Delaware and Raritan River Railroad-General Discussion

(tongue in cheek) Why I remember when some were saying this was gonna be a complete disaster - or at least implying it.

It's great seeing things reactivated and the ongoing updates here. Here's a link for the tax map of the property at the connection with the southern. Kind of gives an idea of how much room for the wye legs. http://njparcels.com/property/1315/22/1

I wouldnt get too excited about new consignees along the line... Id love to see it, but state of NJ has been busy chasing businesses out of the state. The selling point is that rail will take trucks off the roads, but the pinheads seem to want to close businesses down completely.

I too am skeptical, though for more than just NJs attitude towards the sort of industry that gets rail service. There’s not too many people in NJ nowadays who deal with the huge amount of material one railcar transports. For these smaller companies, one truck here or there suits them just fine and they won’t have to build a very expensive rail siding that will also need costly maintenance to get their shipments. Switches alone are at least 200 grand. If dealing with C&D, such spurs might be built to their high standards which also adds a little bit to the cost. (Class 2 with all new materials. Some exceptions for rail conditions) You can circumvent this with transloading, but only to a certain point.

Additionally, as far as trains go it’s also somewhat competitive in this part of NJ in regards to who you’d want to get service from if your a brand new customer looking to have a property near a railroad. You can get service from C&D and for the most part have no issues with the service, and most likely it would be cheaper than trucks if you deal with a lot of materials, but there’s weight and size limits on cars right now, and you have to pay NJT fees since any freight car to/from the DRRR has to cross the Raritan River Bridge. The transfer process to DRRR also isn’t very efficient, and the one to Jamesburg seems kinda odd lately. Not as bad as OI-16 though.

Neighboring Raritan Central, minus Amtrak fees and possibly the Conrail transfer, doesn’t suffer from these issues. They also have a much larger transload capacity and services their entire network 6 days a week.
It’s actually so well set up in there that I’ve recently discovered the Lakewood Israelis source their kosher foods from them, vs bringing into Lakewood directly and delivering from somewhere on the Southern.

So who do you choose? C&D or someone else? Hell there’s even some Conrail trains left where the service hasn’t gone to hell yet as crazy as that sounds! I know there’s more to consider here than who’s the better railroad to deal with, but even so…

There are also those around here who, for whatever reason, just don’t believe in rail shipping. Take John Blewitt for example. He could bring his scrap loads by truck to the Southern Secondary and load them into cars. Instead? He pays SIMS metals in Morrisville PA to come get the loads, and then they they put it in railcars to go wherever.


There are still a few people they could pick up. Brick Recycling, Cambridge Pavingstones, maybe even the tar plant in Farmingdale if they truly want service.

I say they should improve the team tracks in this area and turn them into small transloading stations. They did this in Kenvil and they managed to pick up a guy who transloads bricks. Could be the same down here, but with different materials.

And if they REALLY wanna boost their profits I know a certain someone down in the Pinelands who’s been waiting far too long to move his big, heavy trains of a certain coarse yellow substance! HINT HINT.

Im thinking more of industry using their own siding , or a team track thats within a few miles of their location.

Drtiving 50 miles in NJ traffic to transfer to a railcar seems pretty ridiculous, unless u have a really small operation.

Having a siding built can cost 300K, but for a commitment of so many cars per month, a RR will put in a siding for free..
Some shortlines have let consignees unload cars spotted on the main, if its in an area thats not too busy. Getting traffic is the lifeline of a shortline.

Under Conrail they only covered the siding costs if a customer received 8 cars a week or more. I do not know if C&D has any similar arrangement. C&D also doesn’t allow loading/unloading directly on the main, according to the FAQ on their website.

As far as this area goes you don’t have to go 50 miles if your just transloading. Raritan Center to Lakewood is only 35 ish miles.

CharlieL wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 4:29 pm (tongue in cheek) Why I remember when some were saying this was gonna be a complete disaster - or at least implying it.

Took the words right out of my mouth...

guda wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 7:32 pm It's great seeing things reactivated and the ongoing updates here. Here's a link for the tax map of the property at the connection with the southern. Kind of gives an idea of how much room for the wye legs. http://njparcels.com/property/1315/22/1

This is what I saw lots of encroachment on Railroad land

So, let me get this straight - - - what we are seeing is a disaster, and not a minor miracle comeback? Guess I should break out my sackcloth and ashes.

