• Edaville Discussion

  • Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New England
Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New England

Moderators: MEC407, NHN503

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  by number7
 
http://www.patriotledger.com/business/b ... lle?zc_p=1

I found the above article when doing a Google search on 2012 Edaville renovations.

The incompetent reporter failed to ask about expanding the mainline. However, it does give the current line of propaganda coming out of the S. Carver operation.

They are relocating part of the mainline to supposedly accommodate more parking. Wouldn't surprise me if the real reason was that he sold off some land, but who knows.

At any rate, the relocation of the mainline is disappointing as well as the lack of any mention of expanding the mainline.

They have also moved the crossing signal from the south end of Eda ave and placed it over near where the train ride begins by the look of the pictures.

Unfortunately there is nothing of substance in all of this work. No new static displays, no expansion of mainline track.
  by MaineCoonCat
 
I note now two Facebook groups I've never found before. How new or current I don't know. I may have missed these before.
Save Edaville USA!!!
Edaville USA Employee's
I shall withhold comment at this time but I do reserve the right at some later point.
  by number7
 
I looked at those two groups Papabarn and didn't see anything of substance.

Judging by the pictures posted on the Edaville facebook page Deli Priscoli has the wrecking ball out again. It's a shame to tear those trees down. Why do they need more parking? I'd be surprised if they could fill up what they have now.

Why relocate part of the mainline?

He says he's putting a few more million into the place, great, why not use that money to expand the mainline?

I think he likes to exaggerate the amount of money he is dropping. Possibly by a factor of 10.

It's disappointing that his plans do not include at least using the spur.
  by number7
 
3rd Rail made an interesting comment a while back. He spoke of the idea of a street car or trolley at Edaville.

I believe that such a rail vehicle would make for a nice ride down to the end of the spur and back. On a warm day it would be most pleasant with water on both sides in many places and on the west side of the track for almost the entire spur.

I am not a big fan of catenary, and I question whether or not a third rail would be practical. The vehicle would probably need to be gas, diesel, or even battery powered.

A two foot gauge street car, open, with longitudinal seating would do the track. At the end of the line a small turntable or if possible a loop with spring switch would be nice.

A low tech method of achieving the same objective would be to have people get change sides at the end of the spur.

It's possible that latitudinal seating may be a better choice.

Either way, an open car ride down the spur, then when it returns to Atwood Junction, it continues counter clockwise around the tiny loop, would make for about as nice a ride as they can provide.

As is shown in the sales brochure for Edaville, there is an easement that would allow an expansion of the present tiny loop on the west side of the reservoir. In my opinion, this should be done post-haste, and before wasting money on non-rail related junk like they are now.
  by 3rdrail
 
Oh yeah, I think that it would be pissah ! It would do (if done correctly) what Disney does in his venues, and that's to put the audience in the mood for the spectacle that they are about to see. Riding on a little trolley to a small park, away from the trains, would put the visitor back to a time when a typical weekend trip might involve a family doing exactly that. And again, I don't think that we are talking ultra-high realism, folks. Make up a few convertible streetcars that run on rechargeable batteries. Put phoney poles running on overhead on them like at Disney Land. Recharge at night when their not running. All that would be needed would be a secluded section, it wouldn't have to be a long trip. As long as they couldn't just "walk to the park" and had to take the trolley (put up a little bridge over a shallow pond) to the park, that would be fine. We're not talking mega-millions to do this, it would draw in customers, kids would love it, adults would love it, it would maintain a "railway experience", and best of all, with a few tracks laid and rolling stock acquired, we might have our old Edaville back plus some ! :-)
  by MaineCoonCat
 
I would support the idea of a trolley using simple catenary (ala. late 1800's - early/mid 1900's). Especially if it connected to the park, a picnic area or some other "attractive destination". The thought of a ride on a "breezer" along the reservoir on a warm summer day enroute to a well run chicken (or even hotdogs and burgers) barbecue kind of stimulates my interest.
  by 3rdrail
 
I'm a believer in "generational memory", which is the belief that memories and experiences can transmit from one generation to the next or any subsequent generation, not necessarily in order. You might be surprised at the feeling of well-being an operation like this might induce.
  by number7
 
The iron is there, probably in good enough shape or close to it, some brush cutting may be needed.

