Hampton Roads/Norfolk/Newport News NE Regional Service

ThirdRail7 wrote:ACCA yard already has a bypass. It's called the passenger main. It has been there for years. It allows trains headed south to bypass the main yard...assuming CSX didn't park a train on it.
It sounds like someone isn't getting their money's worth.

I'd love to see a diagram. From other sources, it looks like somebody paid for the 1993 installation of a Passenger Main but that, yes, CSX parks trains on it. Sounds like a combination of a rookie mistake by State/Fed officials at the dawn of actual govt investments in deals for more passenger service in which they didn't write a good contract (apparently there is/was a similar problem in New Orleans?) and bad-old-days CSX

Meanwhile, the Richmon Main St Station Trainshed conversion to retail space has seen its roof torn off (Dec 2015) and nearly put back on (March 2015, video below)
https://vimeo.com/157473388/5355df0e91

Arlington wrote:

ThirdRail7 wrote:ACCA yard already has a bypass. It's called the passenger main. It has been there for years. It allows trains headed south to bypass the main yard...assuming CSX didn't park a train on it.
It sounds like someone isn't getting their money's worth.

I'd love to see a diagram. From other sources, it looks like somebody paid for the 1993 installation of a Passenger Main but that, yes, CSX parks trains on it. Sounds like a combination of a rookie mistake by State/Fed officials at the dawn of actual govt investments in deals for more passenger service in which they didn't write a good contract (apparently there is/was a similar problem in New Orleans?) and bad-old-days CSX

I have the track charts but this picture tells the tale. Looking from the bottom of the picture,the track that juts out to the left of all the tracks (and remains in the picture) is the Passenger Main as it comes from West AY and moves towards RVR station. Speed is 40mph.

ThirdRail7 wrote:I have the track charts but this picture tells the tale. Looking from the bottom of the picture,the track that juts out to the left of all the tracks (and remains in the picture) is the Passenger Main as it comes from West AY and moves towards RVR station. Speed is 40mph.

So is the problem simply that CSX wasn't/isn't actually required to give pax trains priority on the track? What kind of scam is CSX running? Arguing the other side, maybe CSX's case is simply that in order to accommodate an additional daily R/T on the Long Bridge (to Lynchburg) and an additional RVR-NPN train, and to actually keep the 40mph pax bypass track clear that they decided they needed to get more done at Acca?

looking from google satellite, there doesn't seem to be a crossover between the 2 main tracks for some miles north of RVR station. This would seem to be quite a restriction for Amtrak trains accessing the platforms. Same South of RVR, Amtrak is restricted to one track from the station to just south of Acca yard.

There is a universal crossover at Greendale, just north of the station. No problem there.

The single passenger main south of the station is an obvious obstacle to the smooth running of the passenger trains. On a simulation I have, a northbound train can be delayed about 10 minutes or more when one is held for a southbound getting ready to leave the station. The distance is just about 3 miles of single track between the station and CFP AY.

Sounds as if the problem is that they need two bypass tracks and not just one.

Agreed.

Cross posted from the Lynchburg Regional thread. Specifically for the sake of consideration and discussion of a renewed Fast Flying Virginian (FFV) from Newport News and/or options from Norfolk to include classics such as the Cavalier, Pocahontas and/or the Powhatan Arrow to Cincinnati. I think there are some clear themes in this area that are beginning to emerge from VA DRPT, one of them specifically is the restoration and reactivation of transportation options in corridors which previously had been abandoned entirely by passenger transportation services.

Balerion wrote:I'm not sure where exactly to put this, but Amtrak has added a connecting Thruway bus service from Charlottesville to Richmond.

CVS to RVR service is 755am-915am and 740pm-910pm

Southbound departures from RVR include:

944am Newport News Regional
1219pm Palmetto
108pm Carolinian
448pm Newport News Regional
517pm Silver Star
624pm Norfolk Regional
944pm Silver Meteor

Northbound/Eastbound arrivals in CVS are:

709am Crescent
852am Regional
319pm Cardinal

RVR to CVS service is 615am-740am and 600pm-730pm

Southbound/Westbound departures from CVS include:

152pm Cardinal
723pm Lynchburg Regional
852pm Crescent

Northbound arrivals at RVR include:

432am Silver Meteor
813am Regional (from Norfolk)
1104am Regional (from Newport News)
1207pm Silver Star
205pm Carolinian
504pm Palmetto
655pm Regional (from Newport News)


I'm trying to make sense of the connections here. It looks mostly like a way to connect Richmond to the Crescent (and to a less convenient extent, the Cardinal) and Charlottesville to the Silver Meteor (and again, to a less convenient extent, the Palmetto). It also connects Charlottesville to Newport News, but not the other way around.

EDIT: playing around with Amtrak's website, it doesn't seem like it allows you to travel via the Thruway to NPN from CVS.

Richmond-to-Crescent sounds like a winner to me:
1) It adds RVR-ATL in particular, but also RVR-NOL (I bet they discovered it as they were looking into Sunset Limited restoration east of NOL, having asked what's the biggest market we don't serve from NOL? Assuming NOL's biggest ones are on the SL route itself, Richmond would be pretty much the headliner for a big market that'd turn up if you just ran "all NOL city pairs" and "all ATL city pairs"

2) It will generally do a better job of filling the Crescent south of CVS (north of CVS is presumably pretty full as it is), so if it works, it might support adding a coach to the Crescent (market-wise. I have no idea on ops restrictions), or just creating "found money" in seats that, today, are only filled (or fully-priced) CVS->WAS->NEC.

A Bus RVR to CVS connecting to <> from Crescent has much merit. Biggest problem is still the low ridership ATL <> New Orleans and consequently empty coach cars south of ATL. Connecting from RVR might make the problem worse. Traffic CVS <> WASH is much less and is not normally sold until the last minute as the Lynchburg train has unloaded that demand allowing more passengers south of LYH. If another coach is needed the problem of dropping / adding 3 - 4 coaches and a sleeper becomes even more acute.

Long range solution is the day train NYP - RVR - Raleigh - CLT - ATL.

This is waaaay outside of the Hampton Roads thread, but hear me out: if there are so few riders south of Atlanta, split the train at Birmingham and run to Memphis. I bet that would have a lot more traffic, both from Atlanta and direct from the NEC.

Mods: please, feel free to stick this in the Crescent thread!

mtuandrew wrote:This is waaaay outside of the Hampton Roads thread, but hear me out: if there are so few riders south of Atlanta, split the train at Birmingham and run to Memphis. I bet that would have a lot more traffic, both from Atlanta and direct from the NEC.

Mods: please, feel free to stick this in the Crescent thread!

Or better yet, split the train in Meridian, MS and run the other half to Dallas, TX.

Or better yet, run the New Orleans section to Houston

bdawe wrote:Or better yet, run the New Orleans section to Houston

Houston doesn't have room or facilities to turn a train around. Dallas doesn't either, but Fort Worth does have room, and already turns the Heartland Flyer. San Antonio can too, turning the Texas Eagle around.

We're putting too much emphasis on a one seat ride. Dallas and Houston already have two seat rides into New York City.
What's important is to arrive in time at the transfer station to make the transfer to the second train.