Brightline (All Aboard Florida) Orlando - Miami FL FEC fka Virgin Rail

Unless It's raining cats and dogs this Sunday, I expect to do the joyride I outlined earlier in the topic.

The Boynton Beach Police released the Brightline vidoe. After the advertisement, the accident is at 2:04.

https://www.tcpalm.com/videos/news/loca ... 109776318/

Are there toxicology results for the fatalities? That cyclist seems almost to have his head down rather than in an alert position as if he were in his own world.

For the railroads part I'm wondering if there is some way of painting on the pavement or between the rails to make it look more bumpy/3D

chaz wrote:The Boynton Beach Police released the Brightline vidoe. After the advertisement, the accident is at 2:04.

https://www.tcpalm.com/videos/news/loca ... 109776318/

He didn't even look! How can you be so oblivious?

At the rate these fatal in incidents have occurred, some party is going to seek the Judiciary to deem AAF a public nuisance.

But I shall defer to our barristers around here to determine if AAF rises to the applicable standard.

Personally, I think the public nuisance is the people, not the railroad.

Gilbert B Norman wrote:At the rate these fatal in incidents have occurred, some party is going to seek the Judiciary to deem AAF a public nuisance.

But I shall defer to our barristers around here to determine if AAF rises to the applicable standard.

Mr. Norman,

I think it is absurd that a railroad, an entity which has long been recognized as a public utility, would ever be treated in such a manner by the courts. If there was ever an example of why some might wonder if you hold animus against the operation this would be "Exhibit 1". Recalling and respecting as always your experience at "The Milwaukee Road" it seems that perhaps the idea of passenger service being financially viable for its own account must require a suspension of disbelief that is "beyond the pale". I can only write to say that some of the very best passenger rail executives in the entire country have worked on this project and I have no doubt that they would never have been involved if it was going to be doomed to failure.

There is every reason to believe that in such a heavily populated area such as the Florida Coast, along with today's higher energy prices (relative to the 1950's) and the overall higher cost of transportation that privately operated rail passenger service could be an economically viable offering. I also recall as always that even at the very end the SAL was still making money on the Florida services and that was without the benefit of access to the FEC.

Food for thought ...

Mr. O'Keefe, lest we forget, I'm planning an AAF joyride this Sunday.

Further, I have never been opposed to the initiative; only skeptical. Again I concede I was mistaken when I thought AAF was a ploy to fatten the steer for a sale of the railroad to the State, and when such sale was closed, AAF would "quietly yet quickly be forgotten". With the "Billybucks" the State has invested in the two South Florida ports served only by the FEC (apparently CSX does not make rates out of either), I could not imagine any party having an interest greater than the State to ensure that the FEC was not acquired by either Class I and that Jacksonville remained an Open Gateway served by both CSX and NS.

With the railroad being sold to one foreign party and the real estate company, of which AAF is a subsidiary, to another, I foresaw "no way". But it is "up and running" and providing joyrides (Disneyland rides) to apparently quite a few - and I expect to be part of the "body count" come Sunday (it is weather permitting as there will be a 2.1 mile walk in each direction along Broward Blvd between Amtrak/Tri Rail and AAF). However simply because people are stepping up for joyrides does not mean meaningful transportation has been provided. Possibly there will be when Miami Central is open and becomes occupied with tenants having a need for a Miami-West Palm "Super Shuttle". AAF could become nicknamed "The Barrister" used by attorneys from West Palm considering the Federal and County judiciaries are a simple walk from Miami Central (I'm not sure where the judiciaries are located in W Palm).

But at this time, I cannot see making AAF pay operating only MIA-WPB; to build it out to Orlando will require, again, "Billybucks" ($1.8 of 'em as I recall), that the investment community seems reluctant to provide. Even if "bottom feeders" step up, they will want a yield at "junk" rates of likely 8%. That means to build it out will cost more than anticipated and of course lessen the expectation of AAF attaining profitability.

"Can't make it as a Super Shuttle; can't afford to complete it (where maybe it has a chance)" does not sound like a promising future.

Now so far as the possibility AAF could be shut down as a "public nuisance", there have been three fatalities in about three weeks. It doesn't matter according to that legal definition I noted earlier if the fatalities arose from the victims' negligence (I couldn't agree more with Mr. Rockingham), the joyrides it presently provides cannot rise to a level of public benefit and accordingly there is exposure to being shut down at least until Miami service is inaugurated.

gokeefe wrote:

Gilbert B Norman wrote:At the rate these fatal in incidents have occurred, some party is going to seek the Judiciary to deem AAF a public nuisance.