I think it's about 2 miles or close to it beyond Atwood Jct.

I don't have any major objections to catenary, as long as it's not ridiculously expensive or a problem to maintain.

I imaging that they could make their own two foot street car, sacrifice a passenger coach, strip it down, and build it up as a street car. Give it the controls, the traction motors and anything else necessary to make it run.

If it worked out, maybe the right of way could be extended all the way around the reservoir. With the proper diplomacy, the street car line could even go off Edaville property and do some street running as well as some private right of way.

If they are electric, noise certainly won't be a problem. The town of Carver should get on board as it would be good for tourism.

At Xmas time, the cars would need to be enclosed or run at a speed comparable to a sleigh ride so that the people don't freeze to death.

I think there are possibilities.

But, you have to crawl before you can walk. If they would make one and use it on the Atwood Spur that would be a big step forward.
  by number7
 
In addition to the street car, I favor replicas or vehicles similar to the model T inspection car and the rail bus as well as a two foot gauge speeder.

They've got the speeder.

It's a different experience when you are exposed to the outdoors and don't have the walls and closed or partially closed windows insulating you from the outside like you do in a regular passenger car.

Many people prefer open speeders like the M9 as opposed to enclosed speeders. Kind of like riding a motorcycle instead of a small car.

Cab rides, as well as rides in smaller rail vehicles are an opportunity to bring in more dough-ray-me.

As I have said before and other have agreed with me, it was a major blunder to lose the loop around the right of way. It's much easier to accommodate multiple types of vehicles in operation at the same time if you have a signalled loop of track.

On the old loop it would have been safe to run a street car, a regular train, and a speeder all at the same time by relying on the block signal system to keep them separated. Similar to when they ran three trains at Xmas at the same time.

As mentioned before, I am in favor of bringing live steam to the operation. It would have it's own dedicated track and be operated separately but it's likely to be a big hit, especially with kids.

Face it, there are so many railroad related things that they can do, they should scrap all of that non railroad junk that they are bringing in there and instead put their efforts into rail.

It's real simple, if it doesn't have flanged wheels on it, get rid of it.

The biggest problem is that we are dealing with leadership that has shown itself to be the epitome of incompetence. Losing the 5.42 mile loop is such an embarrassment and such a major failure that I don't see how these people can show their faces in public.

That Save Edaville facebook group should start selling T-Shirts that read "Save Edaville, get rid of Deli-Priscoli"

By the way, I was looking at some pictures of the entrance. It is really bad. Talk about a really bad first impression. Anyone with any brains would take one look, turn around and go someplace else.

Cabeese should have trucks and tracks beneath them. Cabeese sitting on the ground with no trucks and tracks look so tacky and lame that it's offensive.
  by Narrowgauger
 
My wife and I were in carver last week and we drove by as im determined to get some row shots. I cant seem to find the abandoned section. I would love to get shots before its gone. That aside , as we drove up to the entrance we were shaocked at how bad it looks. I really dont get it. It was such a great place to go. True im a bit bias because im a 2 ft modeler....but its gone to hell. The f unit is in red primer...maybe a more area specific paint job going on it? As i read some where else on here....if i only had a few million.....
  by 3rdrail
 
IMHO the answer to your question is simply that Edaville was infested with people that wanted an investment only who were not really interested in trains. I believe that rail buffs don't keep a venue like Edaville going...unless you're calling the shots.
  by number7
 
Narrowgauger, on the Edaville facebook page they said they were relocating the mainline to make room for more parking.

Did the entrance appear to be in the same place?

As for the abandoned portion of the line, there may be some trespassing issues that you will want to watch out for. In the old days they let people fish in the reservoir and weren't too concerned about people on the property. My understanding is that that is no longer the case.

Your best bet is to go in through the north end near the new houses that were put in on Mt. Urann, you can find the right of way, walk through the section that used to be the "woods", then as you round the curve you'll see the end of track.

Walking may be safer than driving, not sure if you can get a car through there or not.
  by number7
 
3rd rail said "IMHO the answer to your question is simply that Edaville was infested with people that wanted an investment only who were not really interested in trains. I believe that rail buffs don't keep a venue like Edaville going...unless you're calling the shots."

