Mount Washington Cog Railway

As much as railfans love steam, neither railfans NOR steam help tourist railroads balanace their sheet. Period!

Where does the Cog get their coal from?

greenus90 wrote:As much as railfans love steam, neither railfans NOR steam help tourist railroads balance their sheet. Period!

Tell that to Dave Conrad!
There's a reason the Valley RR calls itself the "Essex STEAM Train and Riverboat!"
Oh, and let's not forget Ross Rowland's famous quote:
"If it's pulled by a diesel, it's just a train. If it's pulled by steam, it's an event!"
Oh,...
and what about us "railfans" that work countless hours volunteering for BOTH museums AND "for profit" operations (like VRR) ???
I guess we don't count either?

Cosmo wrote:

greenus90 wrote:As much as railfans love steam, neither railfans NOR steam help tourist railroads balance their sheet, . Period!

Tell that to Dave Conrad!
There's a reason the Valley RR calls itself the "Essex STEAM Train and Riverboat!"
Oh, and let's not forget Ross Rowland's famous quote:
"If it's pulled by a diesel, it's just a train. If it's pulled by steam, it's an event!"
Oh,...
and what about us "railfans" that work countless hours volunteering for BOTH museums AND "for profit" operations (like VRR) ???
I guess we don't count either?

I think I misspoke. I meant to say "neither railfans NOR steam help tourist railroads balance their sheet IN ALL CASES (some exceptions, like Valley RR for example). Because while some RRs are only steam, steam is more expensive to run. And there are far too few railfans to make up for the exceptional cost of running steam full time."

The Valley RR is a perfect example that an all steam tourist line can make it. Certainly, the Cog also made it all steam until recently, probably because they could stay in front of their costs.

But, the Valley RR is not at all similiar to the Cog. I could be mistaken, but I do not think the Valley RR has to run on a wooden trestle for its entire length, like the Cog has to, with the exception of Jacob's ladder of course. So, the physical plant of the Cog is MUCH more expensive to maintain, I'm assuming. Also, the Valley isn't climbing up a mountain with the harsh environment that comes with it like the Cog has to. Another reason the physical plant is more expensive to maintain.

You are comparing apples to oranges, IMO.

I applaud and commend you and other railfans for volunteering at museums and tourist lines; if there were one near me, I would do the same. I also don't want steam disappear, but I've come to terms with the FACT that as I said, "As much as railfans love steam, neither railfans NOR steam help tourist railroads balance their sheet (added: pay their bills). Period!". Railfans are a minority. Steam railfans are a subset of that miniroty. The majority of paying customers (except for a railfan weekend I guess) are tourists looking to kill a few hours. They didn't come to see steam specifically, they came to ride a train. The Valley RR has the benefit of being all steam, as the Cog used to be. But, steam is VERY expensive to run. It's business, not personal.

Ok, that makes more sense.
Too be fair, I wrote that last night after getting back from working my tailbone off at the Valley.
(Good thing I saw the chiropractor this morning! )
But yes, steam IS more expensive to run and maintain, and the ROW upkeep is NOTHING like the Cog's.
Also, (and this is true comparing VRR to CSRR as well,) The Valley has a much closer and more convenient customer base to draw from. We run in a much less remote and much more densely populated area with many big population centers close by. This may be why the Valley has done so well. It is MUCH easier to hit VRR several times in one summer than the Cog.
By way of comparison, I have been to Maine numerous times over the years and worked, ridden and photographed there, as well as here in CT.
I STILL haven't been to the Cog. I keep saying "Maybe this summer," to wind up saying "maybe NEXT summer" time and again.

Cosmo wrote:Ok, that makes more sense.
Too be fair, I wrote that last night after getting back from working my tailbone off at the Valley.
(Good thing I saw the chiropractor this morning! )
But yes, steam IS more expensive to run and maintain, and the ROW upkeep is NOTHING like the Cog's.
Also, (and this is true comparing VRR to CSRR as well,) The Valley has a much closer and more convenient customer base to draw from. We run in a much less remote and much more densely populated area with many big population centers close by. This may be why the Valley has done so well. It is MUCH easier to hit VRR several times in one summer than the Cog.
By way of comparison, I have been to Maine numerous times over the years and worked, ridden and photographed there, as well as here in CT.
I STILL haven't been to the Cog. I keep saying "Maybe this summer," to wind up saying "maybe NEXT summer" time and again.

You truly must. It's a unique ride for sure, one you won't soon forget, steam or biodiesel powered!

Cosmo....go to the Cog!!!!! It is awesome! and the Valley is awesome too!

Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeellllllllllllllll................. maybe THIS summer will be THE summer.

My girlfriend and I plan to go in the middle of August. Have to look for reasonably priced accommodations tonight. We do not need a fancy place.
We would like to take in Conway also.

Rich

greenus90 wrote:As much as railfans love steam, neither railfans NOR steam help tourist railroads balanace their sheet. Period!

So did the cog lower their prices when they for the most part switched over??? I'd pay extra to pulled by steam for sure.

My father the transportation engineer once told me that the Cog was the only passenger service in either the US or the world that had been profitable. I don't remember if that was an average of its whole history, or meant profitable every year, or profitable in the early 1990s, or what, or where the information came from. I also don't know if it was correct, or even if he meant it to be correct or just a useful exaggeration. I also assume it was leaving out old RRs turned into tourist lines but counting the Cog because it's still operating for its original purpose. Still, with all that, it's a good point: pax service has rarely been very profitable for very long, so whatever tourist RRs, which are often pax only or mostly pax, do to keep afloat is good.

I read on the cog website that if you purchase a Cogger Club pass you recieve discounts for family and guests, does anyone know how much of a discount you get?

It's $5 off any additional ticket. You also get a cab ride in the diesel train with the Cogger Club pass.

I recently saw some pictures online of engine #6 "Kancamagus" at the base station by the coal bunker attached to a coach. Does anyone know if #6 has been making runs up the mountain?

tjm304 wrote:I recently saw some pictures online of engine #6 "Kancamagus" at the base station by the coal bunker attached to a coach. Does anyone know if #6 has been making runs up the mountain?

Yes, it was on the hill last week!