Locust Street Subway

What's the history of the Locust Street Subway? The two pages at http://www.trainweb.org/phillynrhs/patco.html and http://world.nycsubway.org/us/phila/broadstreet.html seem to disagree.

http://railroad.net/forums/viewtopic.ph ... eet+subway seems to agree more with the nycsubway.org story. Is the Philly NHRS correct about Bridge Line trains running north to Girard, or did they go all the way to Olney? Also, did Bridge Line trains run onto the Broad-Ridge spur on weekdays, or did they end at 8th-Market then?

A final question - where was the ramp shown in the photo on http://www.septa.org/inside/history/bsl.html?

I'll let the experts answer your first questions. Per the picture, that's on South Broad Street, at Sansom street. The ornate steps just behind the ramp go to the Union League building. They must have been using it as construction access, as the subway was not built cut-and-cover (at least not in Center City -- was it done that way elsewhere?)

SPUI wrote:

http://railroad.net/forums/viewtopic.ph ... eet+subway seems to agree more with the nycsubway.org story. Is the Philly NHRS correct about Bridge Line trains running north to Girard, or did they go all the way to Olney? Also, did Bridge Line trains run onto the Broad-Ridge spur on weekdays, or did they end at 8th-Market then?

I suspect that the answer to the inconsistencies is tied to the period that is being described. I know that in the 1960's, Bridge Line Trains ran through the 8th & Market Station and terminated at 16th & Locust. The Ridge-Broad spur used the same 8th Street Station and usually terminated at Girard Ave. It was certainly possible to have run Bridge Line trains to Girard or even further north in the BSS, but they would have had to reverse directions at 8th Street. I can't say that this was never done, but I never saw it done.

When PATCO took over the Bridge Line, and extended it, the Ridge-Broad trains were removed from that lower platform at 8th Street and a new terminus was built on the same level as the MFSE.

walt wrote:
It was certainly possible to have run Bridge Line trains to Girard or even further north in the BSS, but they would have had to reverse directions at 8th Street. I can't say that this was never done, but I never saw it done.

I rode trains from Camden to Girard that reversed direction at 8th & Market in the late '50's. I believe the PTC fare was 20 cents at the time. An additional 2.5 cent token was necessary for crossing the bridge.

Here is where I got it from http://www.phillyroads.com/crossings/benjamin-franklin/

"For years after the Benjamin Franklin Bridge opened, the outboard structures that were to be used for rail service sat unused. Rail service between Philadelphia and Camden became a reality in 1936, when new service began over the bridge under the auspices of the Delaware River Joint Commission. The new service ran from 8th and Market streets in Center City Philadelphia to the Broadway station in downtown Camden. Through service from Girard Avenue via the Broad Street Spur / Ridge Avenue subway line began soon thereafter."

Its too bad the city gave up its right to run trains from Fern Rock to 16th & Locust. The subway on Locust Street really only serves New Jersians now.

As it stands now, there really wouldn't be any point in having septa run into the locust street subway. 2 of the stops attach directly to the concourse, at walnut-locust. The third stop is 3 blocks away from 8th and market at 9th/10th and locust, and its a cinderella station anyway (like all septa rails) It seems to exist mostly to get folks who live in Jersey to Jeff Hospital.

Now, if they had followed the plan from 80 years ago and kept the tunnel going, or extended it to anywhere, it might make sense.

Since we're talking about the underground tunnel concourses, were there any plans to extend the BSL concourse under Broad Street any further south at any time? I've been taking the underground way home due to the snow and noticed that the end of the tunnel at Spruce St isn't flush with the stairwell walls but rather extends about 3' further south. Anybody have any ideas?

Drew