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  • CSX Train Crash In VA......(and open derailment discussion)

  • Discussion of the operations of CSX Transportation, from 1980 to the present. Official site can be found here: CSXT.COM.
Discussion of the operations of CSX Transportation, from 1980 to the present. Official site can be found here: CSXT.COM.

Moderator: MBTA F40PH-2C 1050

 #176337  by GOLDEN-ARM
 
I can also relate 2 stories, regarding "jumping" crewmen. The first, was a good Conrail freind of mine "Secaucus Sammy", who was running southbound, on the Chemical Coast secondary, when he came around the corner, approaching Bayway, he saw a red target, and "bailed". If the train had impacted, the cars in the siding, going 30 mph, the explosions and fire would have gone on for weeks. Unfortunately, he was looking at the wrong target, broke his leg, and was fired. (for abandoning his post? :-D ) The second time was when I was on the Soo line, and the BN dropped a run-away train into the St. Paul yard, where I was working. This time, I watched the train enter the yard, and while it was headed for the yard office, the conductor (an old head, with 25+ years in service) decided to bail, when he found an opening, between some cars, on the track next to him. He hit the ground, at 54 mph, and broke arms and legs. The engineer, a "kid" with less than 2 years on the railroad, stayed in the seat, blowing the horn, until the train impacted another standing train, outside the yard office, at 49 mph. When the locos had all stopped flying through the air, and all of the cars had finished piling up, and once the end of the building had finished collapsing, that hogger grabbed all the grips, off the engine, and crawled out the window, and carried them to the parking lot, to await a limo back to Northtown. Looking at the trailing unit, and at the other 8 units destroyed in the wreck, the only way he could have survived, was sitting in the seat, like he was. My LC was 3 tracks away, in the departure yard, and a flying loco peeled the roof, and firemans side of his loco away. He was in his seat, and received only some scratches, and bruising. His Cndr was pinned under a covered hopper, that had flown through the air, and landed on it's side, and on top of him. I really don't imagine there is anywhere safe to be. You might survive a jump, or you might get run over. You might survive in the cab, laying on the floor holding the end of the control stand, or you might get crushed, trapped and burned, or torn to pieces. Seeing engines from wrecks, you understand that there is nowhere to run, and nowhere to hide. Luck, and fate are all that you have. BTW, I got 4 rolls of really great pix, from that CP/BN wreck, and of the destroyed locos and cars. Every time I look at them, I am amazed that kid walked away, and had the good sense to grab the grips, when he left. :wink:

 #176352  by blippo
 
There was an accident a few years ago where the crew were in a collision course with the hind end of another train They were going around 25 mph. The conductor stayed on the motor and came out of it okay. The engineer jumped, but when he jumped he collided face first with a wall. Had to have many reconstructive face surgeries.

 #176401  by conrail_engineer
 
All true; but you can play the odds. Usually the lead unit is destroyed/heavily damaged on impact and tends to ride up and over, or roll off the track. It absorbs a lot of the kinetic energy.

The second unit tends to buckle, along with the consist. Usually damage is quite a bit less severe.

It's all a crap shoot; but you've got to figure where your odds are best. Dumbest thing in the world is just to jump off the steps in a panic...you could meet with a 40-foot fall and crack your head on a concrete footer. And the trains might stop short or collide at low impact.

I recall a near head-on near Rochester (I wasn't on it) with an Amtrak run that blew by a red signal. The crew big-holed it and bailed at about 40 mph. They were in hospital for a week. The train stopped short. Amazingly, nobody made a big deal about their injuries...might have been because that area is mostly Conrail holdovers; or it might have been because they wanted to sweep the whole thing under the rug (the Amtrak engineer was female and had had problems in the past...EEOC, dontcha know.)

 #176560  by CSX Conductor
 
conrail_engineer wrote: or it might have been because they wanted to sweep the whole thing under the rug
That's what my vote is.

This incident was just last year, correct?

 #176588  by CSX Engineer 98
 
I believe I would try to Ride it out in the Lead unit. Theres just not enough time to make your way to the second unit. Also I know of 2 incidents where the crews survived:

1. On the NECR RR. in 96 or 97 a grade crossing collision with a Gasoline tanker. " Lucky the windows were closed" in Willamanic CT.

2. Somewhere on the NS about 10 yrs ago a grade crossing collision with a Propane Truck the crew made it. I believe the Engineer pulled the throttle out and hit the Deck. he did not "dump it"

 #176622  by paulrail
 
One of our members of the South Shore Model Railway Club (Jeremy) was the conductor-in-training on the engine that was in the accident with the tanker truck in Willimantic, CT.

He told me that the crew survived because the cab windows were closed and the fire that engulfed the cab of the engine melted the steel on the nose. It destroyed the NECR engine, a GP38-2, I beleieve.

Jeremy had just started working for the New England Central a week before the accident and was so shaken, he quit the railroad the next day. Luckily none of the crew was severely injured or died as a result of the collision.

It must have been an incredible experience to go through.

Paul

 #176629  by CSX Engineer 98
 
It Did not destroy the Engine The engine went up to St.Albans VT. and had cosmetics done, and a Nose repaint. The Interior of the cab was sindged for a long time after. I belive the engine is the "Pride of Palmer" paint sceame.
No one in the Crew was hurt...But the driver of the tanker was Toast.

 #176859  by conrail_engineer
 
paulrail wrote:One of our members of the South Shore Model Railway Club (Jeremy) was the conductor-in-training on the engine that was in the accident with the tanker truck in Willimantic, CT.

