Motive Power update

any word on what will become of the sd70ms?

From the Trains Newsire article on the previous page:

SD70Ms 4050, 4052, and 4054 are parked pending rebuild/lease out or rebuild and use on line decision

scottychaos wrote:ok, I think I figured it out!
looking at more photos made it clear..

All the NYSW SD45's except for two (3618 and 3634) were called SD45's for all of their careers with the NYSW..

3618 went to Dansville to be rebuilt in September 2006..she was rebuilt but *not* repainted at Dansville.
because she was not repainted, she returned still saying SD45 on the cab..
She operated that way for several more years..
She was probably "officially" designated a SD45-2 after the rebuild, but wasn't labeled as such on the side of the
cab until the "error" was fixed in 2010..So she was a SD45-2 in late 2006, but wasnt marked as such until 2010.

3634 went to Dansville to be rebuilt in late 2006, returned in January 2007..she *was* repainted at Dansville,
and returned from Dansville with SD45-2 on the side of the cab..

I will make a note of this on the page:
http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/Scotty ... squehanna/

Scot

Probably the case because of the rebuild but, I wouldn't put too much stock into the loco distinction on the cab. 3010 is noted as an SD40-2 on the cab, when it clearly is an SD40T-2.

Sid Farkus wrote: Probably the case because of the rebuild but, I wouldn't put too much stock into the loco distinction on the cab. 3010 is noted as an SD40-2 on the cab, when it clearly is an SD40T-2.

well, now we are getting into another grey-area!
not quite the same issue as the SD45 vs. SD45-2, but a related issue..

There are two ways you can "label" a rebuilt locomotive..what it originally was, and what it still looks like today.
OR what its rebuilt model number is, and what the railroad chooses to call it after the rebuild.

There were real SD45's, and there were real SD45-2's, both built new by EMD..
the "real" SD45-2 did not have the well-known radiator flares of the SD45:

http://www.sdrm.org/roster/diesel/emd/h ... sf6472.jpg

So now we have two different kinds of SD45-2..we have the "real" SD45-2, as built new by EMD..
and we have rebuilt SD45's, that have been rebuilt to dash-2 specifications (or otherwise rebuilt) that many railroads are now calling SD45-2's..
(or SD45's, SD45-2, SD45-3, SD40-2, SD40M-2, etc..the same rebuilt SD45 can really have any designation the railroad chooses to use,
whatever makes the most sense to them, in the bigger picture of their entire roster)

Railroads usually want to ID the locomotive in terms of its operating characteristics..they dont care what the external carbody looks like..
while railfans are more comfortable identifying the locomotive by its original model name, especially if the external carbody was not extensively rebuilt,
and its a unique and easily identifiable carbody..like the SD45 and the SD40T-2..
railroads and railfans often have different ID goals and needs..different things make more sense to one group than the other..

The confusion comes about in the first place because railroads choose all kinds of different ways for "re-identifying" locomotives after they are rebuilt,
and there are no "rules" for it..a railroad can call a rebuilt locomotive anything it wants..
Union Pacific (and other railroads) use an "M" suffix for rebuilt locos..Some Erie Lackawanna SDP45's are now referred to as SD40M-2's..
here is one:

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=83620

It still has its distinctive EL SDP45 carbody, but no one calls them SDP45's anymore..
"M" for "Modified" I assume..
Sometimes we see a rebuilt SD40-2 referred to as a SD40-3..the new designations can be all over the map..

So for the rebuilt Susquehanna tunnel motors..what are they?
Are they still SD40T-2's? or are they what NYSW now has on the cab? SD40-2?
Technically we should call them what NYSW calls them..SD40-2..technically that is now what they are.
But yes, they obviously still have their tunnel motor carbodies, so technically they are still tunnel motors as well!

in weird way, they are both..officially, according to NYSW, they are SD40-2's..
But..it makes sense for us, as railfans, to continue to call them SD40T-2's..because that makes the most sense for us..
they are obviously still tunnel motors.. for railfans, dropping the "T" makes no sense..for the railroad, it makes perfect sense.
Just like the railroads have no official rules they need to follow, we, as railfans, also have no official rules we need to follow either..

Pretty much everyone refers to the ex-Erie Lackawanna SDP45's operating with UP as SD40M-2's now..
because that is what UP calls them..no one calls them SDP45's anymore because railfans use the "official" UP roster to identify locomotives,
because that makes sense in the context of UP's gigantic roster..UP is the final word in that case..

But on the NYSW, a much smaller railroad with FAR fewer locomotives,
there is nothing wrong with railfans continuing to refer to the four tunnel motors as SD40T-2's..
because it differentiates them from "real" SD40-2's..im sure railfans will continue to call them SD40T-2's for as long as they exist..

