PATCO ROW in Philadephia

The ROW used by PATCO on the Philly side ... I know some of it is part of the old Bridge Line ... any history there? Where does the ROW go from 15/16th streets?

There really isn't much beyond 15th/16th Sts. - AFAIK there are some storage tracks but not, for example, an unused tunnel just waiting for rails to provide service to West Philly.

In another thread I noted that in the mid-1970s the DVRPC (Delaware Valley Regional Planning Commission, if you're not familiar with the acronym) laid out a 50-year plan for transit in the s.e. PA - so. Jersey area. Extending PATCO to West Philadelphia was a priority project, with a connection to a similarly-extended P&W along the Cardington Branch as a potential next step.

'fraid it's never gonna happen, at least not in the current economic and political climate.

When it first opened the Bridge line only went to the 8th and Market Station. Initially the line just shuttled from there to Camden. Later the line was extended up ridge ave. Sometime between 1944 and 1953 the line was extended to its present terminus. I can't be more specific without my notes which are in Philadelphia currently. I hope that helps.

Sean@Temple

And in Philadelphia tradition for building subways, the line was supposed to then go down Passyunk Ave.

Its too bad SEPTA can't run the Ridge Ave shuttle all the way to 15th-16th St. Would be nice to have a Philly subway on Locust Street.

I know this is off topic, sort of, but has anyone heard anything about the reopening of Franklin Square station? Now that the Constitution Ctr is open, and a large office building next to the station opening soon, any chance PATCO will re-evaluate the need for the station? There are always lights on there, although all the street access ways have been sealed off. From the park, you can hardly tell where they used to be. Walk around a little and you will find them though. If you go to the park at night, you can actually look down one of the subway vents and see the train go by.

Eltingville SINY wrote:The ROW used by PATCO on the Philly side ... I know some of it is part of the old Bridge Line ... any history there? Where does the ROW go from 15/16th streets?

The Bridge Line was started in 1936, and it ran from Broadway Camden to 8th and Market in Philadelphia. However, when the Ridge Ave subway was constructed, the line continued on to 16th and Locust St, the tunnel abruptly ended at 18th St. The tunnel from 8th and Market to 16th and Locust was finished but not tracked and open from 1932-53. In 1953, the City installed tracks in the Locust St subway, and limited service was extended to 16th St [Service to 7 p.m. on Weekdays only, the Bridge Line was through routed with the Ridge Ave service nights and weekends. PRT/PTC ran the line under contract with the DRPA and its predecessor].

In 1967, in anticipation of the PATCO line, the City built the one-track stub terminal track above the original 8th and Market station [which killed off the 47 trolley], but a track connection between the Ridge line and the PATCO line continued to exist until the late 80's.

The original plan was that the Locust St Subway would go to University City and Southwest Philadelphia under, then over Woodland Ave [as an El]. The line dead-ended at 18th St because residents of Rittenhouse Square [the richest and most politically powerful citizens in the city] did not want the mess of subway construction through their neighborhood.
Basically, west of 15th-16th, there is a crossover, and the tracks go on to the end at 18th st.

jfrey40535 wrote:... has anyone heard anything about the reopening of Franklin Square station?

I did see an article about Franklin Square recently. Can't remember where right now - post-Christmas brain rot setting in, I guess. Anyway, the gist was that whoever makes these decisions feels that access is too inconvenient and the station wouldn't attract enough riders to justify its re-opening.

I'm not saying I agree, I'm just reporting what I read.

JeffK wrote:

jfrey40535 wrote:... has anyone heard anything about the reopening of Franklin Square station?

I did see an article about Franklin Square recently. Can't remember where right now - post-Christmas brain rot setting in, I guess. Anyway, the gist was that whoever makes these decisions feels that access is too inconvenient and the station wouldn't attract enough riders to justify its re-opening.

I'm not saying I agree, I'm just reporting what I read.

The area is somewhat desolate. The streets [6th, Race, 7th, and 8th] are traffic-choked and dangerous to cross, there are no stores, and the Vine St Expressway cuts off the northern neighborhoods from the station. And lastly, Franklin Sq is a homeless hangout.

When the station was open during the Bicentennial [wayy back in 1976], the usage was so low, the station was closed nights and weekends.

Most people would rather use the 8th and Market station anyway.

Mdlbigcat wrote:

JeffK wrote:

jfrey40535 wrote:... has anyone heard anything about the reopening of Franklin Square station?

I did see an article about Franklin Square recently. Can't remember where right now - post-Christmas brain rot setting in, I guess. Anyway, the gist was that whoever makes these decisions feels that access is too inconvenient and the station wouldn't attract enough riders to justify its re-opening.

I'm not saying I agree, I'm just reporting what I read.

The area is somewhat desolate. The streets [6th, Race, 7th, and 8th] are traffic-choked and dangerous to cross, there are no stores, and the Vine St Expressway cuts off the northern neighborhoods from the station. And lastly, Franklin Sq is a homeless hangout.

When the station was open during the Bicentennial [wayy back in 1976], the usage was so low, the station was closed nights and weekends.

Most people would rather use the 8th and Market station anyway.

You are totally right on ALL counts. I went there last summer to try and find the openings for the station, which was near impossible, and found trying to cross almost got me killed. The park is beautiful, the plaza at the foot of the bridge is beautiful and there could be lots of traffic to that station, but, there would have to be pedestrian bridges put in or have the tunnels extended across the streets to have people access the station.

... or it could make a killer night spot. Philly is always in need for another one of those.

Franklin Square is up for some referb job much like Washington Square got a few years ago. It is going to be tuff to get rid of the homeless there but there are a lot few bodies there then in years past. But as someone said previously, there would deffinately have to be a pedestrian bridge installed near the Constitution Center to the Station enterances in the Plaza. All that is really needed is that bridge and to get rid of the homeless, whom for the most part stick to the square anyway and at least in the day time leave the bridge plaza alone.

Sean@Temple

Gee, a fleeting thought...

What if some sort of shuttle bus service (like the CC loop, or the PHLash I think it's called?) was set up to Independence Mall from Franklin Sq? It could even cover more ground than that ... Franklin Sq, The Mall, the Waterfront, (maybe even another spoke to the Franklin Institute/Art Museum). Right now, there's no convenient way for us South Jersey folk to get anywhere in Philly by mass transit other than the Gallery (or 30th Street via ACL) - bus service on this side of the river is, well, lacking.

The Old City area is a companion to the revitalized Camden waterfront. On the NJ side, there's the River Line connecting PATCO and NJT Bus to the attractions. Something similar on the PA side might be useful.