CR on the Southern Secondary

Bracdude181 wrote: ↑Sat Feb 13, 2021 10:12 am @Charlie If MDL is gonna get service again now is a pretty good time to start working on it. Conrail will eventually have to restore service to Lakehurst for Seashore Lines, if not to turn around there. The MDL Siding is really not in terrible shape and could likely be fixed for cheap. Just needs a good cleaning, new ties, and better signage at the grade crossings. Depending on how often they’d get service, maybe replace the rails too? Might not be necessary.

As I’ve mentioned I’d like to see them get boxcars full of those crates they get in by truck. Not sure what the crates are for but satellite images show lots of them inside the base, stored near two aircraft hangers.

Bracdude, you realize that the Lakehurst siding is not in a useable location for the base? It was situated there to allow for the removal of contaminated soil from the Bomarc Cleanup 1999-2001. For it to be of any use to the Navy, it would have to be rerun like it used to be about a mile and a half north of there to go to their supply warehouses.

If you look at www.historicarials.com and pull up the Navy base, then access the topo maps to 1972, you can see where the original railroad sidings that ran to service the base back in the days that it needed it. It had one long siding that went to Hangar One and the rest of the line ran along Hope Chapel Rd and then turned north to get out beyond Hancock Rd to their supply area. Hangar One siding was left over from WWI to help service the dirigibles.

Bottom line, only McGuire AFB has a real-time function and they get their bulk supplies via pipeline. Lakehurst is nothing but R&D and Ft Dix is now nothing but a minor support facility for the part time Army Reserves and National Guard. None of these bases requires any bulk supplies to make having and maintaining a rail line of any use.

The only time I thought there would've been a shot of re-establishing rail was back during the '91 Desert Shield operation as they were using Ft Dix as a mobilization post to get units ready for deployment before the troops were put on board transport aircraft out of McGuire. It would have been useful to have the rail line to bring in empty flatcars to load out vehicles for Savannah Harbor instead of trucking the vehicles out to get loaded out elsewhere. Maybe if that level of operations went longer than Feb '91 and they actually need the larger deployment of troops (I was a Company Commander in the Reserves waiting on activation orders for my unit), they may have thought to rebuild the tracks from Pemberton.

If any of these bases were home to a combat type outfit, it might be a different story. Earle Naval Depot (totally disassociated from MDL) has more use since they deal in bulk supplies of ammunition for the supply ships that dock out at the Leonardo pier. That is why they have maintained their rail connection.

@CharlieL I was not aware that the rail siding placement wasn’t ideal. I figured they’d just extend it from where it ends if they wanted to.

Also for Earles sake, keeping that spur to the Southern has helped out a lot. Over the past two decades, engines, cars, and maintenance equipment has been ferried there via Conrail. Meanwhile MDL has been dormant. Aside from those crates they get in by truck, which can also be delivered by boxcar, I can’t think of any reason why they’d need rail service now.

Upside is we will eventually see the Earle spur be used even if we don’t go to war. Earle has a boxcar fleet that has to be replaced ever few decades. The last shipment of those cars was delivered in either 2004 or 2002. What’s weird is that supposedly no one knew the power for that train. There is another picture of a Conrail SD80MAC and a CSX GE engine (dash 9 maybe??) sitting in the Earle Yard somewhere on the internet, so maybe that was the power? Idk

I agree JBMDL probally won't ever use a rail siding. But its a must to be connected to one when they start slashing Military Base's. The location of the current Base entrence is planned to be moved very near the siding. I am sure this might have something to do with the new road from Lakehurst to McGuire over rt 539 planned this year?
But we are all just guessing at this time. We need to see guys/girls in suits with chrome shovels...LOL

@Tanker1497 I’m with you that one XD.

Actually, on the topic of rail connections at military installations, wasn’t there one at Fort Monmouth on Pinebrook Road? If so, what was it used for and why was it abandoned?

Bracdude wrote:

Actually, on the topic of rail connections at military installations, wasn’t there one at Fort Monmouth on Pinebrook Road? If so, what was it used for and why was it abandoned?

Ft Monmouth had multiple rail access points. On the Southern the siding at Pinebrooke Rd. was used for warehouses in that area. Then there was the line that went from Eatontown right through the Fort where they had several sidings. The Coast Line (NY&LB) also had sidings in the Fort at different times in it's history. I remember seeing box and flat cars there in the 1960s and perhaps as late as 1975. There were warehouses along the sidings with loading docks. I remember waiting for a train to cross Main St. in Oceanport coming out of the Fort and heading toward Branchport.

