The decline of sleeper trains

On a sleeper train trip lasting only one night, much of the travel time flies while the customers are under the covers.

For example, there currently seem to be no sleeper trains that cross the US-Canadian border? Are sleeper trains now less common in North America than they used to be?

And I am asking about real sleeper services, with bedrooms on the trains.

Myrtone wrote: ↑Sat Oct 07, 2023 8:06 am On a sleeper train trip lasting only one night, much of the travel time flies while the customers are under the covers.

For example, there currently seem to be no sleeper trains that cross the US-Canadian border? Are sleeper trains now less common in North America than they used to be?

And I am asking about real sleeper services, with bedrooms on the trains.

Every type of intercity passenger train have far less service than there used to be from passenger trains heydays (WW2 era).

The jet age msde it possible to convert what used to be overnight trips into one-day out-and-back trips, and many countries developed high-speed rail systems to compete, greatly diminishing the market for sleeping car travel.

But planes do not travel between city centres, intercity trains do. Also, if travelling by sleeper train, the traveller can spend more of a day in the destination city than if going there and back in a day by plane.
Aircraft passengers need to queue through security and pick up baggage and plane occupants have to wear a seat belt unless they really must get up out of their seats, train occupants do not.

For trips not longer than the duration of one night, sleeper trains are a better alternative to planes and maybe even high speed trains.

Apparently a lot of travelers are willing to get up at an ungodly hour to spend the next night in their own bed, or maybe they just hate packing and carrying a suitcase. As an American news broadcaster used to say, "and that's the way it is."

ExCon90 wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 8:21 pm Apparently a lot of travelers are willing to get up at an ungodly hour to spend the next night in their own bed, or maybe they just hate packing and carrying a suitcase. As an American news broadcaster used to say, "and that's the way it is."

This.

I traveled quite a bit on business over a 15 year period, and there are two factors here....

First, from a corporate travel/expense perspective, staying in a hotel was only authorized on one of the following cases:

• it was impossible to get to the start of the meeting in time
• there were meetings on consecutive days
• international travel where flights were limited

Policy dictated being on the first plane home after the meeting unless we were taking a vacation day and footing our own expenses...

Second, from a family perspective.... anyone with a spouse/partner, kids and/or dogs is going to want leave at the last possible time and be home at the earliest possible time.

Maybe in a day and age where men worked and women stayed home, it was more acceptable for what's a day trip today to be two overnights. That ship sailed long ago.

Myrtone wrote: ↑Sun Oct 08, 2023 10:33 pm Aircraft passengers need to queue through security and pick up baggage

I'm of the opinion that it will only take one particularly deadly event to see the security posture for Amtrak change to what is now commonplace for air travel...

We've seen mass shootings on public transit as well as two shooting fatalities on I know of Amtrak trains (the Tucson incident with the DEA and one in Missouri) in recent times. Won't really matter how impractical that might be in practice if Congress is pushed by public outcry to take action or an Executive Order gets issued.

I am not following you.

eolesen wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 10:00 pm We've seen mass shootings on public transit as well as two shooting fatalities on I know of Amtrak trains.

Even so shootings on transit are much rarer than school shootings and workplace shootings. The most notable
was the LIRR shooting at Merillon Avenue in 1993.

Myrtone wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 11:50 pm I am not following you.

The freedom to board without passing thru security or baggage screening is a very fragile benefit.

If screening happens, you can watch for checked baggage to make a comeback.

Whether or not that has an impact on sleepers is arguable, but it would put things on a leveler playing field with air travel, and negate some of that time benefit.

Personally, I'm fine with the security vs. free flow trade-off. I'd much rather get the travel out of the way quickly so I can sleep a few more hours in a real bed and eat at a real restaurant.

When was the last time there was a sleeper service that crossed the US-Canadian border?

So in that case did passengers of the Montrealer get woken up at the border to present passports and go through customs?

eolesen wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 9:22 pm

ExCon90 wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 8:21 pm Apparently a lot of travelers are willing to get up at an ungodly hour to spend the next night in their own bed, or maybe they just hate packing and carrying a suitcase. As an American news broadcaster used to say, "and that's the way it is."

This.

I traveled quite a bit on business over a 15 year period, and there are two factors here....

First, from a corporate travel/expense perspective, staying in a hotel was only authorized on one of the following cases:

• it was impossible to get to the start of the meeting in time
• there were meetings on consecutive days
• international travel where flights were limited

Policy dictated being on the first plane home after the meeting unless we were taking a vacation day and footing our own expenses...

Second, from a family perspective.... anyone with a spouse/partner, kids and/or dogs is going to want leave at the last possible time and be home at the earliest possible time.

Maybe in a day and age where men worked and women stayed home, it was more acceptable for what's a day trip today to be two overnights. That ship sailed long ago.

Two additional factors from my business meeting experience. A majority of the meetings were held in the meeting facilities of a hotel at a major airport, there was no need to get to city center or anywhere else. A second factor was the frequent flyer miles accumulated from the business trips could be used for vacations at destinations not served by trains and arrival in a few hours versus day or two spent on the train rather than on the beach.

eolesen wrote: ↑Tue Oct 10, 2023 10:55 am

Myrtone wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 11:50 pm I am not following you.

The freedom to board without passing thru security or baggage screening is a very fragile benefit.

If screening happens, you can watch for checked baggage to make a comeback.

Whether or not that has an impact on sleepers is arguable, but it would put things on a leveler playing field with air travel, and negate some of that time benefit.

Personally, I'm fine with the security vs. free flow trade-off. I'd much rather get the travel out of the way quickly so I can sleep a few more hours in a real bed and eat at a real restaurant.

For my fellow workers who traveled a lot on business the company paid for the background investigation for pre-clearance which resulted in minimal time in security lines, often less than 5 minutes.