Childrens Museum Utica NY

I know of an outfit that could move this equipment if needed. They are based in Staten Island and they were the outfit that rigged and transported the MTA Alcos from Staten Island to upstate NY this year. I also use them for moving my Trackmobiles and my spare 38-D8 diesel engine that is a parts unit for my FM H12-44 Locomotive.
They are cheap, reliable, and can engineer the means to carry out a given move. I have used them since 2001.
PM me if you would like to contact them.

I would hate to see this equipment moved from the museum but if need be, let me know.

BTW, that caboose looks like an N4 with the cupola from an N8, or MORESO an N8 with N4 windows. I see it has the collision posts that would be found on the N8s. It looks too short to be an N8 though.
Whats its story?
The N8 is my favorite caboose.

Could you please forward a contact for these fellas to me?

I will need to move my CN caboose (only about 100 yards) some time next year, and the contractor I used to move it the first time has retired.

Thanks,

Gardiner Cross
Cripplebush Valley Models
"Great Looking Rocks, In Less Than A Million Years"
http://www.cripplebush.net

PS Good luck to anybody who takes on this project. I would love to get that passenger car, but I haven't even finished the work on the caboose yet.

My two cents worth of speculation on this: the museum either was warned of some sort of liability about having the equipment on site, or (more likely in my opinion) they want the space for something else.

Although my kids have now pretty much "aged out" of the target demographic of childrens' museums, I've been to enough of them to understand that there has been a shift from static to interactive exhibits, and rotating ones that move from venue to venue. Often with "underwriters"-- read sponsors, complete with highly conspicuous branding. For example, a local science center has a large billboard advertising "CSI: The Experience."

Old relics from a bygone method of transportation* have no place in this scheme-- or that's what I suspect selected individuals have been sold, er, told.

*Not necessarily the poster's opinion.

umtrr-author wrote:My two cents worth of speculation on this: the museum either was warned of some sort of liability about having the equipment on site, or (more likely in my opinion) they want the space for something else.

Although my kids have now pretty much "aged out" of the target demographic of childrens' museums, I've been to enough of them to understand that there has been a shift from static to interactive exhibits, and rotating ones that move from venue to venue. Often with "underwriters"-- read sponsors, complete with highly conspicuous branding. For example, a local science center has a large billboard advertising "CSI: The Experience."

Old relics from a bygone method of transportation* have no place in this scheme-- or that's what I suspect selected individuals have been sold, er, told.

*Not necessarily the poster's opinion.

I seemed to notice the same trend to. Many museums tend to rotate there items on display every few months or years. The thought is that if they have the same items over and over again people loose intrest in going to the museum. If you shack it up a bit and change the displays then people might just come back. I got a lot of WWII Military artfacts from Museum sales and Auctions in the former USSR becouse of the fast change of items that have been put into storage over the years and were in danger of seeing a land fill. The theam seems to be out with the old items and in with the new ones these days. This could be a sign of things to come. Maybe they will request a small operational Train layout next?

scharnhorst wrote: This could be a sign of things to come. Maybe they will request a small operational Train layout next?

They have one (or maybe two) layouts on one of the floors. They were donated, trains and all. It talks about them on their website mainpage. Just follow the link that says "Trains."

Here is the latest update from U&MV Chapter President Doug Preston dated October 2:

TO WHOM IT MAY CONCERN:
The Utica & Mohawk Valley Chapter, National Railway Historical Society anticipates immediate disposition of three items of historic rolling stock, now on outdoor display at the Children's Museum of History, Science & Technology, 311 Main Street, Utica, NY (next door west of Utica Union Station).

All are on panel track, not connected to active track, but adjacent to city streets and within 300 feet of a New York, Susquehanna & Western, a connection to CSX, and (across CSX) the Mohawk, Adirondack & Northern Railroads. The locomotive and diner share one panel truck; the caboose is on a second.

The U&MV Chapter will consider donating pieces to responsible non-profit organizations. Bids from private individuals or for-profit businesses are also welcome, but they should not anticipate donations of equipment. New owners will be responsible for removing the equipment as soon as possible, at their own expense.

1) ALCO RSC-2 (A1A-A1A) diesel road switcher, built in 1952 for Seaboard Air Line. Later Seaboard Coast Line, Florida Power & Light, Adirondack Railway (1979-80), and New York, Susquehanna & Western (for parts).
CONDITION: Not operable: traction motors and numerous engine parts removed by previous owner. Painted Adirondack Railway forest green and gold in Dupont Imron.

