Cascades 501 Wreck 18 December 17

[deathtopumpkins]

In regards to the 30 MPH restricted speed sign, maybe that was for freight? I know with LIRR that MAS is 60 for pax and 40 for freight...but 81 vs. 30 seems high.

KING-5, one of the local networks, showed a shot of the restricted speed signs before the curve. I didn't get a screenshot, but it was very clearly two signs: "T-30" and "P-30". However, MAS was 79 before this curve.

I'm not sure any freight even runs on this line at all.

I must say I was never a fan of the bypass to begin with, it was going to save a whopping 10 minutes but take away some great scenery that it passes (including chambers bay) which I felt negated the 10 minutes extra.

The bypass wasn't just about saving 10 minutes. It was also about getting trains off a stretch of track that was prone to landslides, and away from a congested BNSF freight route. As far as I'm aware the bypass is exclusively for Amtrak and Sound Transit. Thus the Cascades trains should be significantly more reliable and less prone to disruption on the new route. It's also worth noting that the majority of passengers are not riding for the scenery.

[Rockingham Racer]

You left out the single track tunnel at Nelson-Bennet, the major cause of delays and congestion on the Seattle Sub.

[dowlingm]

I must say I was never a fan of the bypass to begin with, it was going to save a whopping 10 minutes but take away some great scenery that it passes (including chambers bay) which I felt negated the 10 minutes extra. With that being said, what a horrible way to continue using the old route. I don't think it was going over the speed limit and if they are getting technical about 81 vs 79 that wouldn't have made a difference. Glad the engineer is alright from the sounds of the dispatch comms he sounded just fine.

That was the conductor, he said he hadn't found his engineer (at 0:53) http://komonews.com/news/local/emergenc ... trak-train" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[dowlingm]

https://twitter.com/NinaHarrelsonTV/sta ... 6648711168

For an interesting sidelight, scroll down on the link to the report that Antifa claims to have sabotaged "train tracks" in Washington; the accompanying photo shows electrified narrow-gauge trackage--therefore not only not in Washington but not in North America.

Yeah I can't believe @teapartytrumper posted something by @farleftwatch and it was not on the up and up

[ExCon90]

In regards to the 30 MPH restricted speed sign, maybe that was for freight?

From what I've observed when out there, the "T" governs Talgos and the "P" governs passenger trains other than Talgo.

[EuroStar]

The media outlets are almost unwatchable with their coverage. Hearing from some sources that the speed over the bridge was 30 mph, after a 79 mph straightaway, initial reports are train was doing 81 mph.

The reports appear to be quoting speed from GPS tracker. 2 mph difference is certainly within the margin of error for typical tracking applications.

That's a fairly gentle curve, but it's still a curve.

That actually is a serious S-shaped curve. Just eyeballing it, the radius of the first turn is definitely less than 1,000 ft, probably closer to 500 ft. The radius of the second turn going south appears to be somewhat larger. I wonder if there was any cant deficiency present on the track.

[scoostraw]

In regards to the 30 MPH restricted speed sign, maybe that was for freight?

I don't think so. The photo I saw shows two signs "T30" and "P30". Just a guess, but is T "Talgo" and P "Passenger"(?)

Perhaps someone familiar with the territory can weigh in.

Photo: https://mobile.twitter.com/DerechoDrago ... 1050370048" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Matt Johnson]

Yes, P indicates conventional passenger, and T indicates Talgo. I understand that this bypass route doesn't host freight traffic.

[Ken W2KB]

The media outlets are almost unwatchable with their coverage. Hearing from some sources that the speed over the bridge was 30 mph, after a 79 mph straightaway, initial reports are train was doing 81 mph.

The speed reports are from data from Amtrak's publicly available train tracker app. I believe that these data are not continuous, but rather updated once every several minutes so it is possible that the reading was taken and the speed reduced as required before entering the track section. Need to wait for NTSB analysis of the locomotive event recorder before speculating.

[John_Perkowski]

ADMIN NOTE:

Comments about antifa will be swiftly deleted.

[Ken W2KB]

Audio clip linked on AP newswire of conductor radioing dispatcher to report the derailment: https://youtu.be/PJhHOvhBFJg

[RenegadeMonster]

Wow

Here is a really ominous article from just a couple weeks ago fearing this exact time of things with high speed trans on the new bypass.

http://komonews.com/news/local/lakewood ... in-service" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[litz]

The mayor of Lakewood was concerned about collisions at grade crossings in his town ... not a train diving off a bridge onto an interstate highway.

Regarding some of the pictures ... the lead Charger looks like it took on something (like a tree) that cleaved the entire roof, nose to tail, clean off the carbody. It's an absolute miracle that engineer survived.

Also fairly astonishing is the condition of the track behind the trailing locomotive back to the presumed point of derailment halfway through the curve (around where that concrete retaining wall ends).

It almost seems like the Charger jumped off, dragged the rest of the front of the train with it, the middle piled up, and the rear just coasted to a stop. That trailing locomotive reportedly never derailed.

[litz]

Overhead footage from KGW, shows pretty much all the approach, and the piled up equipment, with some good closeups.

http://www.kgw.com/news/amtrak-cascades ... /500305839

Something that's interesting is how far up the track from the crash site the investigators are marking "things of interest" on the ground.

Also looks like they destroyed a signal bridge partway through the curve.

[CPSmith]

The media outlets are almost unwatchable with their coverage. Hearing from some sources that the speed over the bridge was 30 mph, after a 79 mph straightaway, initial reports are train was doing 81 mph.

The speed reports are from data from Amtrak's publicly available train tracker app. I believe that these data are not continuous, but rather updated once every several minutes so it is possible that the reading was taken and the speed reduced as required before entering the track section. Need to wait for NTSB analysis of the locomotive event recorder before speculating.

Ken is correct. Speeds from the Amtrak site are culled from GPS, so 1) they are not used for speed enforcement; 2) they are not entirely accurate; and 3) (most importantly) they are not real time. So while it possible it was operating at a higher speed somewhere, the "81 mph" thrown around the *ugh* newsfeeds does not imply any, repeat any, speed at the time of derailment. So let's cool it on speed until they pull the recorders, OK ?