Trolleys Running In Pairs

In the last couple of weeks, I've noticed Kawasakis on the 101 and 102 and the cars on the route 100 lines running in coupled pairs. Perhaps this is normal and I've only noticed because I've been around 69th Street more often lately. I don't ride the trolleys very often.

Are the cars basically running as MUs or is that some kind of ferry mode with the trailing car not in revenue service? Does the motorman have control of brakes and motors on the trailing car? Is this a way to run Kawasakis as a higher capacity light rail system?

HangarRat wrote:In the last couple of weeks, I've noticed Kawasakis on the 101 and 102 and the cars on the route 100 lines running in coupled pairs. Perhaps this is normal and I've only noticed because I've been around 69th Street more often lately. I don't ride the trolleys very often.

Are the cars basically running as MUs or is that some kind of ferry mode with the trailing car not in revenue service? Does the motorman have control of brakes and motors on the trailing car? Is this a way to run Kawasakis as a higher capacity light rail system?

They was designed to do that from the get-go but Red Arrow hasn't been doing that as of late because that second car could be used on a extra. The Media-Sharon Hill will do it more, and has several runs seheduled like that because of the schoolkids.

As for how they work, its your standard MU setup with two operators, one in the lead controlling the train and taking fares and one in the other car just taking fares, but will run the train from his car heading back in. The Subway-Surface Single Enders are also designed to operate MUed but normally don't because of the massive length of the coupler hookups and (as of late) they cannot operate into the subway - can't be detected by the CBTC. Nowadays if you see a MU coming down Woodland or Elmwood, its OOS.

The Metrorail Gold Line and Blue line normally operate with two "trolleys" in tandem, all operated by one person. The streetcar lines in the metropolitan Los Angeles area are growing and becoming more and more a necessity. When Angels Flight starts running again, all will be back to normal.

pennsy wrote:The Metrorail Gold Line and Blue line normally operate with two "trolleys" in tandem, all operated by one person. The streetcar lines in the metropolitan Los Angeles area are growing and becoming more and more a necessity. When Angels Flight starts running again, all will be back to normal.

Was that comment about Angels Flight jocular, or is there an actual date being given out for a resumption of service? When I was in L. A. last October I saw the two cars mounted on a flatcar in the former Santa Fe First St. yard looking really good, like they were just coming back from wherever they were rehabbed and ready to go into service. Is there any reliable information about a resumption of service?

About as reliable as the Welbourne company can be. Both Sinai and Olivet are back on their tracks at Angels Flight, and the new cable has been attached, plus some new saftey measures. I have been told by the people next door that tests are being run on the system and the cars. Once approval has been given, and certification approved, it will be open to the public once again. We will have to wait and see how long that takes.

Running two car trains on the former Red Arrow trolley lines is really nothing new. In the "heyday" of the Red Arrow trolley lines ( when all four of the original lines were still operating) two car trains were frequent, especially during peak periods. Of the 1920's-1940's era cars ( The Center Door Cars, Brill Lightweights, Brilliners, and St Louis Cars) only the Center Door Cars and the St. Louis cars could be run in tandem, and they often were. The Brilliners and Lightweights could not be run as anything but single units. The trail car in those older two car units could be controlled from the lead car, however they usually carried a second operator to operate the doors and collect fares on the trail car.

The bustitution of the West Chester Line ( in 1954) and the Ardmore Line ( in 1966) reduced the frequency of two car trains on the entire system, though the actual reason was probably a decrease in transit usage, generally, that occurred at that time.

pennsy wrote:The Metrorail Gold Line and Blue line normally operate with two "trolleys" in tandem, all operated by one person. The streetcar lines in the metropolitan Los Angeles area are growing and becoming more and more a necessity. When Angels Flight starts running again, all will be back to normal.

I've always been impressed that the post 1970's new light rail systems, San Diego Edmonton Calgary etc..., not only have long articulated cars, but usually run minimum 2 car trains, at least on weekdays. Buffalo's equipment's not articulated, but they are the longest non-articulated light rail cars in North America, and Buffalo does regularly run multi car trains.
Most of the cities that retained their light rail and streetcars also use articulated cars, Philly and New Orleans are the only ones that use non-articulated cars, and as mentioned in this thread, Philly city usually runs them as single cars, Philly's suburban or Red Arrow division had and still does run 2 car trains, but usually only rush hours, and usually not every trip.

Going across to NJTransit's Riverline, I haven't counted cars and done the math, but my understanding is that they do not have enough equipment to run 2 car trains on all trips during 15 minute headways. I'm not sure if they have enough equipment for 2 car trains on all trips during 30 minute headways, but I have been on and seen from the street some of those 30 minute headway trips that could have used 2 cars but had only 1.

I'm sure other railfans and transit profesionals have noticed civilians' tendency to call an articulated car a 2 car train.

pennsy wrote:About as reliable as the Welbourne company can be. Both Sinai and Olivet are back on their tracks at Angels Flight, and the new cable has been attached, plus some new saftey measures. I have been told by the people next door that tests are being run on the system and the cars. One approval has been given, and certification approved, it will be open to the public once again. We will have to wait and see how long that takes.

Thanks--that's the first hard information I've been able to get for lo these many years.

