ALP-45DP's - Usage and Delivery

Jtgshu wrote:well look at that, they weren't the 451X and 451X - i read that as if they were being delivered on center street.....my bad

I wonder if they are testing them MU'ed now. That could be interesting. One go into diesel mode, the other go into electric mode hahaha

Its okay JT, they were most definitely not on Center Street.. that I know is up much higher in the yard, and if one was on Center Street Ken would likely have beaten me to reporting it by several hours. yeah I was wondering myself why they were coupled up, wouldnt that be a bit of a waste to test them like that in seperate modes? Maybe its compatibility testing amongst themselves?

Two AEM-7 units can not provide HEP from both units. One AC reman or HHP can provide a single 1000kW hep which is more than enough for 12 amfleets. Two units are usually used to keep time but one AC or one HHP can pull the whole train. A DC due to age, is limited to 8 cars and only provides about 500kW HEP. They used to be able to double up HEP on the DC units but due to problems with the cards and maintenance of the sync system most of the cards have been removed/disabled.

morris&essex4ever wrote:

25Hz wrote:

sixty-six wrote:

25Hz wrote:

michaelk wrote:I'd love that but someone (Cruiser i think) pointed out that a NEC train is pretty big (could be like 8-10 cars?) and a typical Raritan Valley Line train is relatively much smaller (more like 5?). So they couldn't likely be able to get everyone off a NEC train to transfer to a RVL train to make that work. I'm pretty sure those of us who use the RVL are hosed for the foreseeable future with the possible exception of a midday or weekend train here or there.

RVL trains are typically 6 and sometimes 5 or 7 cars. The dual modes and the alp46a have enough HEP for 12 multilevels, but i'm not sure if or when regular 12 car trains will run in service. Perhaps someone (cruiser?) could enlighten us.

You sure about that?

As i've been on a 12 car train hauled by a 46, yes. This was back when 44's were still in service - the train was broken in 2 at morrisville to give a 5 car train to a 44 and 7 cars stayed with the 46, this was confirmed by me noting the car numbers, had to wait at trenton for 3 hours and i saw both leave for nyp.

Also in various njt pdf's it is noted that the newer locomotives (45 & 46a) had the head end power for 12 multilevels. If this was changed i wasn't aware.

12 car train hauled by a single 46? All I recall is some 12 car trains running with 2 46's on the Totally Badass Supercruisers. The ALP 45's will not be run with 12 ML's.

Yes, i was surprised too. We had no problems getting up to speed or spotting at stations, whomever the engineer was knew how to work that loco. I believe the heat/AC was cut out on several cars (broken?) and 2 cars were open but dark, no indicator signs nothing. On the 2 trains eastbound all cars were fully lit. There were at least 3 cab cars, one was hooked directly to the loco, on the 46's train eastbound it had 2 cab cars, one still hooked to the loco.

All well and good; isn't the topic 45's, not 46's?

My point is that while we may not see 12 car MVL trains in regular day to day service, both the new loco models are capable of powering such trains solo according to numerous spec pdf's and at least one press release that i've seen.

I would need to see official njt evidence to the contrary to convince me otherwise if this was indeed changed. And, the 45 being one of the heavier locos out there it should have no problem with tractive effort both starting and braking.

Yesterday at TransAction 2012 in Atlantic City, there was a session on the ALP45-DP in which a gentleman from Foley presented on the Caterpillar prime mover and a gentleman from Bombardier presented on the locomotive. Both were very good presentations full of very useful and detailed facts about the units. A few interesting tidbits that I learned are:

i. The Montreal derailment was not caused by the locomotive but by a track defect. The report is to be released officially within the next couple of days.

ii. NJT has 8 ALP45-DPs on property.

iii. The Pueblo tests have been completed successfully. In those tests the units were tested in e-Mode at upto 125mph.

iv. NJT is likely to introduce them in commercial service in late summer, most likely on the Montclair-Boonton Line. This last piece of information from an NJT gentleman in the session on "How does NJT Compare with other Transit Agencies" which was moderated by the Editor in Chief of Railway Age.

Jishnu wrote:Yesterday at TransAction 2012 in Atlantic City, there was a session on the ALP45-DP in which a gentleman from Foley presented on the Caterpillar prime mover and a gentleman from Bombardier presented on the locomotive. Both were very good presentations full of very useful and detailed facts about the units. A few interesting tidbits that I learned are:

i. The Montreal derailment was not caused by the locomotive but by a track defect. The report is to be released officially within the next couple of days.

ii. NJT has 8 ALP45-DPs on property.

iii. The Pueblo tests have been completed successfully. In those tests the units were tested in e-Mode at upto 125mph.

iv. NJT is likely to introduce them in commercial service in late summer, most likely on the Montclair-Boonton Line. This last piece of information from an NJT gentleman in the session on "How does NJT Compare with other Transit Agencies" which was moderated by the Editor in Chief of Railway Age.

