SWS/HC downtown terminal relocations...

Metra has already announced its long-term plans to move its SWS trains from Union Station to LaSalle St. It's also possible to move the HC trains there too, but perhaps a better idea would be to send them all the way east to Millenium (Randolph St.) station. Going northward, the CNIC freight mains currently cross over in a tunnel above MED trackage from east to west around McCormick Place, then begins to curve westward about 1/2 mi north, in the vicinity of 16th and Indiana. There is a small parcel of undeveloped land in this area, which could be feasible enough to build a short, one-track flyover going northward toward the two southbound tracks of the MED. The single track would extend to about 14th St. or so, where an interlocking could be built for it to join the MED tracks.

The greatest benefits to both proposals include better downtown distribution of Metra commuters. It's ironic that both LaSalle St. and Millenium station are much more centrally located downtown, and have greater potential to serve more Metra commuters, but only two routes (well, three, if you count the South Shore) currently terminate there. By contrast, CUS/OTC are home to Metra's other nine routes, but many commuters after detraining have to take a bus, train, or taxi to go toward State St., or Michigan Ave. Unless they travel during rush hour, when they can use the CTA link-up sticker, it's still an additional cost to many people, particualrly off-peak riders, but the extra travel time affects everyone. Even though we're only talking about a maximum of 36 trains being diverted, at least those trains will have improved downtown distribution of its commuters, while simultaneously easing the congestion at CUS...

There is space in the south concourse at Randolph - however we would need to build new tracks and lo-platforms, which would be quasi-useful for CSS trains as well if they were wired. And that little space where a northbound flyover could be built, we guess what used to be there? A northbound flyover - it was for freight traffic going from congress street yard and the van buren pig ramp to the west. (Yes, until 1969 there was a TOFC ramp under the art institute).

The problem: Supposedly the city is trying to get CN to turn over SCAL for development. CN wants something in return, and the city says "what can we give you?" Word has it now there is going to be a junction at Grand Crossing installed so all CN-based Amtraks can get to CUS and all CN-based freights can get to more northern terminals around Chicago. At that point SCAL will be abandoned. Maybe when SES is instituted this will allow SES trains to use Randolph rather than CUS, by going from UP to IC at Grand. I once rode the Cardinal up this UP alignment and it sucked - super slow. I would hope the SES is put on Metra for a quicker trip downtown.

Tadman wrote:There is space in the south concourse at Randolph - however we would need to build new tracks and lo-platforms, which would be quasi-useful for CSS trains as well if they were wired. And that little space where a northbound flyover could be built, we guess what used to be there? A northbound flyover - it was for freight traffic going from congress street yard and the van buren pig ramp to the west. (Yes, until 1969 there was a TOFC ramp under the art institute)

Interesting, didn't know that. Thanks for the historical reference...

Tadman wrote:The problem: Supposedly the city is trying to get CN to turn over SCAL for development. CN wants something in return, and the city says "what can we give you?" Word has it now there is going to be a junction at Grand Crossing installed so all CN-based Amtraks can get to CUS and all CN-based freights can get to more northern terminals around Chicago. At that point SCAL will be abandoned. Maybe when SES is instituted this will allow SES trains to use Randolph rather than CUS, by going from UP to IC at Grand. I once rode the Cardinal up this UP alignment and it sucked - super slow. I would hope the SES is put on Metra for a quicker trip downtown.

Actually, the proposed Grand Crossing connection involves a link to NS's Chicago line (ex-Conrail/PRR/Valpo dummy) that runs paralell to the Chicago Skyway between here and Indiana, and it crosses over the CNIC/MED tracks around 75th St; this would be the connection used by Amtrak trains to/from CUS, and some CN freights as well. Meanwhile, Metra initially plans to run SES out of LaSalle St, connecting it to RI via a current CRL (Chicago Rail Link) connection running between Gresham and the UP/CSX diamonds approx. 1/2 mile east.

It's no secret that many railroads are continuing to learn difficult, and expensive lessons about ripping up capacity only to regret it later on when there's a spike in traffic volume, and some roads eventually wind up spending more money to lay down brand-new trackage in areas that were only recently abandoned in some cases. With this in mind, I've heard about the deal the City of Chicago is trying to make with CN regarding the SCAL, but I hope it doesn't go through, because I believe it could still serve as a useful Metra link to both LaSalle St. and (perhaps) Millenium stations, especially in times of emergencies that would necessitate temporary re-routing of certain trains. Granted, some excess capacity should be eliminated, but this isn't one of them; we're aren't talking about the overbuilt networks of 30 or 40 years ago anymore...

Another issue of Randolph St Station is ventilation. When the south shore used a diesel set, it was still an open station. Now that it's been covered by the park, I'm not sure it could handle of bunch of idling diesels.

I am personally curious to see what Metra will propose when they have public hearings about moving SWS over to LaSalle. SWS commuters who have never used RI before can expect a nice surprise when their train pulls into a station with no restaurants or convenient stores. Connecting transportation is also very minimal at LaSalle.

