Larry wrote:To answer Noel's question, is it not the same problem today why this is not being used, The ST, Guilford, B&M and now Pan Am owed the line from the Springfield Armory to the the MA/CT Line, so in hense why the had it ripped up and sold the land underneath so no one could use this right away. With the NVN-SPG line being upgraded in near futrure, this line becomes more important today then ever to move freight from the North to places in CT. I know they have tried to get the land back but Politicians in State of MA are not helping.It's never going to be completely encroached because either Guilford or PC poached some coin allowing a major gas main to be installed underneath it. No structures can ever be built on the ROW as long as the gas main is there, and whatever is there has to be able to be dug up at-will to service the pipeline. So the only things blocking it are some driveways, this jungle gym, and a couple patches of grass abutting parks. The paved trail in Longmeadow is even rail-with-trail'able since most of it seems to be offset ever-so-slightly from where the tracks were (I'm guessing because of the pipeline). It can happen if Amtrak's got the muscle to lay down demands about punting freights off the Springfield Line. It's just too bad MA has been so flippant about lifting a finger to do any more than that. I-291 in CT and those last 2 road bridges before the B&A junction: those are the only overhead structures on the entire line. Double stacks into Hartford...right there.
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Remains of the NY&NE?
- Discussion relating to the NH and its subsidiaries (NYW&B, Union Freight Railroad, Connecticut Company, steamship lines, etc.). up until its 1969 inclusion into the Penn Central merger. This forum is also for the discussion of efforts to preserve former New Haven equipment, artifacts and its history. You may also wish to visit www.nhrhta.org for more information.
Regarding the Armory Branch:
Gas Pipeline-
This was called "the Jet Line" and was built during the early to mid 1960s so it was during the New Haven Railroad era. The pipeline followed the Air Line from New Haven to Middletown, then the Valley from Middletown to Hartford. I believe it parallels the main line Hartford to East Hartford, then the Armory from there to Springfield. It continued beyond the Armory branch to Westover Field, the Air Force Base. Its primary mission was to supply jet fuel to the USAF. My Dad worked in Willimansett MA next to where the Westover Branch connected with their Conn River main line and before the pipeline there were usually tank cars stored in the area.
Regarding the "Through Freight Route" concept-
"Engineer Spike" was (and is) correct that the line has a lot of light rail - I believe 78 and 80 lb per yard and even some ex CNE 79 lb rail according to A J Belliveau of the Central New England RR, the operator that has the rights to the state of CT owned line north of the East Windsor Hill area to the State Line in Hazardville, where the track ends. A J did try to purchase some of the line intact north of the state line but did not receive any cooperation from any party, including the former owner, the state of Mass, or even the scrappy hired to lift the track. This remains a sore point with him to this day. As finanaces and time permits A J is improving the existing line, some of it having been out of service since the mid 1970s. I remember one especially large tree that grew in the gauge by a crossing between Hazardville and Melrose that literrly kinked the out of service rail before A J rebuilt the crossing!
Additionally, years ago I asked the question of using the route for through freights - and there were several each way back at the time - to Hartford trainmaster the late Joseph F Daly, who had been at that position through the NH, PC CR (for a short time) and Amtrak. Joe said the PC had studied this but the major problem was a large number of grade crossings (he said around a hundred but that must have included everything down to inactive farm crossings). Many more crossings than the main line, Hartford to Springfield. Add to that the problem of the light rail, mostly cinder ballast and a few surprisingly sharp (but short) grades and possibly some bridges as well.
Gas Pipeline-
This was called "the Jet Line" and was built during the early to mid 1960s so it was during the New Haven Railroad era. The pipeline followed the Air Line from New Haven to Middletown, then the Valley from Middletown to Hartford. I believe it parallels the main line Hartford to East Hartford, then the Armory from there to Springfield. It continued beyond the Armory branch to Westover Field, the Air Force Base. Its primary mission was to supply jet fuel to the USAF. My Dad worked in Willimansett MA next to where the Westover Branch connected with their Conn River main line and before the pipeline there were usually tank cars stored in the area.
Regarding the "Through Freight Route" concept-
"Engineer Spike" was (and is) correct that the line has a lot of light rail - I believe 78 and 80 lb per yard and even some ex CNE 79 lb rail according to A J Belliveau of the Central New England RR, the operator that has the rights to the state of CT owned line north of the East Windsor Hill area to the State Line in Hazardville, where the track ends. A J did try to purchase some of the line intact north of the state line but did not receive any cooperation from any party, including the former owner, the state of Mass, or even the scrappy hired to lift the track. This remains a sore point with him to this day. As finanaces and time permits A J is improving the existing line, some of it having been out of service since the mid 1970s. I remember one especially large tree that grew in the gauge by a crossing between Hazardville and Melrose that literrly kinked the out of service rail before A J rebuilt the crossing!
Additionally, years ago I asked the question of using the route for through freights - and there were several each way back at the time - to Hartford trainmaster the late Joseph F Daly, who had been at that position through the NH, PC CR (for a short time) and Amtrak. Joe said the PC had studied this but the major problem was a large number of grade crossings (he said around a hundred but that must have included everything down to inactive farm crossings). Many more crossings than the main line, Hartford to Springfield. Add to that the problem of the light rail, mostly cinder ballast and a few surprisingly sharp (but short) grades and possibly some bridges as well.
Sounds to me like the shades of the Beacon Branch. Although I think Beacon had 107 pound rail for the most part, it was in pretty dreadful shape in the early 70's when I was running on it. Speed of 10 MPH all the way with a bunch of crossings and the grade out of the Hudson Valley called for all the power we could muster on the heavy trains that ran from Selkirk to Oak Point and the Long Island Rail Road during this period. You could do the Hudson with two units but you really needed all five unites after you got to Beacon. The biggest difference in Beacon was that the distance was not as great. Eventually the Penn Central fixed up the track to a point where we could go somewhat faster than 10 MPH at least part of the way but my memory slips me just how much of it we could do better. In 1972 it took a bit over an hour to do Hopewell Junction - Beacon. I had a lot of adventures running over in that neck of the woods but it was still a nice ride in the country.
Noel Weaver
Noel Weaver
Noel;
You could have been running one of the trains back in the early 70's (70-74 for me) that I would follow, on foot! Me and friends used to hang around in Beacon in our early teens, and when I heard a train coming I'd take off and and meet it up with it at Churchill street, right where the old station was. I'd then walk along with it at least up to East Main, and I didn't have to run! So yea, 5-10 MPH tops! I think after a while they got used to me chasing/ following along with it. Of course a couple of times when I didn't make it up to the engines in time, I'd hop on one of the ladders and ride for a bit (you know, stupid kid stuff!) When I got my liscense I'd follow them up the grade to Fishkill, but then girls came into the picture, and that was that!
John T
You could have been running one of the trains back in the early 70's (70-74 for me) that I would follow, on foot! Me and friends used to hang around in Beacon in our early teens, and when I heard a train coming I'd take off and and meet it up with it at Churchill street, right where the old station was. I'd then walk along with it at least up to East Main, and I didn't have to run! So yea, 5-10 MPH tops! I think after a while they got used to me chasing/ following along with it. Of course a couple of times when I didn't make it up to the engines in time, I'd hop on one of the ladders and ride for a bit (you know, stupid kid stuff!) When I got my liscense I'd follow them up the grade to Fishkill, but then girls came into the picture, and that was that!
John T