by NYCUticaSyracuse81
I must have hundreds of questions that pertain to the West Shore Railroad, and instead on clogging up the board every time a new question arises, I thought that I'd start a single thread for all who want to discuss anything related to both the mainline and the Chenango Branch. I'm extremely interested in everything there possibly is to know about the W.S. from birth to abandonment. Any additional information you may be able to provide related to the West Shore and its three divisions, as well as the Chenango Branch will be gratefully accepted. No information will be considered insignificant.
Off the top of my head, here are a few immediate questions that I have.
Question # 1: Did the West Shore ever have stations in the cities of Utica or Buffalo, or did they use the NYC mainline stations? I know that there was an architecturally stunning station erected by the West Shore in Syracuse which unfortunately burned around 1910. After that, the W.S. used the NYC mainline station for all passenger traffic until it was discontinued in the 1930's. It seems unlikely that the W.S. did not have stations in the cities of Utica and Buffalo at one time, so if they did, I'd like to know where were they located, and if any photographs of the stations exist?
Question # 2: Was the original W.S. right-of-way through the city of Syracuse situated on the former ROW of the NYC main prior to the 1936 mainline elevation? Today it is now 690.
Question # 3: According to John Taibi's Oneida Railway Company book, "From Horsecars To Interubans," the West Shore discontinued its steam passenger service during 1907 when the Oneida R.W.Co. electrified the West Shore between Utica and Syracuse with the exception of occasional excursions to Sylvan Beach and so on. However, a 1909 timetable has scheduled stops at both the Oneida Castle and Canastota stations; clearly due to the interchanges with the O & W at Oneida Castle, and the Lehigh Valley at Canastota. So, if the timetable is correct, there were scheduled stops at both the O.C. and Canastota stations, which suggests to me that there was regular through passenger service between Utica and Syracuse after the 1907 interurban electrification. If this is not the case, then was passenger service detoured on to the NYC main between Utica and Syracuse? Or, did it only operate between Buffalo and Syracuse, and Utica and the River Division?
Question #4: After interurban service between Utica and Syracuse was discontinued on the electrified West Shore, passenger service did not return between the two cities. It did however continue from Syracuse west to Buffalo, and Utica to the east. Does anyone know if passenger service was cut at the same time in both directions, and the exact dates, or at least years of discontinuance? Something makes me think that it was sometime during 1933 or 1934?
Question # 5: While researching the W.S., I've gathered a number of abandonment dates. Please correct any of these dates if they are incorrect. I'd also like to know the exact month and day of abandonment if anyone has knowledge of such dates. I've heard conflicting stories of when the W.S. was abandoned between Canastota and Oneida Castle. I've heard that the final abandonment was in June of 1982, but have also read that it was Oct. 1982. I recall reading somewhere on this forum that the W.S. continued operations from Canastota to Wampsville up until 1983; possibly to service the fertilizer plant, but that was the only time I've heard this? I'd really like to know the exact date that W.S. discontinued service east of Canastota.
Here are the dates that I've acquired to far-
Mainline abandonment's on the West Shore:
Minoa-Canastota (12.9 miles) 1955
Belle Isle - Amboy (3.9 miles) 1955
Byron-Oakfield (10.24 miles) 1963
Chili Jct. - Byron (11.88 miles) 1959
Amboy-Wayneport (59.32 miles) 1959 (small portions near Lyons and Newark abandoned 1982)
Vernon-New York Mills (12.3 miles) 1964
Little Falls-South Ft. Plain (14.5 miles) 1971
Harbor-South Utica (5.6 miles) 1971
Ilion-Little Falls (9.5 miles) 1973
Oneida Castle-Vernon (5.6 miles) Nov. 1, 1977
Ilion-Harbor (9.4 miles) 1982
Canastota-Oneida Castle (5.9 miles) Spring of 1982 or Oct 1982??
Chenango Branch abandonment dates:
Cazenovia-Earlville 1937
Oran-Cazenovia 1944
Manlius-Oran 1948
Fayettville-Manlius 1964
Dewitt-Fayettville 1977
Final abandonment of the Chenango Branch Syracuse-Dewitt 1983
Please feel free to add corrections or more specific dates.
Question # 6 I am not as familiar with the other parts of the W.S. as I am between the Utica-Syracuse corridor. I plan on bicycling the West Shore rail-trail starting at Little Falls next spring. Can anyone tell me how far east the canalway trail shares the old ROW? Also are there any remnants that I should keep an open eye out for; milemarkers, whistle posts, flangers, former customers, stations etc.??
Question # 7 I'm interested in any customers that were serviced on the West Shore from NJ to Buffalo, including the Chenango Branch. I am aware of some in CNY, but not so much outside of that area. Please list any that you are aware of. I'm also interested in the dates of passenger and freight station demolitons along the entire line.
