Amtrak Downeaster Discussion Thread

[gokeefe]

Insufficient time for crew qualification was stated as a reason.

Whether or not that's due to new regulations or delays from decision makers at MaineDOT (or Amtrak or FRA) is another matter. It is completely unclear at this time to me where the issue was.

[Backshophoss]

IS CMQ the host RR to Rockland? That might be the reason.

[MEC407]

I still don't understand this fetish that some people have for running MBTA commuter rail equipment on the Downeaster route, or why it keeps coming up. It wouldn't help the Downeaster and it wouldn't help the T, so why do it? "If it's not broke, break it"?

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[Tom M]

I haven't bothered to trace it back, but I don't understand why it keeps coming up, either. I don't believe it originated with the T. I can't imagine that it originated with NNEPRA. So... did someone here toss it out as an idea and now it is seen as a legitimate possibility?

[BandA]

NNEPRA should be looking into acquiring their own equipment if that can save money compared to leasing from Amtrak.

Not enough time to qualify crews??? A year and a half isn't long enough? Clearly Amtrak is disinterested / uninterested in extending service. Perhaps NNEPRA needs to evaluate alternative operators - Keolis, PanAM, etc. for the entire route.

[gokeefe]

This is not correct at all. The initial problem was MaineDOT pulling funding at the last minute under the previous administration after Amtrak and all other stakeholders had agreed to run the service. Amtrak, and especially the local supervisors and crews, is a very strong partner for the Downeaster. The route has a reputation within the company as one of the best operations in the entire country and frankly it is the envy of many other state operators.

[gokeefe]

IS CMQ the host RR to Rockland? That might be the reason.

They are the host railroad (state contracted operator to MaineDOT) and to the best of my knowledge they most certainly are not the problem.

[BandA]

This is not correct at all. The initial problem was MaineDOT pulling funding at the last minute under the previous administration after Amtrak and all other stakeholders had agreed to run the service. Amtrak, and especially the local supervisors and crews, is a very strong partner for the Downeaster. The route has a reputation within the company as one of the best operations in the entire country and frankly it is the envy of many other state operators.C

Glad to be wrong! How do Amtrak costs compare with MBTA costs, per train or per coach? Can I assume the Downeaster has a longer MTBF than the MBTA? Presumably Amtrak is maintained to a higher standard

[electricron]

Glad to be wrong! How do Amtrak costs compare with MBTA costs, per train or per coach? Can I assume the Downeaster has a longer MTBF than the MBTA? Presumably Amtrak is maintained to a higher standard.

The Downeaster uses three train sets to provide the services it does today. I'm not sure MBTA has three train sets available to send trains all the way to Maine?
Of course Amtrak provides a better service, all one has to do is look at what is provided in the coaches.
Amfleet I capacity = coaches have up to 84 seats (basically 21 rows 4 seats abreast), each with 2 restrooms per car, one of which is handicap accessible, plus one AmCafe per train.
MBTA Horizon equivalent (BTC and CTC- 1s) capacity = coaches have up to 122 seats (basically 24 rows 5 seats abreast), none with a restroom, and only one cafe version (car#224) available for MBTA. All CTC-1 are used as BTC-1 today because all their cab controls have been deactivated.
MBTA MBB (BTC-3 and CTC-3s) capacity = coaches have up to 96 seats ( basically 24 rows 4 seats abreast), all with restrooms, and no cafe versions available. Having restrooms may be why ConnDOT leased MBB coaches vs Comets from MBTA.
I do not think Maine will be interested in bilevel coaches soon. I have never ridden in either a Comet or MBB coach before, so I can't compare their ride quality.

[gokeefe]

Glad to be wrong! How do Amtrak costs compare with MBTA costs, per train or per coach? Can I assume the Downeaster has a longer MTBF than the MBTA? Presumably Amtrak is maintained to a higher standard

No idea. In terms of "Mean Time Between Failures" my impression is certainly that Amtrak's maintenance practices were better than MBTA Commuter Rail. I can't remember the last time the Downeaster got cancelled prior to departure due to an Amtrak equipment failure. Some kind of enroute failure is the only thing I can think of and those are not frequent at all.

[troffey]

I haven't bothered to trace it back, but I don't understand why it keeps coming up, either. I don't believe it originated with the T. I can't imagine that it originated with NNEPRA. So... did someone here toss it out as an idea and now it is seen as a legitimate possibility?

If I recall correctly, it came up originally as a CapeFlyer type extra weekend service idea using MBTA equipment, either last year or the year before...the idea has kept popping up on and off since.

[Cowford]

The initial problem was MaineDOT pulling funding at the last minute under the previous administration after Amtrak and all other stakeholders had agreed to run the service.

With respect George, this is not an accurate account. ME DOT was not the bad guy here; there was never any funding to pull. NNEPRA touted this service as being able to pay for itself. When ME DOT clearly told NNEPRA the service was not to be offered if it required additional subsidy, NNEPRA balked.

[MEC407]

From NBC Boston:

Due to the lack of seats, a Massachusetts mom-to-be is expressing her frustration with Amtrak after being consistently forced to stand during her hour-long commute into Boston.

Story and video here: https://www.nbcboston.com/investigation ... 94321.html

[MEC407]

From Maine Public:

For the second summer in a row, plans to extend the Amtrak Downeaster’s service north of Brunswick through Rockland for a limited seasonal schedule have fallen through.
. . .
The Maine Department of Transportation owns the 58 miles of track between Brunswick and Rockland. However, the Central Maine and Quebec Railway has a lease with the DOT to carry freight on the Brunswick-Rockland line.

In order to operate the extended Downeaster service ― called the Coastal Connection ― Amtrak would need to contract with the Central Maine and Quebec Railway to use the line, Quinn said.

Read the rest of the article at: https://www.mainepublic.org/post/plan-o ... ough-again

[sicariis]

From NBC Boston:

Due to the lack of seats, a Massachusetts mom-to-be is expressing her frustration with Amtrak after being consistently forced to stand during her hour-long commute into Boston.

Story and video here: https://www.nbcboston.com/investigation ... 94321.html

No one bothers to ask why they don't switch to commuter rail passes? They would have their pick of seats getting on in HHL, and also get a free connection on the T. My sympathy would be much greater if this was happening further up the line where there are no alternative modes (i.e EXR). Downeaster only saves 8 minutes vs CR.

Easy fix seems to be to reserve more 680 seats for pass holders. problem solved. Or if NNEPRA deems that number to be too high, then maybe 680 becomes disembark only at HHL.