Beech? Longer in time, costs, & distance for Beech. If Horizons regular maintained at Brunswick then parts necessary will go there? Spreading out Horizons for maintenance does not make sense.

I believe Brunswick can do SOME things (ISTR they had a wheel-truing machine), and the nightly recovery ops are performed there, but I think larger servicing is still performed at Southamption St. It's a layover facility, not a maintenance yard.

[electricron]

I believe Brunswick can do SOME things (ISTR they had a wheel-truing machine), and the nightly recovery ops are performed there, but I think larger servicing is still performed at Southamption St. It's a layover facility, not a maintenance yard.

I believe and I think does not mean you know for sure.
Whatever rolling stock Amtrak decides to run on the Downeaster trains, I'm pretty sure Amtrak has the means and capabilities to make it happen. They have been running Horizon cars in the Midwest, but they have also been running them in the Pacific Northwest for Cascade services. They, if not still doing so, have been running Horizon cars for Surfliner services in southern California as well.
So running Horizon cars in multiple places Amtrak has proven capability.

[Gilbert B Norman]

ANOTHER Grade X-ing incident this past Saturday; Andover MA

Never mind the driver's IQ; at least she is OK.

Same cannot be said of her "Bimmerute":

https://whdh.com/news/watch-video-shows ... n-andover/

[CSRR573]

Us at Southampton do ALL the work on the equipment used on the DE. Amfleets are regularly cycled in and out of service on the NEC and 448/449. They make those moves once sometimes twice a week. Brunswick does very small running repairs to the equipment, not sure about the wheel truing machine because it seems we cut EVERYTHING that comes down from Maine. We take care of most big things at SHSY. 90 days are sent to Albany for P42s but the cabbages stay with us unless major structural work is needed(90213 hit a tree last winter and went to Albany for that reapir, All Bondo'ed btw). As for parts, we barely stock much stuff as it is, most gets overnighted to us. And for training for Horizons, we have all the workshop manuals for them and Carmen new-hires do receive very basic training on them during their probation period. As for delays, its been my experience that its the P42s that cause most delays not the Amfleets, I often get calls to North Station to fix a P42 issue.

[sicariis]

Maine's passenger rail authority is proposing to increase Downeaster fares for the first time since 2019. Executive Director Patricia Quinn says the increases are necessary to keep up with inflation which, she says, "has gone gangbusters" in the last 4 years.

Under the proposal, individual tickets might go up as much as $6, while multiride passes will increase by $10, but the proposal would also bring the concept of "dynamic pricing," to Downeaster tickets. Quinn says the most popular trains might see fares increase by $6, but less popular runs might even see fares go down.

https://www.mainepublic.org/business-an ... ual-ticket

[MEC407]

...the proposal would also bring the concept of "dynamic pricing," to Downeaster tickets.

I thought "dynamic pricing" had already been introduced to the Downeaster a few years ago. I remember that the prices for the most popular trains went up, and the prices for the least popular trains went down. However, I just checked the Amtrak web site and looked up Downeaster prices for a few random dates, and the prices are the same at all times of day. Does this mean that they stopped using dynamic pricing at some point, but are planning to bring it back? And if so, why did they stop using it?

[daybeers]

Increasing by $6 is wild!

The Downeaster is one of the only routes to have fixed pricing, which IMO gives it a huge advantage in flexibility. Buy your ticket one minute or eleven months before departure, doesn't matter.