@R&DB Thanks for the info. No idea Fort Monmouth had that much going on railroad wise.

Bracdude181 wrote: ↑Sat Feb 13, 2021 5:23 pm @Tanker1497 I’m with you that one XD.

Actually, on the topic of rail connections at military installations, wasn’t there one at Fort Monmouth on Pinebrook Road? If so, what was it used for and why was it abandoned?

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@Tanker1497 So that’s what the abandoned track near Maxwell was. Thanks for the info.

Bracdude181 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 14, 2021 10:51 am @Tanker1497 So that’s what the abandoned track near Maxwell was. Thanks for the info.

Originally, the Southern (from the north at Port Monmouth and Red Bank) turned east onto this abandoned ROW. It ran through Fort Monmouth to Long Branch via Eatontown and Branchport. The Southern went south from the junction toward Farmingdale. Once, Pennsy had trackage rights to run from Farmingdale up the Southern and then to Long Branch, the only way for them to get there at that time, circa 1861.

@GSC Wow, there’s a lot more to that track than I thought! I always figured the Southerns current alignment has remained the same for most of its history, with small changes over time. (Red Bank Yard for example) I’m yet to learn more about how things were on this line prior to the early 90s. I’m very much interested in how things were on this line during its peak under CNJ rule and how it was under early Conrail. From what I gather, the line ran the most efficient under 1970s CNJ than it ever did under Conrail! Certainly more efficient than it is now.

The Southern,was originally founded as its own railroad as the Jersey Southern Railroad, to bring seafood up from the Delaware Bay to the New York city Market.

Once this line reached Red Bank, it ran due North, crossing the NY&LB on a diamond and ran to Port Monmouth where the cargo was put on boats to send it over to the City.

If you go to https://www.historicaerials.com/viewer and search for Red Bank, NJ and select the topo map from 1888, you will see this line going across the Shark River at a location further east of NJT's crossing (I don't see any remains of the bridge and piers they would have used but geographically, you can still find the rai cut/valley the ROW ran in south of Port Monmouth. If you look south of Red Bank, you will see the branch that ran due east out of Eatontown thru the Ft Monmouth area, past Monmouth Park (sometime after1920, Monmouth Park which previously was relocated on the edge of the Ft Monmouth area, was moved to it's current location off the NY&LB), and cross the NYL&B to serve Long Branch.

This is the origins of the trackage you were just discussing going through Oceanport

CNJ bought all of this later and abandoned the line north of Red Bank, staying with the NY&LB to run north.

#1563268 by CJPat
Sun Feb 14, 2021 3:04 pm

CJPat, Wiki Raritan and Delaware Bay Railroad. That is the original name. You are correct about the seafood, specifically oysters. The branch from Eatontown to Long Branch was for the tourist trade. At the time Long Branch was THE RESORT! It was the hangout for the rich, famous and well connected. Seven U.S. presidents vacationed there, one of them died there. (Garfield) That piece of track was very busy in its day. And it got to LB in 1860, 15 years before the NY&LB. The name changed to New Jersey Southern when it was re-organized after being forced into bankruptcy by the Camden and Atlantic. Taken over by Central of New Jersey around 1880 and operated as their Southern Division.

R&DB - Thanks for the correction. I didn't mean to snub your namesake. I was going by the name on the topo map, not realizing that they had had financial problems by then.

CJPat wrote: ↑Sun Feb 14, 2021 4:13 pm R&DB - Thanks for the correction. I didn't mean to snub your namesake. I was going by the name on the topo map, not realizing that they had had financial problems by then.

The history of the Southern is really interesting. If you have time, go to the library and see if you can take out "The Trail of the Blue Comet". Very interesting reading. Some of the interactions with the other railroads in NJ were strange and the State of NJ's actions didn't (and still don't) help. The reason the line even exists where it is, is because of politicians and two guys named Stevens and Stockton who now have colleges named for them. Can you say monopoly?

Torrey's plan was originally to build a system of multiple rail and ferry crossings all the way to Norfolk, VA. The NJ segment was to run from Port Monmouth to Cape May, where a ferry connection would continue the line south. His R&DB RR never reached the Delaware Bay, nor did it follow the intended route. Instead of building towards Cape May, it deviated west to Atsion, where it made a connection westward with Camden & Atlantic, violating a state-sanctioned monopoly on NYC-Philly traffic granted to the Camden & Amboy. While there is no proof, this was likely Torrey's intended plan, rather than the less lucrative moving of seafood from the Delaware Bay. This resulted in the legal battle mentioned above, which bankrupted the R&DB. The completion of the line to Bayside took place under the successor railroad, the NJS.