But I shall defer to our barristers around here to determine if AAF rises to the applicable standard.

Mr. Norman,

I think it is absurd that a railroad, an entity which has long been recognized as a public utility, would ever be treated in such a manner by the courts. If there was ever an example of why some might wonder if you hold animus against the operation this would be "Exhibit 1". Recalling and respecting as always your experience at "The Milwaukee Road" it seems that perhaps the idea of passenger service being financially viable for its own account must require a suspension of disbelief that is "beyond the pale". I can only write to say that some of the very best passenger rail executives in the entire country have worked on this project and I have no doubt that they would never have been involved if it was going to be doomed to failure.

There is every reason to believe that in such a heavily populated area such as the Florida Coast, along with today's higher energy prices (relative to the 1950's) and the overall higher cost of transportation that privately operated rail passenger service could be an economically viable offering. I also recall as always that even at the very end the SAL was still making money on the Florida services and that was without the benefit of access to the FEC.

Food for thought ...

I totally agree with this one. GBN has been the one constant negative on Brightline for a long time. I don't look for somebody to be proven wrong but we ALL need to think positive and think passenger trains in Florida, better days are on the way and getting closer and closer.
Noel Weaver

Gilbert B Norman wrote:Now so far as the possibility AAF could be shut down as a "public nuisance", there have been three fatalities in about three weeks. It doesn't matter according to that legal definition I noted earlier if the fatalities arose from the victims' negligence (I couldn't agree more with Mr. Rockingham), the joyrides it presently provides cannot rise to a level of public benefit and accordingly there is exposure to being shut down at least until Miami service is inaugurated.

I think I need only remind of the "Valparaiso Limited" which ran for decades under both PC and Amtrak to make the case that "public benefit" is probably not quite as narrowly construed as one might imagine. There are plenty of other examples but if I had stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night that's the case I would be making. If I really wanted to nail it down to Florida I would probably discuss the FEC in its final days, which even though they went to Miami was so schedule constricted as to be an almost meaningless offering.

[quote="Gilbert B But it is "up and running" and providing joyrides (Disneyland rides) to apparently quite a few - and I expect to be part of the "body count" come Sunday (it is weather permitting

The walk between Tri-Rail and Brightline is not thw greatest and I DO NOT recommend you do it. If the bus alternatives do not appeal to you a taxi will be fast and probably aroind $10.00 or so and that's probably your best bet. Enjoy your ride.
Noel Weaver

[/quote]

If BL wanted to adapt its strategy and serve Central Florida and Tampa via CSX Auburndale division is there a place where a connection exists or could be made between the FEC and CSX that would be north of BL Fort Lauderdale station?

Mr. Weaver, I "walked" Broward Blvd with Mr. Google as my guide.

It looks like a lot of traffic on it, but this is broad daylight. So if "there's something"I should lnow, please advise.

Here comes BNSF 1304 first leg.of my poor man's to O Hare

Arlington wrote:If BL wanted to adapt its strategy and serve Central Florida and Tampa via CSX Auburndale division is there a place where a connection exists or could be made between the FEC and CSX that would be north of BL Fort Lauderdale station?

Yes brand new and reactivated dead trackage just north of West Palm Beach being built right now. The Florida situation in the area is backwards. Freight goes down the FEC which goes through the populated downtowns of the cities and passenger trains go down CSX which is not as convenient.

There is an interesting project underway to reverse this whole thing.

Read all about it: http://www.fdot.gov/design/training/Des ... ilaire.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

There are lots of options here for Amtrak too of course. Should Amtrak cross over and go via the populated coastal cities and serve downtown Miami? Should Amtrak go all the way down the FEC serving populated areas vs. the inland route (Tampa trains would still serve Orlando). Should Amtrak extend to the Miami Airport station and join the crowd there? Anything would be better than using the existing Amtrak station in the middle of nowhere.

Aboard BNSF 1304

Yes Mr. Trainguy, Tri Rail should have been built along the FEC, but "too late now". Ride West Palm to Magnonia and you'll see the physical SAL-FEC connection.