He told me that the crew survived because the cab windows were closed and the fire that engulfed the cab of the engine melted the steel on the nose. It destroyed the NECR engine, a GP38-2, I beleieve.

Jeremy had just started working for the New England Central a week before the accident and was so shaken, he quit the railroad the next day. Luckily none of the crew was severely injured or died as a result of the collision.

It must have been an incredible experience to go through.

Paul
I'd take that tale with a grain of salt.

Think it through. You're riding a locomotive that penetrates a gasoline tanker...the gasoline is going to spray and vaporize. There's air blowing in the cab constantly, through cracks and through the HVAC system on a widebody.

That air around the point of impact is literally going to be on fire. Temperature even at 100 feet is going to be enough to cook your skin off. Is the window-glass not going to crack? Is that superheated air not going to get inside the cab?

Is the cab not going to distort if any gear off the truck hits it?

I simply cannot see it. Those windows would shatter and melt and even if they didn't, the weatherstripping that holds them in place would be ash in seconds.

I don't want to call anyone a liar; but making plans for action on the basis of stories and wives' tales is reckless. If that truck stopped on the crossing is a tank...I'm stepping off.

 #176860  by conrail_engineer
 
CSX Conductor wrote:
conrail_engineer wrote: or it might have been because they wanted to sweep the whole thing under the rug
That's what my vote is.

This incident was just last year, correct?
I think it was about 18 months ago. A Rochester TV station did a news blurb about it and had the snippet on the Web...and inside of 24 hours it was gone. At the time there was a Google cache; surely it's gone now even if I could find the exact dates.

There were no other news reports. The CSX Coverup Brigade was in full swing.

 #176891  by charlie6017
 
I live just northwest of Rochester, and I remember the Amtrak incident. If I remember right, the freight was headed east (the 624 maybe?) and their clear signal dropped and just then the crew heard the "Kirkville" detector go off--on their track--at 78 mph!! That's when the crew dumped it and left. Wasn't that long ago........

 #177088  by CSX Engineer 98
 
conrail_engineer wrote:
paulrail wrote:One of our members of the South Shore Model Railway Club (Jeremy) was the conductor-in-training on the engine that was in the accident with the tanker truck in Willimantic, CT.

He told me that the crew survived because the cab windows were closed and the fire that engulfed the cab of the engine melted the steel on the nose. It destroyed the NECR engine, a GP38-2, I beleieve.

Jeremy had just started working for the New England Central a week before the accident and was so shaken, he quit the railroad the next day. Luckily none of the crew was severely injured or died as a result of the collision.

It must have been an incredible experience to go through.

Paul
I'd take that tale with a grain of salt.

Think it through. You're riding a locomotive that penetrates a gasoline tanker...the gasoline is going to spray and vaporize. There's air blowing in the cab constantly, through cracks and through the HVAC system on a widebody.

That air around the point of impact is literally going to be on fire. Temperature even at 100 feet is going to be enough to cook your skin off. Is the window-glass not going to crack? Is that superheated air not going to get inside the cab?

Is the cab not going to distort if any gear off the truck hits it?

I simply cannot see it. Those windows would shatter and melt and even if they didn't, the weatherstripping that holds them in place would be ash in seconds.

I don't want to call anyone a liar; but making plans for action on the basis of stories and wives' tales is reckless. If that truck stopped on the crossing is a tank...I'm stepping off.
Well Guy, Believe it or not that is the Way it Happened. That train Smoked the Gasoline Tanker smack dab center. It blew up in a huge fire ball. And the Crew was saved only Because the Windows were closed. That day, in the Morning was a bit cool for the month of April... Lucky for them. I saw Pic's of what was left of the Tanker and saw the Locomotive up close..... and Somebody was looking out for all of them.

 #178695  by conrail_engineer
 
charlie6017 wrote:I live just northwest of Rochester, and I remember the Amtrak incident. If I remember right, the freight was headed east (the 624 maybe?) and their clear signal dropped and just then the crew heard the "Kirkville" detector go off--on their track--at 78 mph!! That's when the crew dumped it and left. Wasn't that long ago........
That's it, exactly. The freight had an "approach limited" signal, which on NORAC territory at that point means only that they'd be crossing over from one track to the other...40 mph. They were slowing for the crossover, when the signal dropped.

The rule when that happens is, absent any known cause, to bring the train to a nice, safe stop. The engineer was setting up his brakes when he heard the detector go off, on his track. Immediately after that they saw a headlight...the crew dumped the air and bailed.

 #178697  by conrail_engineer
 
Well Guy, Believe it or not that is the Way it Happened. That train Smoked the Gasoline Tanker smack dab center. It blew up in a huge fire ball. And the Crew was saved only Because the Windows were closed. That day, in the Morning was a bit cool for the month of April... Lucky for them. I saw Pic's of what was left of the Tanker and saw the Locomotive up close..... and Somebody was looking out for all of them.
Yeah, well, whatever. I have some knowlege of what happens in an explosion; and what happens to glass when burning gasoline is poured over it. And I'd just started with the railroad when that Amtrak run drilled a tank truck in Chicago, with the head-end crew all dead.

I think I'll just step off, thanks.

 #179156  by Railjunkie
 
In the Amtrak/CSX near collision a couple of things need to be cleared up, the engineer was male, kirkville dragger is east of Dewitt yard (SYR) and if memory serves it happened around CP 278 and the CSX train was 626. Being a student engineer at the time I can assure you that it wasnt covered up and that the engineer in question is still out of service and chances are will never be back.

 #179372  by CSX Engineer 98
 
Is there a reason why the Engineer cant come back. You can get back for running a red after 30 or 60 days Cause its a Decertification. Was the Engineer Dirty?