Berkshire Flyer: Pittsfield - New York City Service via Albany

daybeers wrote: ↑Sat Jun 10, 2023 3:19 pm Yikes. Who would've predicted a train that isn't cheap and takes longer than driving while only having one run each direction once per weekend wouldn't do too well.

Maybe they should subsidize running more buses.

It makes a round trip every Friday and Sunday. Turns from AMT235 on Friday to AMT 1235 ALB/PIT return AMT 1234 PIT/ALB. Runs as AMT 1245 ALB/PIT return AMT1244 PIT/ALB and turns for AMT 244 on Sunday. AMT1234 and AMT1245 very rarely if ever have passengers. High counts of one or two. Sundays numbers are hard for me to get as I am normally busy working somewhere in the ALB yard.

I know families that have summer homes (west of Scranton, not in the Berkshires) where the family lives in Manhattan, but summers in Pennsylvania, and one of the parents commutes home to work for the week every other week. There's basically no traffic of that type on Saturdays but frequent traffic on Fridays (to PA) and Sundays (to NYC). I'd be surprised if the Berkshire Flyer's business isn't almost entirely a similar pattern.

RandallW wrote: ↑Sun Jun 11, 2023 12:18 pm I know families that have summer homes (west of Scranton, not in the Berkshires) where the family lives in Manhattan, but summers in Pennsylvania, and one of the parents commutes home to work for the week every other week. There's basically no traffic of that type on Saturdays but frequent traffic on Fridays (to PA) and Sundays (to NYC). I'd be surprised if the Berkshire Flyer's business isn't almost entirely a similar pattern.

With numbers like 27,29,17 I think to today coming back maybe 20. There isn't enough ridership to pay for the fuel let alone the crew.

Regular people don't know about this train in the Albany area at least, and to be fair it should go all the way to Boston., but you have to start somewhere.

Things are changing, the car-based US culture is dying. Trains like this will be more important in the future.

Railjunkie wrote: ↑Sun Jun 11, 2023 9:35 pm

RandallW wrote: ↑Sun Jun 11, 2023 12:18 pm I know families that have summer homes (west of Scranton, not in the Berkshires) where the family lives in Manhattan, but summers in Pennsylvania, and one of the parents commutes home to work for the week every other week. There's basically no traffic of that type on Saturdays but frequent traffic on Fridays (to PA) and Sundays (to NYC). I'd be surprised if the Berkshire Flyer's business isn't almost entirely a similar pattern.

With numbers like 27,29,17 I think to today coming back maybe 20. There isn't enough ridership to pay for the fuel let alone the crew.

Keep in mind that it's only June. The CapeFlyer, which has been running now for 10 years, has always had low ridership during June. (Maybe not this year though, with the $10 round-trip fare available this month).

Also keep in mind that the state (in this case Massachusetts) subsides the service just like the other state-supported Amtrak services.

Subsidizing service Albany-Pittsfield is designed to "balance" the subsidies to the MBTA in eastern MA, IMO

Train60 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 12, 2023 9:32 am

Railjunkie wrote: ↑Sun Jun 11, 2023 9:35 pm

RandallW wrote: ↑Sun Jun 11, 2023 12:18 pm I know families that have summer homes (west of Scranton, not in the Berkshires) where the family lives in Manhattan, but summers in Pennsylvania, and one of the parents commutes home to work for the week every other week. There's basically no traffic of that type on Saturdays but frequent traffic on Fridays (to PA) and Sundays (to NYC). I'd be surprised if the Berkshire Flyer's business isn't almost entirely a similar pattern.

With numbers like 27,29,17 I think to today coming back maybe 20. There isn't enough ridership to pay for the fuel let alone the crew.

Keep in mind that it's only June. The CapeFlyer, which has been running now for 10 years, has always had low ridership during June. (Maybe not this year though, with the $10 round-trip fare available this month).

Also keep in mind that the state (in this case Massachusetts) subsides the service just like the other state-supported Amtrak services.

Last nights train 27 to PIT Zero on the return. Same type numbers as last year, the high count for the train last year was its inaugural trip which still did not break 100. I work out of Albany and any work is good work but I also look at things and think WHY???. Which in the current state of Amtrak is a pretty common thought.

The logic for this train was the assumption of the ever choo choo enthusiastic ex state Sen. Hinds, that if you offer the service, the people will surely take advantage of this wonderful passenger train opportunity which will ultimately result in the need for multiple trains in this convoluted corridor. I believe that Amtrak agreed to go along with this "idea" primarily to make nice with Mass Dot , looking down the track to have the foot more firmly in the door for an inland operation through Springfield.

The reality of the situation from a traffic perspective, is that very few people who live in and around New York City have any interest in going to Pittsfield. And on the flip side of the coin, I don't think there's a ton of folks in Pittsfield dying to go to the big apple in the heat of summer either.

As a consequence of the reality track side, not a helluvah lot of butts in the seats. Maybe if they added a couple of sleepers and a RPO??

I think the tourist market is more on the Barrington, Lee, Lenox corridor, but that's a whole other horse that's well-tenderized at this point

I can just see the "Flyer" pulling into Canaan........

Last I checked (pre-covid) the Cape Flyer was not subsidized but was operationally profitable.
Not hard to imagine why: the train equipment and its maintenance are essentially free since it normally sits around all weekend anyway. Then you load up the train with hundreds of $20 fares - not hard to pay the fuel and crew for two hours run.

Lol oh yeah, Manhattan-ites are just clamoring for some Stateline Pizza and to use the ATM at Salisbury Bank

I was thinking more Kent, Barrington, and Stockbridge, places where weekenders congregate already that could offer true car-free or car-limited things to do and places to stay. Kent has good cafes, food, and places to shop. Barrington has a very bustling downtown with great shopping. The Red Lion Inn offers higher-end accommodation in Stockbridge.

As a commuter corridor, the B&A has potential. As a tourist destination for the wealthy of NYC, not so much.

Mr. Naugy, we know that the Commonwealth of Tax spent some of their namesake $$$ to fix up the New Haven Berkshire Division Pittsfield-Canaan. This so a rail dependent industry there, medical device maker Becton Dixon, could have reliable rail service (plastic pellets moving by rail). Since the Commonwealth is at present passenger train crazy, and the New Haven is along many a tourist attraction in Western MA. they just might try to put one on.

But Kent? that's thirty miles North of Danbury and fifty miles South of Pittsfield, and from being out there to observe my School's, SKS, Centenary last weekend, you wouldn't want to be on a passenger train over what I observed of the Berkshire Div. Besides, CT has other places to put their rail allocated tax $$$ than over that now sick excuse of a railroad.

Unfortunately given CT is cutting its rail budget the idea of any new service, even the “gimmies”, is unlikely.

"Oh I hear a train go by every day, and in the Winter, I can see it".

Judging from where this gal's office (she's on SKS's administrative staff - sure has grown since "back in my day") is located, that is a fair statement. Of course, unknown to her is what does this train haul, how many cars, what kind of engines - all of which means unknown to me.

Now I must acknowledge that I didn't see too much of "Housy" this trip. This is simply because Bulls Bridge Road that X's the HRR @ South Kent (and is the School's main entrance) was passable but reduced to gravel. My buggy does not like graveled roads, so I entered and exited campus over a back entry. "Wits-End", I knew of - and stayed off the gravel. My one view was X-ing at Bridge Street in New Milford what I noted makes me wonder how this "sub-FRA Class 1" excuse of a railroad has avoided simply being embargoed.

Yes, I realize this posting probably should have been a Private Message to both Messrs. Moore and Naugy, but I thank all others for bearing with.