I wonder if Metra ever considered making LaSalle Street station larger by enclosing the east and west exists and the empty concourse space between the current station and the tracks.

metraRI wrote:SWS commuters who have never used RI before can expect a nice surprise when their train pulls into a station with no restaurants or convenient stores.

Not to mention horribly unclean bathrooms. The status quo from Orland Park and New Lenox will love it.

metraRI wrote:Connecting transportation is also very minimal at LaSalle.

Well, not really. A one-block walk north yields some crosstown and uptown bus routes, and the blue line is across the street. I've used it to go from Blue Island to O'Hare. True, these options require going outdoors, but it's a very short walk.

Don't forget the L, with orange, brown, purple, pink (green via transfer) lines is right out front. I used to ride the brown downtown and grab an RI train out - it was easy provided I wasn't too hungover... but that's another story (I missed three trains that day).

metraRI wrote:I am personally curious to see what Metra will propose when they have public hearings about moving SWS over to LaSalle. SWS commuters who have never used RI before can expect a nice surprise when their train pulls into a station with no restaurants or convenient stores. Connecting transportation is also very minimal at LaSalle.

I am a SWS rider and I wont like the move at all, but what can I do when it happens I just got to get use to it when it happens.

Also I am bet that at least 50% and up wont like that the line is moving to La Salle(When it happens), and probally that most will be shocked that LaSalle is just a little Terminal, and not even half the size of Union Station(if they never been through La Salle St).

Also they will see that the restrooms are not propley cleaned, or stink, the ticket office is not open for all of the train departures, and that the resturants closes early, and most don't open at all on weekends.

Hey it is closer to State st., the all of the L lines(execpt green line) is right next to the station.

People will be saying why metra moved that line into LaSalle St. When Metra do have public hearings for the SWS I will try to go to them.

I don't really understand why Metra wants to move SWS to LaSalle to begin with. The move won't really reduce the travel time unless they are going to have a high speed connector between RI and SWS. SWS will also still pass through Forest Hill, where most of the delays on SWS occur.

metraRI wrote:I don't really understand why Metra wants to move SWS to LaSalle to begin with. The move won't really reduce the travel time unless they are going to have a high speed connector between RI and SWS. SWS will also still pass through Forest Hill, where most of the delays on SWS occur.

I haven't seen their master plan, but could it be that they'd like to expand Heritage Corridor serivce? I haven't a clue how much demand there would be; just a thought I had.

I have not seen what Metra's idea is either... I know there are some plans out there, but no idea how accurate they are. Metra has really kept HC expansion on the down-low. There has been talk about adding more stations, one in either Romeoville or Justice, I forget which one. I have heard about plans in the past, however they have not gotten any further than paper.

A possible reason why Metra wants SWS out of CUS is to free up those slots for more Burlington trains, which theoretically could allow them to cut/add equipment for some trains in the terminal. For example, a couple of 10 or 11 car Naperville expresses from the AM rush could be cut to 5 or 6 cars for midday runs, then added again for the evening rush. I think Metra does this already with one set, but the only difference in this case would be that no moves would be necessary to/from 14th St. yard in between. So, fewer equipment moves for Burlington trains, with SWS out of the picture, should mean less congestion and improved traffic flow, especially during rush hours. Just my opinion...

I haven't heard much about Metra's long-term plans for HC either, there haven't been any studies done that I'm aware of, so I guess it's just talk for now...

Regarding moving HC into Randolph St. (old names die hard for some of us), I had a long conversation with one of NICTD's senior execs last year, and in the midst of their chronic car shortage, we discussed diesel trainsets.

It seems that even going back to the days when South Shore DID use a lone diesel trainset, it was with a special waiver from the City of Chicago because of exhaust. Now, with the tracks closed over the city made it clear to NICTD that they would NOT reissue said waiver in the future, thereby requiring that any traffic, be it Metra or NICTD, will have to be straight electric. Considering the shortage of good 600V electric stock, this of course implies that the only short-term solution that would give CSS more seats is the retired Highliners, but I'm not going to start any such rumors or discussions here

Not that it wasn't a good idea

BTW, does that mean that the remaining low-level platforms were removed from the CSS side of Randolph? I know they had one for the bilevel set...

metraRI wrote:I don't really understand why Metra wants to move SWS to LaSalle to begin with. The move won't really reduce the travel time unless they are going to have a high speed connector between RI and SWS. SWS will also still pass through Forest Hill, where most of the delays on SWS occur.

From everything that I've read and heard, it's simply a matter of distributing capacity; rather, changing how only one line runs out of LaSalle vs. six plus Amtrak out of CUS. Also, for whatever it's worth, the Circle Line draft plan dated March 26, 2002 illustrates the new RI "Archer" transfer station as being the transfer for both RI and SWS, assuming that SWS will already be running out of LaSalle.

metraRI wrote:There has been talk about adding more stations, one in either Romeoville or Justice, I forget which one.

Justice has expressed interest in a HC station.