Cascades 501 Wreck 18 December 17

scoostraw wrote: Looking at how far that charger unit traveled after leaving the rails, this scenario seems possibly similar to Spuyten Duyvil from several years ago. I'd be interested in what others think, but I don't think this train was moving at 30mph.

I'd bet on overspeed through a curve being the cause. I agree, I don't think that looks like a 30 mph derailment.

litz wrote:Regarding some of the pictures ... the lead Charger looks like it took on something (like a tree) that cleaved the entire roof, nose to tail, clean off the carbody. It's an absolute miracle that engineer survived.

I suspect that's a case of the damage looking worse than you would expect. The roof panels are removable by design so components can be lifted out of the carbody; it probably wouldn't take much to shear off the bolts holding them in place. The carbody is basically intact below the edge of the roofline, with no signs that I can see of anything tearing through it.

Does anyone know if the new locomotives are heavier than the old...a new unit was leading correct? I am getting the sense that this curve was a death trap that should have never been built, that Sound Transit is to blame, but I seriously wonder if they also programmed the speed for lighter units. I also wonder if Sound Transit ever tested this curve at speed, maybe not, because that would have disturbed BNSF.

icgsteve wrote:Does anyone know if the new locomotives are heavier than the old...a new unit was leading correct? I am getting the sense that this curve was a death trap that should have never been built, that Sound Transit is to blame, but I seriously wonder if they also programmed the speed for lighter units. I also wonder if Sound Transit ever tested this curve at speed, maybe not, because that would have disturbed BNSF.

I believe that the SC-44 is slightly lighter than the P42.

scoostraw wrote:Pure speculation on my part, but I have not seen any evidence in the photos to indicate that there was anything on the track - or even any track damage at all. In fact the trailing unit and last car stayed on the rails I believe.

Looking at how far that charger unit traveled after leaving the rails, this scenario seems possibly similar to Spuyten Duyvil from several years ago. I'd be interested in what others think, but I don't think this train was moving at 30mph.

I agree 100%. There's no visual evidence of anything being struck on the track, and the damage to the loco is mainly on the top and right hand side (likely caused by trees). No damage to the tracks from what I could see. Even if it did hit an object on the tracks, provided it was going the speed limit there wouldn't have been that much damage. It clearly was going too fast, which is probably why everything but the trailing P42 derailed.

Was this a two man crew in the cab, or just an engineer?

I was off today and am just now seeing this. Thank you all for a good discussion so far. Praying for all involved. I’m sure we’ll all know soon enough whether it was speed or an obstruction.

I now wonder if Amtrak/WSDOT will revert to the older schedule in order to work around the accident. The old route's still clear.

Didn't take long to likely total one of these new locomotives. Glad to see that she did her job in the crash though and that the engineer is alive to tell about it.

My prayers go out for the less fortunate and the families of those that lost their lives here.

Praying for miracles and comfort for all involved.

(Telecomtodd - The LIRR has MAS above 60 on some stretches.)

Leo_Ames wrote:Didn't take long to likely total one of these new locomotives. Glad to see that she did her job in the crash though and that the engineer is alive to tell about it.

My prayers go out for the less fortunate and the families of those that lost their lives here.

Lot of luck too and a guardian angel. With the way the roof came off I don't want to even imagine what could have happen to the engineer if the charger rolled and he/she was ejected.

Are there any safety features in the Chargers to prevent the engineer from being ejected such as seatbelts?

This picture from page #4 is somewhat interesting ...



This is back around the curve ... there's a signal shack in the background, and apparently a destroyed signal bridge at the end of the concrete retaining wall.

The camera angle is most likely contributing, but it almost looks like there's a downhill slope as the track curves left.

If that's the case, think about it ... possible excess speed, possible change in track profile to a slight downhill grade, and combine that with a left hand curve with a 30mph speed restriction ... that's almost like putting a launching pad right there.

It looks like they plowed right through the end of that wall + the signal, and just plowed the side of the hill around the curve then got ejected straight downhill once the earthen hill petered out.

The overhead shots show the locomotive basically took a straight trajectory from that point to its final resting place on the highway.

RenegadeMonster wrote:

Leo_Ames wrote:Didn't take long to likely total one of these new locomotives. Glad to see that she did her job in the crash though and that the engineer is alive to tell about it.

My prayers go out for the less fortunate and the families of those that lost their lives here.

Lot of luck too and a guardian angel. With the way the roof came off I don't want to even imagine what could have happen to the engineer if the charger rolled and he/she was ejected.

Are there any safety features in the Chargers to prevent the engineer from being ejected such as seatbelts?

I don't know of any trains in North America that have seatbelts. Unlike the removable hatches that cover the engine compartment, the cab roof is meant to stay in place. Its also worth noting that the windows on a locomotive are very strong, so its unlikely an engineer would be ejected through them.

Seattle Post-Intelligencer reporting Amtrak will go to the older routing while cleanup is still being worked on, old station still active.

http://www.seattlepi.com/local/transpor ... 440088.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Amtrak a bit behind on latest updates, but sets up a customer care line: https://twitter.com/Amtrak/status/942933536197267456" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Wonder if that's the top of the grade (summit) of the climb from Tacoma or Ft Lewis? And it's on a curve to boot!
This pic is at the extreme mag of a telephoto lens.