Through Sleepers on the Michigan Central

I have a reprint of the Jan. 1930 Official Guide. In it, the Lehigh Valley was running several through Pullman sleepers between Philadelphia (via RDG Co.) and Detroit and Chicago, as well as between New York and Chicago. That got me thinking... just how and where were these sleepers handed off between railroads?
Growing up in Eastern PA, I never familiarized myself with the Buffalo railroad lines and connections. I know that the LV had a connection with the NYC on it's Niagara branch, but that line bypassed Buffalo. In addition, the Michigan Central trains ruan via the Ft. Erie route directly to Buffalo Central Terminal, bypassing Niagara Falls.
Since the service was discontinued some time in the 30's (I think), I'll be surprised if anyone can definitively answer my question. Instead, I'm willing to settle for speculation. Where would through Pullmans be exchanged? I imagine the Michigan Central trains traveled past Exchange St. Station on their way to Central Terminal. Did the LV have an interchange with the NYC somwhere near downtown Buffalo?

Could Canadien National and Grand Trunk Western be involved?
A recent article about Notre Dame sports special trains in 1937 mentioned a routing of South Bend - GTW - Sarnia - CN- Suspension Bridge - LV - Hunter - PRR - New York.

JimBoylan wrote:Could Canadien National and Grand Trunk Western be involved?
A recent article about Notre Dame sports special trains in 1937 mentioned a routing of South Bend - GTW - Sarnia - CN- Suspension Bridge - LV - Hunter - PRR - New York.

In 1930, the Valley had a through train with coaches and sleepers from Chicago-New York via the CN/GT. However, that ran via Niagara Falls. I think it was called the New Yoker. I'll have to double check the guide. I'm not sure if it stopped in Buffalo, then backed out to Depew/Niagara Jct. or if it bypassed Buffalo altogether. Regardless, the Michigan Central through Pullmans would have had no need for the CN, as they had their own route between Chicago and Buffalo via Detroit and Southern Ontario . Michigan Central #8 (The Wolverine) carried a through sleeper from Chicago-Philadelphia and Detroit-Philadelphia via LV and RDG. According to the schedules, that train took the Ft. Erie route, which means it crossed the bridge in Buffalo, bypassing Niagara Falls.

On some of the trains, the Canada-bound cars were probably pulled off at Depew and ran to Niagara Falls as a separate train. This practice was in effect on trains 7 & 8, the Maple Leaf right until the end of passenger service in 1961. Niagara Falls/Toronto cars were pulled off at Depew and operated as trains 107/108 Depew-Niagara Falls.

Regarding the Michigan Central / Lehigh Valley Pullman services.
I am speculating that the hand off of Pullmans was made downtown between NYC MCRR Terrace Station and LVRR Washington Street Terminal via the NYC connecting track. The MCRR / LVRR connection ended sometime after the opening of NYC Buffalo Central Terminal in 1929. The following schedule for LV-MC Pullmans is from the April 26, 1925 LV Timetable.
Westbound Pullman Service NYC- Chi 12 Sec/DR was handled by train 3 The Chicago - Toronto Express, passing over the LV trackage at night and bypassing Ithaca. The westbound Philly - Chicago 12 Sc/DR Pullman was carried by the daylight Black Diamond from Bethlehem.
Eastbound train 2 Philadelphia - New York Express carried the Chicago to Philly 12 Sec - DR Pullman overnight on LV rails bypassing Ithaca.
Eastbound daylight train 10 The Black Diamond carried the Chicago - NYC 12Sec - DR Pullman. The Michigan Central routing appears to be three hours faster than the GT-CN routing via Depew/Suspension Bridge.
Tom Biery

Thanks Tom. That's the most likely way they interchanged.
For kicks and grins, I looked up the fastest way to get from Tempe, AZ to Bethlehem, PA (where I grew up) in 1930. Initially, if I were to take a guess, I would have thought that changing stations in Chicago and taking a Pennsy train to N. Philadelphia, with a change to Reading's N. Broad St. station and on to Bethlehem would have been the fastest. But the layover times in Chicago were so long, that a LV through sleeper was the fastest routing:
From Tempe to Bethlehem: Golden State Limited (Joint SP-Rock Island) left Tempe 6:30AM (picked up for El Paso and beyond) arrived at Chicago LaSalle St. Station at 9AM two days later. In Chicago, transfer to Central Station where the Michigan Central's Wolverine (#8) carried a through sleeper to Philadelphia via the LV/RDG. That left Chicago at 11AM, connected with the LV's #2 (New York-Philadelphia Express), arriving in Bethlehem at 8AM the next morning. So it took about 3 days.

For the return trip, the fastest (and least expensive) routing took the LV through Buffalo as well. The #5 (Lehigh LImited) left Bethlehem at 10:30ish PM, arriving in Buffalo at 7:00AM. Transfer to Central Terminal where the NYC #151 (Interstate Express) left at 8:30AM for Chicago, arriving 7:30PM LaSalle St. Station. At 8:30PM, the Golden State Limited left for L.A. It stopped in Tempe to drop off passengers from beyond El Paso.. I figured it was cheaper to back then to buy a Pullman fare from Bethlehem to Buffalo, then pay coach from Buffalo to Chicago, as opposed to pay for a Pullman trough from Bethlehem to Chicago.

Some of my times may be off, I'm trying to enter this from memory.
As cool as it was to trace that routing, I'd still rather spend 5 hours cramped in a Southwest 737 from Phoenix to Philly then spend 3 days on a train.

Bethlehem Jct. wrote:Thanks Tom. That's the most likely way they interchanged.
For kicks and grins, I looked up the fastest way to get from Tempe, AZ to Bethlehem, PA (where I grew up) in 1930. Initially, if I were to take a guess, I would have thought that changing stations in Chicago and taking a Pennsy train to N. Philadelphia, with a change to Reading's N. Broad St. station and on to Bethlehem would have been the fastest. But the layover times in Chicago were so long, that a LV through sleeper was the fastest routing:
From Tempe to Bethlehem: Golden State Limited (Joint SP-Rock Island) left Tempe 6:30AM (picked up for El Paso and beyond) arrived at Chicago LaSalle St. Station at 9AM two days later. In Chicago, transfer to Central Station where the Michigan Central's Wolverine (#8) carried a through sleeper to Philadelphia via the LV/RDG. That left Chicago at 11AM, connected with the LV's #2 (New York-Philadelphia Express), arriving in Bethlehem at 8AM the next morning. So it took about 3 days.

Some of my times may be off, I'm trying to enter this from memory.
As cool as it was to trace that routing, I'd still rather spend 5 hours cramped in a Southwest 737 from Phoenix to Philly then spend 3 days on a train.

The September 4th business news announced america's airline industry expects to lose $9,000,000,000 dollars this year. Infact this is more than the industry has ever made in 80 years! American Airlines has just announced 7% cuts and laying off over 900 service attendents. As the coming years go by. Fares will rise, service will be cut till there is very little air service. South What? a flash in the pan of cheap oil history.
On your next air trip take lots of pictures.

Bethlehem Jct. wrote:
As cool as it was to trace that routing, I'd still rather spend 5 hours cramped in a Southwest 737 from Phoenix to Philly then spend 3 days on a train.

I do understand, those long distance trains are always sold out today. Some with waits of months for sleeper space in the summer. I'd still take alot of pictures of the airport.