You're right 3rd rail. What is sad is that these clowns running the show now don't realize that the best way to make money as a tourist RR is to be a good tourist RR. At least that's the way everyone else does it.

That means you don't do stupid things like cut your ride down to 1/3 of what it was. You don't tear up sidings, you don't tear down RR buildings.

These incompetent amateurs seem to have a knack for doing exactly the opposite of what the successful railroads would do.

In my opinion these people would have a hard time properly managing a school playground.

They came in and tore things down without thinking, spent money where it wasn't needed, then got into financial trouble.

They should have used caution. If it works, don't fix it. Repair the Cranberry Jct Station, don't tear it down. Repair the engine house, water tower, and anything else that may need repairing. Keep the character of the railroad.

Then, put your money into getting a new steam engine, improving the track, and improving the rolling stock.

If they were cautious and somewhat intelligent, they'd still have their 5.42 mile loop.

Now, compared to what they started with they are stuck with a big fat cow pattie.

If they are looking for ways to bring in revenue, they could publish a book chronicling all of their various mistakes and market it to people who are interested in business and A. want a good laugh B. want a good cry and C. don't want to repeat the same mistakes.

Of course it would have to be published volume by volume as 3,000 page tomes tend to be a bit on the expensive side.

It's real easy, they should have taken stock..

1. We have a 5.42 mile loop, that's a priority, nothing happens to the loop.
2. We have sidings, yard tracks, the Cranberry Jct station, water tower, and other RR related items, those don't get touched either.
3. We have a signal system. The signal system is a priority and shouldn't be touched.

Instead of taking a cautious and conservative approach they went in with a wrecking ball, hired a blind operator, and whatever he destroyed, he destroyed. There was no rhyme or reason.

The other thing that seems to have gone over their head is that Edaville was a railroad. People visiting were there for the railroad stuff, otherwise they'd go somewhere else.

The goal is to provide 6 to 8 hours or so of entertainment for the visitors, maybe less.

You have static displays, the train ride, it was time to add other railroad related attractions.

Why add a non railroad related ride when you can add a railroad related one?

Instead of that stupid little square layout that had hand powered train cars for the kids to ride on, why not make an elaborate one? Something that the kids will want to spend an hour or more on?

Canobie Lake used to have a nice one. I remember riding it as a kid, I loved it.

The problem is the same, Deli Priscoli has no desire to be the best at anything. He says in the press that he "doesn't want to be a six flags." Fine, then forget about amusements then.

Do it right or not at all.

Stick with the railroad theme and keep adding railroad related things.

Right now he has no sense of direction. He says that Edaville is a recognized brand but unfortunately he's destroying the brand.

Under DeliPriscoli the name Edaville will become synonymous with the words "tourist trap."

It's well on it's way.
  by number7
 
You know, back in the day, Edaville was a force to be reckoned with in the narrow gauge world.

Just before it closed in the early 90's, they had the capacity to handle what little traffic they get now, plus what they get up at MNRR, plus what they get at WWF plus what they get at Boothbay. And they could do it all at the same time.

I figure they could have run up to 5 trains at a time if they really wanted to. It may have required additions to the signal system.

7 and 8 could each pull their own train. 3 and 4 could pull shorter trains and still steam heat them. #5 could pull a short train or be double headed with a diesel and steam heat the train.

With 5 trains each train would on average have a mile of track to call it's own. With skillful speed control and timing it could be done.

Now of course they'd be lucky if they could run two trains at once.

One of the problems that they face now is that after the train ride, the intelligent person is going to feel unsatisfied, he or she is going to have the feeling that they have been jipped. They didn't get their money's worth and thus aren't likely to be in a hurry to return.
  by 3rdrail
 
I agree with your post generally number7, however I don't think that you can compare Edaville with other tourist railroads, thus by building a better one, some of the same problems might still exist. As most who experienced Edaville it's its heyday will tell you, Edaville was a tradition and a New England icon. Bar none, none of any of the other "tourist railroads" or museums has been able to do that. That was the Achilles Heal that shouldn't have been messed with. It pissed a lot of people off.
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