No mention of the voiding of the warranties because the engines arent being allowed to heat up before operating them in diesel mode? LOL

It hit me the other day that this is why any other dual mode diesel operating railroad only uses them in electric when its absolutely impossible to use the diesel. Once a diesel block goes below operating temp its not happy, and wont load correctly.

ApproachMedium wrote:

Jishnu wrote:Yesterday at TransAction 2012 in Atlantic City, there was a session on the ALP45-DP in which a gentleman from Foley presented on the Caterpillar prime mover and a gentleman from Bombardier presented on the locomotive. Both were very good presentations full of very useful and detailed facts about the units. A few interesting tidbits that I learned are:

i. The Montreal derailment was not caused by the locomotive but by a track defect. The report is to be released officially within the next couple of days.

ii. NJT has 8 ALP45-DPs on property.

iii. The Pueblo tests have been completed successfully. In those tests the units were tested in e-Mode at upto 125mph.

iv. NJT is likely to introduce them in commercial service in late summer, most likely on the Montclair-Boonton Line. This last piece of information from an NJT gentleman in the session on "How does NJT Compare with other Transit Agencies" which was moderated by the Editor in Chief of Railway Age.

No mention of the voiding of the warranties because the engines arent being allowed to heat up before operating them in diesel mode? LOL

It hit me the other day that this is why any other dual mode diesel operating railroad only uses them in electric when its absolutely impossible to use the diesel. Once a diesel block goes below operating temp its not happy, and wont load correctly.

the computer won't let it load at full power until it is warmed up enough. It keeps the main circuit breaker open until all parameters are met. There are hotstart systems on both diesel engines to keep the blocks and fluids up to operating temperature while running in Electric mode, so when they are ready to start running in diesel mode, they are good to go.

I think the warranty issue you are alluding to is another issue, but has nothing to do with them starting up cold and being run under load, that I know of at least.

No im not getting into it here

both P32acdm and Alp45dp have kim hot start systems that are suppose to keep oil and water above 150 degrees.

Latest news from MMC tour:

-12 are on property, one more is due this week
-Highest number I saw is 4510
-Initial service will be Port Morris-Hoboken, further expansion is anyone's guess
-Instrumented wheelset testing currently ongoing to ensure no Montreal-like derailments occur here.

Amtrak7 wrote:Latest news from MMC tour:

-12 are on property, one more is due this week
-Highest number I saw is 4510
-Initial service will be Port Morris-Hoboken, further expansion is anyone's guess
-Instrumented wheelset testing currently ongoing to ensure no Montreal-like derailments occur here.

Right. The gentleman from NJT Capital Programs at the NJ-ARP meeting yesterday said that 8 have been accepted and there are a few more on property awaiting completion of acceptance tests.

He confirmed that the AMT derailment in Montreal has been determined to be track problem and not locomotive problem by the Canadian equivalent of FRA.

He also said there will be none operated commercially in the Newark Division initially for may be upto a year. So my surmise is that any through running of RVL or NJCL Bay Head train to Penn Station is at least a year or more away.

Also the additional 10 that were due are now only 9 because the exchange rate between Dollars and Euros changed enough to reduce the number by one.

Jishnu wrote:.....

Also the additional 10 that were due are now only 9 because the exchange rate between Dollars and Euros changed enough to reduce the number by one.

that's an interesting tidbit- I am surprised the contract wasn't locked in to dollar prices at the time of the sale- at least for the initial order. I just assumed (i know i know!) that such a large sale would be based on dollars. Apparently airbus - also European but selling marge larger ticket items so much more to lose- only switched from selling in dollars to euros this past fall.

michaelk wrote:

Jishnu wrote:.....

Also the additional 10 that were due are now only 9 because the exchange rate between Dollars and Euros changed enough to reduce the number by one.

that's an interesting tidbit- I am surprised the contract wasn't locked in to dollar prices at the time of the sale- at least for the initial order. I just assumed (i know i know!) that such a large sale would be based on dollars. Apparently airbus - also European but selling marge larger ticket items so much more to lose- only switched from selling in dollars to euros this past fall.

Is there an online source confirming this so that Wiki can be updated without the mods complaining that there is no source?

jp1822 wrote:So now that a unit has been delivered, taken out for a test run or two (or three etc.), and we have 114 pages of postings on the topic, where will these locomotives be used and when? I would think their usage and delivery would make the most sense if the travelled on a rail line where they could use both types of power sources - electric and diesel. Although this narrows it down to a few lines, the question still remains, WHERE will NJT assign the units and WHEN?

You really haven't read back too much huh? We've gone over where they will be deployed ad nauseum.

CNJGeep wrote:Coast Line was talking to a test train earlier...not sure if it was a DP or not.

That's a quality update right there.