Two-car operation at peak hours has been the norm on the P&W for many years. It requires the operators to do some pretty precise spotting at some stations so the front doors of both cars are accessible. If you have a chance, check out the rehabbed Gulph Mills station some morning or late afternoon.

Intentional P&W operation with more than 2 cars is pretty rare. There's a picture in one of Ron DeGraw's books of a 3-car Bullet consist headed over the bridge to Norristown but that was very unusual. It's a real stretch but you could try to claim there were 4-car trains when a CTA married pair would break down and have to be towed/pushed by another set.

JeffK wrote:Two-car operation at peak hours has been the norm on the P&W for many years. It requires the operators to do some pretty precise spotting at some stations so the front doors of both cars are accessible. If you have a chance, check out the rehabbed Gulph Mills station some morning or late afternoon.

Intentional P&W operation with more than 2 cars is pretty rare. There's a picture in one of Ron DeGraw's books of a 3-car Bullet consist headed over the bridge to Norristown but that was very unusual. It's a real stretch but you could try to claim there were 4-car trains when a CTA married pair would break down and have to be towed/pushed by another set.

I've seen pictures of the 3 car Bullet Car train (one was by the Conshohocken Road Station), but I didn't realize it was very unusual for that to happen. Interestingly enough, I have a post card from the Transit Museum store that features a 4 car CTA train running on the Limited service at the former Norristown Stop at Main & Swede Streets.

As for Gulph Mills, did they lengthen the platform so that it's much easier to have two-car train operation? I remember that back in the day, for the first door of the rear car to platform, the operator had to pull up to the very edge of the platform, where only half of the first door of the first car would be useable.

HangarRat wrote:In the last couple of weeks, I've noticed Kawasakis on the 101 and 102 and the cars on the route 100 lines running in coupled pairs.

Only in the last couple of weeks?

Could this be pressure on the part of Springfield and other outlying towns to not have so many consists bringing down the crossing gates during rush hours?

I would consider a good compromise for road and rail operations to be an average of no more than one consist every 4 minutes, or an 8 minute headway each direction during rush hours. Running two car trains may well satisfy this. This may pave the way (no bustitution pun intended) to putting in more trolley priority traffic signals.

Tritransit Area wrote:I've seen pictures of the 3 car Bullet Car train (one was by the Conshohocken Road Station), but I didn't realize it was very unusual for that to happen.

The major reason was that a 3-car train simply couldn't fit at most platforms without being stopped once, for the front car/cars and then moved forward for the rear cars/car (note order of plurals )

Interestingly enough, I have a post card from the Transit Museum store that features a 4 car CTA train running on the Limited service at the former Norristown Stop at Main & Swede Streets.

Definitely interesting. I rode the CTAs at peak hours and the only time I ever saw a 4-car consist was as a result of a breakdown. Spotting of course was not a problem as the CTAs had passthru doors.

As for Gulph Mills, did they lengthen the platform so that it's much easier to have two-car train operation? I remember that back in the day, for the first door of the rear car to platform, the operator had to pull up to the very edge of the platform, where only half of the first door of the first car would be useable.

Gulph Mills has been entirely rebuilt. The old station was, to put it bluntly, pretty pathetic esp. given the high passenger volume there. It took years, and the intervention of then-Rep. Connie Williams, to get SEPTA to take any action at all to improve conditions that left a lot of people out in the rain and snow, not to mention slogging through water up to their ankles in the tunnel under the station embankment. I haven't used the new station yet but it appears to have enough space to hold everyone, plus having far better lighting.

Ah, the new Gulph Mills Station is certainly nice. I used it occasionally, particularly when coming from the 124 to connect with a train to my bus at Norristown.

I can certainly attest to the conditions of the old Gulph Mills Station. Back when I used to use the 95 bus regularly, I had to use the station all of the time. There were essentially no walkways, and the underpass basically was just a driveway full of rocks. You had a lone bench outside of the bus shelter. The 124/125 buses that were heading to the city boarded from the streetside, which had no curb or sidewalk either.

All I can say is that the new station is certainly welcome...but why not just call it an intermodal Transportation Center?

Because there's no reason to use a long phrase when a diminutive one will suffice

Tritransit Area wrote:

JeffK wrote:Two-car operation at peak hours has been the norm on the P&W for many years. It requires the operators to do some pretty precise spotting at some stations so the front doors of both cars are accessible. If you have a chance, check out the rehabbed Gulph Mills station some morning or late afternoon.

Intentional P&W operation with more than 2 cars is pretty rare. There's a picture in one of Ron DeGraw's books of a 3-car Bullet consist headed over the bridge to Norristown but that was very unusual. It's a real stretch but you could try to claim there were 4-car trains when a CTA married pair would break down and have to be towed/pushed by another set.

I've seen pictures of the 3 car Bullet Car train (one was by the Conshohocken Road Station), but I didn't realize it was very unusual for that to happen. Interestingly enough, I have a post card from the Transit Museum store that features a 4 car CTA train running on the Limited service at the former Norristown Stop at Main & Swede Streets.

As for Gulph Mills, did they lengthen the platform so that it's much easier to have two-car train operation? I remember that back in the day, for the first door of the rear car to platform, the operator had to pull up to the very edge of the platform, where only half of the first door of the first car would be useable.

3 car revenue service on the P&W is/was impossible only because of station length.... Any pictures of 3 car trains are most likely rail-fan excersions.