2) Budd stainless steel dining car, built in 1937 as Atchison, Topeka & Santa Fe 1479. In Amtrak service 1971-early '80s.
CONDITION: 73-year old body testifies to durability of Budd's patented "Shot-Weld" construction, but needs many fogged windows replaced. One truck and one draft gear not roadworthy. Small gas hot-air furnace installed and 110-volt entrance installed for museum display.

3) Pennsylvania Railroad steel cabin car (caboose) 477594, model N5e built at Altoona Shops in 1929. Said to be one-of-a-kind. Penn Central and Conrail until retired in mid-a980s.
CONDITION: Carbon steel body generally sound but needs body work, window work, and interior restoration. Painted and lettered PRR. No modern utilities installed.

SERIOUS INQUIRIES ONLY PLEASE, TO:
Utica & Mohawk Valley Chapter, NRHS
P.O. Box 257, Whitesboro, NY 13492

Anyone aware of any efforts to relocate this equipment?

An article (with photos) from this morning's Utica Observer-Dispatch:

"The historic train display that's been a landmark outside the Children's Museum for more than two decades might soon be on its way to a new home. A safety dispute brewing between museum leadership and the Utica Mohawk Valley Chapter of the National Railway Historical Society, which owns the display, has left it the subject of recent advertisements for new caretakers."

The link:

http://www.uticaod.com/features/x159496 ... ric-trains

Oh, now I see! The exhibit can stay if the trains are put in Plexiglass boxes! Why didn't they say so, I have a bunch right here! What scale were they again....

Mike

ut-1 wrote:A safety dispute brewing between museum leadership and the Utica Mohawk Valley Chapter of the National Railway Historical Society, which owns the display, has left it the subject of recent advertisements for new caretakers."

Unfortunately it looks like my two cents of speculation might be worth at least 2 1/2 cents. A safety issue? I'll bet someone got a nice consulting fee to tell them that... or perhaps some busybody got upset... or both.

I guess you can't be too careful.

It may have been something from their underwriters. Having such large objects that belong to a secondary organization on the Museum's property could be a liability issue.

Let's face it, if the ATSF BUDD lounge was on the North Side of the tracks instead of the south side it would be making regular trips on the line north to Thendara. Truck work is not a big deal. Nor are the windows. Amtrak refitted these cars with some sort of replacement windows that fogged like this. Someone will snap this car up as there is a demand for these stainless steel cars on tourist lines and for Private varnish.

The RSC-2 is scrappers fodder. The RSC-2 is a derailment prone model due to it's trucks. A lot of RSC-2 ended up running with their middle axles removed because of it. Parts for the 8223 might have been the best thing it has ever done.

As for the caboose. I am not sure what to think about it. it looks like a multitude of other PRR cabooses, and it sits in an New York Central area. Put simply, it's out of place.

The steamer sits on NYS&W track and is not on the Museum property.

The RSC2 also has a local history and there's no reason it can't be stuffed and mounted someplace else. The derailment issue is entirely debatable and there's no sense repeating that again. No reason it can't for the time being sit where the FL9s got cut up, at any rate.

The caboose is apparently a one-off and looks wierd compared to other PRR cabs, I always thought it was an N8 (the type turned into an end-cupola and reproduced by the thousands by Tyco) modified with smaller windows, but apparently not. And it's small enough it wouldn't kill you to haul it even if it had to go by truck.

lvrr325 wrote:The RSC2 also has a local history and there's no reason it can't be stuffed and mounted someplace else... No reason it can't for the time being sit where the FL9s got cut up, at any rate... And it's small enough it wouldn't kill you to haul it even if it had to go by truck.

Write a check and you can have the RSC2, an FL9 (you can have SIX FL9s!!), and the caboose. What's stopping everyone?

-otto-

Here is some more info on the PRR caboose.
http://www.hebners.net/cr/crn5AEF.html
Some sort of wreck rebuild that became the prototype for the N8 class. Someone should see if a museum down in PA would be interested in it.

I remember these three from my time I lived in the area. I stood on the Caboose and watched trains. Got up on the RSC-2 and looked around.

I have to admit I was always a little annoyed I never got to see the inside of the ATSF BUDD diner/lounge, but I was always kinda shocked that once the Adirondack Scenic started up that a way was not found to move the car over to the north side of the tracks for service.

These three have been an icon and a fixture in Utica for years, someone at the Museum needs to have thier brain examined. I mean your next to the train station.