For my NYSW roster:
http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/Scotty ... squehanna/
I will continue to label the SD40T-2's as SD40T-2's..and I will still call the SD45's SD45's..
it would be too confusing to begin referring to the tunnel motors as SD40-2's..
NYSW can have their model designations, and we can have ours..IMO there is no conflict in this..

Scot

Interesting Scot, but the 3014 was rebuilt in Dansville, and they lettered that as an SD40T-2. When the tunnel motors undergone repainting and rebuilding by AMP, I always thought that 3010 was incorrectly lettered. The paint job, and lettering is a little off on that unit IIRC (or it's the two chop nosed SD40s I'm thinking of).

Very good post Scott, just wanted to make a clarification

a "no dash" (SD45 for example) vs a -2 vs. -3 are TOTALLY different.

A "no dash" generally used relays to control various functions and systems of the locomotive

A -2 uses various individual self contained computer cards to control the many differnet functions and systems of the locomotive

A -3 uses a microprocessor CPU to replace the individual computer cards. Im not sure if they all use them, but most use the EM2000 computer from EMD.

An as built SD45 from the factory would have the familar flared radiators. An SD45-2 from the factory would not. However, a SD45 could have been upgraded to an SD45-2 with no external appearance change. Some are even upgraded further to SD45-3s.

But its only called an SD45 (or SD45-2, or -3) if it still has the V20 prime mover in it. Thats pretty universal across all railroads, except of course, NS with the ex-EL SD45-2s (1700-1705), which have had their V20 taken out and a V16 put in and maybe a few others rolling around out there. They are essentially SD40-2s now, but ive been told that the NS company info on them was never changed, and still shows them as 3600 HP, even tho they don't have that. Im not certain of that.

The tunnel motor designation meant something to the Southern Pacific when those locos were on there roster, it meant that they had the different cooling system for the tunnels, and should be used on trains that went into tunnels Meant a LOT to the power dispatcher when making up locos for trains! Yes, that the original designation from EMD, but it meant more to the railroad (SP and Rio Grande) than anything else. It dont' mean squat to the NYSW, and they just refer to them as SD40-2s as thats really what they are. The shop forces im sure know the difference and that is probably the only group on the NYSW that the "T-2" means anything to, as it might require different parts or different procedures to fix the cooling systems on them.

Sometimes when a loco is rebuilt into another entirely different model, they put "extra" letters on, like UP did with the SD45s into SD40M-2s, also sometimes when they are rebuilt by an outside agency with regards to keeping the locos organized with regard to warantee work, like BN (now BNSF) did with the GP30/35 rebuilds. I don't remember off hand, but they were rebuilt into like GP39E, GP39M and O I think? Each one meant they were rebuilt by a different company (EMD, Morrison-Knudson, and maybe in house? Im not sure). So while trackside, it looks like a GP30, its no longer one internally, and the classification means a LOT of info to the company...

GP20s probably have no future. Early turbo on those units is not a great design and failure-prone. Would have to convert them to roots-blown and make them essentially a GP18 to be reliable - which is doable and not expensive, but expensive enough that you can buy already running engines that can go right to work for the same money. Also, I'm not sure what that would do to you as far as EPA stuff goes. Now why the RR didn't do that, who knows, perhaps they already knew they'd have to step up to a little newer power at the behest of CSX and NS.

lvrr325 wrote: Now why the RR didn't do that, who knows, perhaps they already knew they'd have to step up to a little newer power at the behest of CSX and NS.

Well... you gotta keep the boss happy!

Went by Binghamton Yard today and saw that the 3618 has been moved on the outside house track up the the house and was coupled up to CEFX 3108. Had a couple of engine doors open the other day. Anyone know what's up with it?

^TrainsNewsire:

SD45-2 3618 & 3634 and SD40-2 3010 will remain stored serviceable pending traffic changes

thebigham wrote:^TrainsNewsire:

SD45-2 3618 & 3634 and SD40-2 3010 will remain stored serviceable pending traffic changes

Yep.

NYSW SD60 #3810 made the first of several test runs on the Paducah & Louisville RR today, arriving in Louisville,KY this morning. It will head back to Paducah tonight. Not sure how many runs will be made.

I'm posting this as a queston so is the genset (2009) still being tested? I say a video from a few days ago with it on a CSX train that left Ridgefield Park.

The Q moved the dead units down to the bridge over RT7 I believe it's RT7 to make room for the frack sand off loaders and scale.3810 was next to the shop.

Found some pictures I took of the Yellowjackets earlier this year, around early May I believe, before they were moved east.

2064, 2066
http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk24 ... dc801f.jpg

4050, 3634
http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk24 ... bf0d6f.jpg

2062
http://i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk24 ... ee5fdd.jpg

Can't remember which ones the others were, but I believe 4052 and 3010 were both there.