Revisiting the "more auto train" idea

[Jeff Smith]

Let's assume that with the stimulus being bandied about, money for fleet acquisition and infrastructure is NOT an object.

[Tadman]

A Joliet-Flagstaff AT on ATSF would probably be fairly well patronized. Perhaps it's not as busy as the Florida run, maybe run 2x/week.

Mr. Dunville, you have cooked up a routing to benefit your Mother snd Father, and from knowing you face to face, nothing ever came to my attention that they're any kind of "train aficionados".

They're not, but if the route worked, they would use it. I don't think anybody enjoys the long drive. Nor do the other three couples living in close proximity to them.

You're missing the forest for the trees. The days and times are arbitrary in order to show that it's possible to use one set to cover two routes that don't have the demand for daily services. If this were ever taken seriously, you know for sure someone would get a million dollar study contract (or three) before wheel 1 turns.

As for "railroaders", auto loaders are not railroaders. They can be third party contractors and often are at other auto loading facilities.

And this is not aimed at New Yorkers. Joliet was chosen because it's upper midwest. You can take your pick of Joliet, Waukesha, Kankakee, Kokomo, Dayton... But Joliet is one railroad, one main line, all the way.

The days may have been arbitrary, but not the times. You picked the times to show a leg being accomplish overnight. But if you use realistic times in the schedule, a late afternoon departure with a mid morning arrival, it would take two nights to travel between Joliet and Fairbanks. Then those wishing to travel all the way from the Midwest to southern California would have a more reasonable day transfer at the train station in Fairbanks about 8 to 9 hours. Give them a movie, lunch, and another movie to pass their time half way entertained. The workers loading and unloading the auto racks work on a single "day" shift without a shift bonus to their salaries.
But this would turn a two night trip into a three night trip - effectively making the train much slower. Again, it just will not work like you imagine it.

Arizona snowbirds are the focal point here, not LA. It's a one-night ride to Arizona from Chicago, or a one day ride to Arizona from LA. It's not about Chicago to LA. The timing stands. Leave at noon, get in late the next day. It's the same elapsed time the Chief uses. The alternative is to get up early two days in a row and drive 13 hour days. As the boomers age this is less and less attractive and I know quite a few who question what they will do in ten years when a long drive is not as easily accomplished.

Again, it just will not work like you imagine it.

I love hearing this. Seriously I just eat it up. I make a concerted effort to speak up when I have subject matter knowledge and when I've done some research. I love hearing "it just will not work". It usually means there are a lot of preconceived notions and institutional inertia that is just waiting to be disrupted.

This is how EHH happened.

[Tadman]

A Joliet-Flagstaff AT on ATSF would probably be fairly well patronized. Perhaps it's not as busy as the Florida run, maybe run 2x/week.

Mr. Dunville, you have cooked up a routing to benefit your Mother snd Father, and from knowing you face to face, nothing ever came to my attention that they're any kind of "train aficionados".

Addressing a whole new train routed over the Santa Fe? That ship simply will not sail. I have suggested Galesburg simply on the strength that two routes, namely Galesburg-Irondale and Galesburg-La Junta could be served from one facility.

"Been there done that"; the 18 hour "arewethereyetitis" factor comes into play.

They're not, but if the route worked, they would use it. I don't think anybody enjoys the long drive. Nor do the other three couples living in close proximity to them. If 18 hour itis comes into play in a sleeper, try 24 hour itis in a personal car.

You're missing the forest for the trees. The days and times are arbitrary in order to show that it's possible to use one set to cover two routes that don't have the demand for daily services. If this were ever taken seriously, you know for sure someone would get a million dollar study contract (or three) before wheel 1 turns.

As for "railroaders", auto loaders are not railroaders. They can be third party contractors and often are at other auto loading facilities.

And this is not aimed at New Yorkers. Joliet was chosen because it's upper midwest. You can take your pick of Joliet, Waukesha, Kankakee, Kokomo, Dayton... But Joliet is one railroad, one main line, all the way.

The days may have been arbitrary, but not the times. You picked the times to show a leg being accomplish overnight. But if you use realistic times in the schedule, a late afternoon departure with a mid morning arrival, it would take two nights to travel between Joliet and Fairbanks. Then those wishing to travel all the way from the Midwest to southern California would have a more reasonable day transfer at the train station in Fairbanks about 8 to 9 hours. Give them a movie, lunch, and another movie to pass their time half way entertained. The workers loading and unloading the auto racks work on a single "day" shift without a shift bonus to their salaries.
But this would turn a two night trip into a three night trip - effectively making the train much slower. Again, it just will not work like you imagine it.

Arizona snowbirds are the focal point here, not LA. It's a one-night ride to Arizona from Chicago, or a one day ride to Arizona from LA. It's not about Chicago to LA. The timing stands. Leave at noon, get in late the next day. It's the same elapsed time the Chief uses. The alternative is to get up early two days in a row and drive 13 hour days. As the boomers age this is less and less attractive and I know quite a few who question what they will do in ten years when a long drive is not as easily accomplished.

Again, it just will not work like you imagine it.

I love hearing this. Seriously I just eat it up. I make a concerted effort to speak up when I have subject matter knowledge and when I've done some research. I love hearing "it just will not work". It usually means there are a lot of preconceived notions and institutional inertia that is just waiting to be disrupted.

This is how EHH happened.

[David Benton]

Easiest way to find out if the demand is there, put autoracks on the Chief , as others have suggested. Maybe offload at La junta to avoid climbing Raton Pass in the Chicago direction. Load at Barstow in CA , t avoid the Cajon pass climb.