I would also like to mention that I started a West Shore Flickr group last year. Feel free to join, and post anything related to the West Shore RR. Nothing is off limits as long as it is related to the West Shore.
https://www.flickr.com/groups/2285792@N23/pool/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I guess that's all I can think of for now.
Thanks-NYC81
Off the top of my head, here are a few immediate questions that I have.
Question # 1: Did the West Shore ever have stations in the cities of Utica or Buffalo, or did they use the NYC mainline stations? I know that there was an architecturally stunning station erected by the West Shore in Syracuse which unfortunately burned around 1910. After that, the W.S. used the NYC mainline station for all passenger traffic until it was discontinued in the 1930's. It seems unlikely that the W.S. did not have stations in the cities of Utica and Buffalo at one time, so if they did, I'd like to know where were they located, and if any photographs of the stations exist?
Question # 2: Was the original W.S. right-of-way through the city of Syracuse situated on the former ROW of the NYC main prior to the 1936 mainline elevation? Today it is now 690.
Question # 3: According to John Taibi's Oneida Railway Company book, "From Horsecars To Interubans," the West Shore discontinued its steam passenger service during 1907 when the Oneida R.W.Co. electrified the West Shore between Utica and Syracuse with the exception of occasional excursions to Sylvan Beach and so on. However, a 1909 timetable has scheduled stops at both the Oneida Castle and Canastota stations; clearly due to the interchanges with the O & W at Oneida Castle, and the Lehigh Valley at Canastota. So, if the timetable is correct, there were scheduled stops at both the O.C. and Canastota stations, which suggests to me that there was regular through passenger service between Utica and Syracuse after the 1907 interurban electrification. If this is not the case, then was passenger service detoured on to the NYC main between Utica and Syracuse? Or, did it only operate between Buffalo and Syracuse, and Utica and the River Division?
Question #4: After interurban service between Utica and Syracuse was discontinued on the electrified West Shore, passenger service did not return between the two cities. It did however continue from Syracuse west to Buffalo, and Utica to the east. Does anyone know if passenger service was cut at the same time in both directions, and the exact dates, or at least years of discontinuance? Something makes me think that it was sometime during 1933 or 1934?
Question # 5: While researching the W.S., I've gathered a number of abandonment dates. Please correct any of these dates if they are incorrect. I'd also like to know the exact month and day of abandonment if anyone has knowledge of such dates. I've heard conflicting stories of when the W.S. was abandoned between Canastota and Oneida Castle. I've heard that the final abandonment was in June of 1982, but have also read that it was Oct. 1982. I recall reading somewhere on this forum that the W.S. continued operations from Canastota to Wampsville up until 1983; possibly to service the fertilizer plant, but that was the only time I've heard this? I'd really like to know the exact date that W.S. discontinued service east of Canastota.
Here are the dates that I've acquired to far-
Mainline abandonment's on the West Shore:
Minoa-Canastota (12.9 miles) 1955
Belle Isle - Amboy (3.9 miles) 1955
Byron-Oakfield (10.24 miles) 1963
Chili Jct. - Byron (11.88 miles) 1959
Amboy-Wayneport (59.32 miles) 1959 (small portions near Lyons and Newark abandoned 1982)
Vernon-New York Mills (12.3 miles) 1964
Little Falls-South Ft. Plain (14.5 miles) 1971
Harbor-South Utica (5.6 miles) 1971
Ilion-Little Falls (9.5 miles) 1973
Oneida Castle-Vernon (5.6 miles) Nov. 1, 1977
Ilion-Harbor (9.4 miles) 1982
Canastota-Oneida Castle (5.9 miles) Spring of 1982 or Oct 1982??
Chenango Branch abandonment dates:
Cazenovia-Earlville 1937
Oran-Cazenovia 1944
Manlius-Oran 1948
Fayettville-Manlius 1964
Dewitt-Fayettville 1977
Final abandonment of the Chenango Branch Syracuse-Dewitt 1983
Please feel free to add corrections or more specific dates.
Question # 6 I am not as familiar with the other parts of the W.S. as I am between the Utica-Syracuse corridor. I plan on bicycling the West Shore rail-trail starting at Little Falls next spring. Can anyone tell me how far east the canalway trail shares the old ROW? Also are there any remnants that I should keep an open eye out for; milemarkers, whistle posts, flangers, former customers, stations etc.??
Question # 7 I'm interested in any customers that were serviced on the West Shore from NJ to Buffalo, including the Chenango Branch. I am aware of some in CNY, but not so much outside of that area. Please list any that you are aware of. I'm also interested in the dates of passenger and freight station demolitons along the entire line.
I would also like to mention that I started a West Shore Flickr group last year. Feel free to join, and post anything related to the West Shore RR. Nothing is off limits as long as it is related to the West Shore.
https://www.flickr.com/groups/2285792@N23/pool/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
I guess that's all I can think of for now.
Thanks-NYC81
My Flickr Photos http://www.flickr.com/photos/97630304@N02/sets/