SEPTA approves FY2022 Budget

A bit late but they approved their FY2022 budget

https://www.railwayage.com/passenger/se ... 22-budget/

The operating budget will allow SEPTA to increase service levels—without fare increases—in support of the region’s recovery from COVID-19, and also reflects initiatives launched as part of a new Efficiency and Accountability program, according to the agency.

Among the projects included in SEPTA’s capital budget and 12-year program, which totals $7.4 billion:
• $203.66 million for trolley modernization through 2033, with $30.14 million set aside for FY22. Work includes infrastructure upgrades in areas such as communications, signals, power, ADA stations, bridge improvements and maintenance facilities.
• $97.3 million for rail fleet replacement through 2033, including trolley cars, the Market-Frankford Line fleet and Silverliner IV Regional Rail vehicles. For FY22, $1.76 million is budgeted.

ZS and Everyone:

Interesting news about SEPTA's new FY 2022 Budget - the good news is no ill-timed fare increase while SEPTA
is trying to recover from the massive ridership losses in the past 16 months from the pandemic...

The question that I have is concerning possible replacement of the Market-Frankford M4 fleet - which dates from
the second half of the 1990s - these cars are 23 to 24 years old as of now (1997-98 I believe were the build dates).
Have the current MFSE fleet fallen out of favor of SEPTA operations this quickly?
For comparison the Budd 1960 M3 fleet saw about 38 years of service on average.

For comparison the Broad Street Line Kawasaki B4 cars are now 38-39 years old (built 1982-1983) and have held
up well over the years...When these cars were new they replaced the older fleet - the B1 cars (1928); B2 "Bridge"
cars (1936) and B3 cars (1938) which were (from what remained) 55, 47 and 45 years old respectively at the time
that they were retired. That old BSL fleet was literally run into the ground when they were replaced by the B4's.

The Silverliner Four fleet is now 45 to 47 years old (1974-1976) and does look to reach 50 years in service before
any replacement fleet is in the offing...A single-level S6 fleet would make the most sense for SEPTA - and not any
multilevel MU cars. This new order would need to be about 220 cars to effectively replace the S4 fleet.

What SEPTA needs is a steady funding source such as a regional sales tax to not have to be at the mercy of
revenue sources such as Pennsylvania Turpike tolls and better yet not have to deal with hostile PA politicians
from outside the Philadelphia area for any PA state transit subsidies...MACTRAXX

Glad to hear that SEPTA and other commuter railroads are still improving service and recovering from the pandemic. Keep in mind that this is the same railroad that proposed this map due to lack of funding in the middle of the pandemic.

PF: That map is your typical SEPTA "Doomsday" warning to riders and politicos...
Nothing new about this...SEPTA has used drastic service cuts as leverage in the past...MACTRAXX

MACTRAXX wrote: ↑Tue Jul 27, 2021 5:32 pm PF: That map is your typical SEPTA "Doomsday" warning to riders and politicos...
Nothing new about this...SEPTA has used drastic service cuts as leverage in the past...MACTRAXX

The doom and gloom maps are comically bad. We are seeing what a reduced service looks like now. Not as horrible as advertised.

BTW, the Bridge Cars were the B-3 (goes by year acquired, not year built).

Could Philadelphia and the surrounding counties raise the sales tax by %0.5 for dedicated funding?

After taking a trip to Sweden and visiting the Stockholm area, Septa needs lots of improvements. People use the commuter rail system all day and is well connected to the subway and bus network. Having a new fleet will be nice, but Septa needs to improve all the stations with clean bright stations, elevators, escalators and be high platform. Not having dedicated funding prevents Septa from realizing this goal.

In the metro area how much money does %0.5 annually raise?

I would take a slightly different approach… have the state cut its sales tax by 1% and let the region keep the 1% going provided that money was dedicated to SEPTA. Any other region of the state could do the same thing. That 1% would be about $650 million presuming that the region brings in 1/3 of the state sales tax revenue.

MACTRAXX wrote: ↑Tue Jul 27, 2021 4:20 pm ZS and Everyone:

Interesting news about SEPTA's new FY 2022 Budget - the good news is no ill-timed fare increase while SEPTA
is trying to recover from the massive ridership losses in the past 16 months from the pandemic...

The question that I have is concerning possible replacement of the Market-Frankford M4 fleet - which dates from
the second half of the 1990s - these cars are 23 to 24 years old as of now (1997-98 I believe were the build dates).
Have the current MFSE fleet fallen out of favor of SEPTA operations this quickly?
For comparison the Budd 1960 M3 fleet saw about 38 years of service on average.

For comparison the Broad Street Line Kawasaki B4 cars are now 38-39 years old (built 1982-1983) and have held
up well over the years...When these cars were new they replaced the older fleet - the B1 cars (1928); B2 "Bridge"
cars (1936) and B3 cars (1938) which were (from what remained) 55, 47 and 45 years old respectively at the time
that they were retired. That old BSL fleet was literally run into the ground when they were replaced by the B4's.

The Silverliner Four fleet is now 45 to 47 years old (1974-1976) and does look to reach 50 years in service before
any replacement fleet is in the offing...A single-level S6 fleet would make the most sense for SEPTA - and not any
multilevel MU cars. This new order would need to be about 220 cars to effectively replace the S4 fleet.

What SEPTA needs is a steady funding source such as a regional sales tax to not have to be at the mercy of
revenue sources such as Pennsylvania Turpike tolls and better yet not have to deal with hostile PA politicians
from outside the Philadelphia area for any PA state transit subsidies...MACTRAXX

The MFL cars have fallen FAR of favor with crews, the shops, and to be honest, the general public. They have not aged well at all. Their interiors are in horrible condition: the plastic used is yellowing, the digital signage rarely works properly, and there are very few places in the car to include wayfinding.

The perfect replacement would be something akin to what the CTA and the MBTA got from CRRC before they were banned from manufacturing for the US. Now, I suppose Alstom will have to step up to the plate and provide SEPTA with its replacements.

mcgrath618 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 05, 2021 11:34 amThe perfect replacement would be something akin to what the CTA and the MBTA got from CRRC before they were banned from manufacturing for the US. Now, I suppose Alstom will have to step up to the plate and provide SEPTA with its replacements.

Why not go back to Kawasaki for the M-5 order?

BuddCar711 wrote: ↑Fri Aug 06, 2021 7:39 amWhy not go back to Kawasaki for the M-5 order?

That depends if that are willing to make a custom set for Septa.