Discussion related to New Jersey Transit rail and light rail operations.

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  by MACTRAXX
 
Everyone: I noticed after reading this entire topic how badly the NJT Rail system
was hit by Sandy...I feared that the NJCL would be the hardest hit noting that the
NJ Shore took a direct hit from this storm...It looks like it will be down from Perth
Amboy on south for some time...

The MMC Complex flooding actually shocked me but I do recall the low-lying area that
it sits on...On the other hand the Hoboken pictures I saw reminded me of the 1992 storm...

At this point only the NEC between NYP-NWK-TRE is even coming close to some semblance
of normal...

I thank everyone for the system status and other information especially pictures...
Hopefully everyone here fared OK...

I feel this way: "We Will Survive!!!" but I also note that "Normal" may be a long way off...

MACTRAXX
  by northjerseybuff
 
getting back on topic. Why not have a backup to the ROC in former towers that still exist?
  by DutchRailnut
 
Who says they do not have a backup, lots of companies found this week that backup plans instituted after 9/11 did not work due to oversight or due to storm just to big.
MNCR has a backup for operations center, its just at lower location than main operations center but it did survive.
Verizon moved emergency generators to higher location but fuel transfer pumps got flooded, there is news all ovwer about plans that did not work.
you learn and correct.
  by ThirdRail7
 
sixty-six wrote:
Jersey_Mike wrote:
Thanks for telling us how to run a railroad, Mr. Railroad Employee!!!! If dispatchers were unavailable, like you say, who's going to issue the Form D's? Running over interlockings with no power requires the switches to be blocked and spiked, taking people away from repairing the hardest hit areas. You can't run push-pull service with 15 cars because the MU signal degrades after 12 cars. But hey, you obviously know more than those who work here, so thanks for coming in!
While dispatchers are unavailable at their computer workstations at ClubMed, the cell and landline phone networks are still largely functional (or if not then high frequency radio) so they can meet anywhere with a white board and implement a manual block system communicating with temporary block operators stationed at block limits. Yes, you would spike and wedge power operated points at affected interlockings, Amtrak has had to do this during several recent snow storms. The reduced capacity would be offset by using longer trains and combining the engines from multiple trainsets on the front to a pull-pull service with engine reversal at terminals or having extra engines live in tow on the rear to provide HEP and to pull the train in the opposite direction upon reaching the terminal.

It's lovely how quick you are to just throw up your hands in surrender instead of trying to think of ways to get service running. Railroads in China wouldn't have even stopped service during the storm. Go America and its can't do attitude.
Oh yea, cause running trains into areas with washouts is a great idea. Running trains into conditions that can disable equipment is a great idea. Good ideas, Mr. Railroad Employee!

Additionally, Jersey Mike has forgotten an important point that I mentioned in the CTEC thread: When you do these types of things, you must be qualified on the physical characteristics and operting rules to rune DCS rules. With the loss of the towers, the head count was cut. The runners no longer exist. I doubt NJT has enough qualified people to staff the multiple TBSs that are needed to launch restoration of magnitude. Furthermore, dispatchers and operators HOS laws are far more rigid. Deadheading to the site(s) is included in their 9:59 maximum allowable work limit. This all adds up to an unacceptable risk when you consider that Amtrak is not fully on the beam (which causes capacity problems), Secaucus is flooded and the tracks still need inspections.

PS: I'm pretty sure this isn't China.
  by northjerseybuff
 
well Dutch do they have a backup?
  by nomis
 
I'd like to know how you could run DCS from an alternate site while in the field Commercial Power was unavailable causing most radio towers were offline and cell tower capacity was diminished in the area?
  by DutchRailnut
 
northjerseybuff wrote:well Dutch do they have a backup?
well Buff, If they did and it did not work what good would answer be, I doubt the FRA would allow a Control center without a backup.
  by lirr42
 
Hey! How come the MTA folks have cool storm recovery maps like this, this, and this and NJT doesn't!?!?

Well, never fear. 20 minutes of insane boredom led to this little adaptation of the NJT map that I've attached.


.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
  by 25Hz
 
lirr42 wrote:Hey! How come the MTA folks have cool storm recovery maps like this, this, and this and NJT doesn't!?!?

Well, never fear. 20 minutes of insane boredom led to this little adaptation of the NJT map that I've attached.


.
Probably because they don't have system maps the way the MTA does. They just have the one map, and everything is suspended anyways. What's the point in making a map when the system is shut down?

Only positive thing about this situation is NJT isn't paying to use any amtrak electricity, save for morrisville yard & sunnyside... but since there's no revenue it's fairly moot.

And dutch, it's about planning around the railroads so the railroads can do their thing. :)
  by morris&essex4ever
 
25Hz wrote:Only positive thing about this situation is NJT isn't paying to use any amtrak electricity, save for morrisville yard & sunnyside... but since there's no revenue it's fairly moot.
So NJT's NEC trains are using the NEC's catenary for free?
  by korbermeister
 
it's not necessarily that their utilities are underground, it's that they are unprotected underground. If NJ's utilities were buried underground we would be enduring less blackouts. wires on poles are so 19th century
  by mmi16
 
You can roll out all these off the cuff operating plans, but the one thing that everyone is over looking

SAFETY

Unless everyone is KNOWLEDGABLY on the same page of how to operate a system it becomes, by defination, UNSAFE.

It has taken years to educate employees on operating system that exists today - and there are still rules failure. What do you think the number of failures, catastrophic failures, would be in a off the cuff system that nobody has been trained on.

PRICELESS
  by EuroStar
 
jp1822 wrote:
I wonder if this storm and its damage will give NJT the final excuse to cut service back to Long Branch......even though there are greater infrastructure issues to deal with north of Long Branch and really bad between Matawan and Woodbridge.
Please, don't give the Governor ideas like that or we will end up with fewer ans shorter lines and more cars on the roads!

On a brighter note -- NJT seems ready to resume some service on Sunday with the RVL, ML, ACL and the truncated NJCL. Still no word on M&E or MB.
Trenton, NJ – Marking key milestones in NJ TRANSIT’s continued recovery, the Christie Administration announced this evening that four additional rail lines would resume service effective Sunday morning. Coming on the heels of the Northeast Corridor’s return to New York Penn Station on Friday morning, the announcements continue the statewide agency’s service restoration efforts following the significant damage incurred by Hurricane Sandy earlier this week.

Effective Sunday morning:

North Jersey Coast Line will resume limited service to New York Penn Station, operating between Woodbridge and New York.
Raritan Valley Line service will resume limited service between Raritan and Newark Penn Station.
The Main/Port Jervis Line will resume limited service, with trains originating and terminating in Secaucus.
The Atlantic City Line will resume normal service, operating between Atlantic City and Philadelphia.

Special schedules detailing this restored service can be accessed by visiting njtransit.com.
  by millerm277
 
lirr42 wrote:Well, never fear. 20 minutes of insane boredom led to this little adaptation of the NJT map that I've attached..
Completely nitpicking here, but PATCO and the EWR AirTrain are running.
  by lirr42
 
millerm277 wrote:Completely nitpicking here, but PATCO and the EWR AirTrain are running.
PATCO and AirTrain EWR are gray by default on the map. So the grey meaning no service and the normal gray for those connecting services are a bit similar. If you got you're color pallet and magnifying glass out you could probably find a difference between them. I (think) I didn't change those colors.

Updated map for Sunday:
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
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