Not a disaster. The Farmingdale to Freehold project is going to do a lot of good for this area even if they don’t pick up any customers. Those on the Southern no longer have to pay the NJT fees for movement between Red Bank and South Amboy, and they will soon have access to heavier cars. Something Woodhaven will probably take advantage of right away since they’ve been complaining about the weight issue for years. Tanker guy, whoever he is, will also be able to put more ethanol in his cars than he does now. There may be more frequent service too, but that remains to be seen.

Also, I received a picture this morning showing a large amount of pole cars sitting in freehold again. EH Allen has been getting way more cars lately…

Bracdude181 wrote: ↑Fri Feb 10, 2023 10:00 pm I too am skeptical, though for more than just NJs attitude towards the sort of industry that gets rail service. There’s not too many people in NJ nowadays who deal with the huge amount of material one railcar transports. For these smaller companies, one truck here or there suits them just fine and they won’t have to build a very expensive rail siding that will also need costly maintenance to get their shipments. Switches alone are at least 200 grand. If dealing with C&D, such spurs might be built to their high standards which also adds a little bit to the cost. (Class 2 with all new materials. Some exceptions for rail conditions) You can circumvent this with transloading, but only to a certain point.

Additionally, as far as trains go it’s also somewhat competitive in this part of NJ in regards to who you’d want to get service from if your a brand new customer looking to have a property near a railroad. You can get service from C&D and for the most part have no issues with the service, and most likely it would be cheaper than trucks if you deal with a lot of materials, but there’s weight and size limits on cars right now, and you have to pay NJT fees since any freight car to/from the DRRR has to cross the Raritan River Bridge. The transfer process to DRRR also isn’t very efficient, and the one to Jamesburg seems kinda odd lately. Not as bad as OI-16 though.

Neighboring Raritan Central, minus Amtrak fees and possibly the Conrail transfer, doesn’t suffer from these issues. They also have a much larger transload capacity and services their entire network 6 days a week.
It’s actually so well set up in there that I’ve recently discovered the Lakewood Israelis source their kosher foods from them, vs bringing into Lakewood directly and delivering from somewhere on the Southern.

So who do you choose? C&D or someone else? Hell there’s even some Conrail trains left where the service hasn’t gone to hell yet as crazy as that sounds! I know there’s more to consider here than who’s the better railroad to deal with, but even so…

There are also those around here who, for whatever reason, just don’t believe in rail shipping. Take John Blewitt for example. He could bring his scrap loads by truck to the Southern Secondary and load them into cars. Instead? He pays SIMS metals in Morrisville PA to come get the loads, and then they they put it in railcars to go wherever.


There are still a few people they could pick up. Brick Recycling, Cambridge Pavingstones, maybe even the tar plant in Farmingdale if they truly want service.

I say they should improve the team tracks in this area and turn them into small transloading stations. They did this in Kenvil and they managed to pick up a guy who transloads bricks. Could be the same down here, but with different materials.

And if they REALLY wanna boost their profits I know a certain someone down in the Pinelands who’s been waiting far too long to move his big, heavy trains of a certain coarse yellow substance! HINT HINT.

Transloading only works if the consignee has the need for a quantity of product that can be shipped by rail and if the shipper has access to ship by rail. There are many industries that do not have/want/require rail service and therefore utilize the highway network to move their materials. Trucking is much more flexible than rail. Transloading also adds the cost of trucking the materials from the transloading site to the consignee location.

The Raritan Central's days are numbered. The number of cars moving between Oak Island and Metuchen have be on the decline. Their idea of an intermodal facility at their "port" sounds nice on paper. Throw in the costs of running a port facility and see how business does. From what my guys told me, the owner of Raritan Central is extremely anti-union. These longshoremen that work these port jobs start out making over $100k a year with extremelygood union representation. A Raritan Central crew member makes under $60k a year with no representation.

As for the John Blewitt business. When scoping out the area prior to C&D takeover we saw this junk yard. They may have a contract with SIMS to move their material. SIMS has many agreements such as these. Such agreements work for smaller businesses.

Is Raritan Central gonna be the one running the port and not someone else?

Edit: The DOT sponsored the port designation with the primary developer Federal Business Centers, who owns the industrial park. Wouldn’t they be the operators?

AceMacSD wrote:Transloading only works if the consignee has the need for a quantity of product that can be shipped by rail and if the shipper has access to ship by rail. There are many industries that do not have/want/require rail service and therefore utilize the highway network to move their materials. Trucking is much more flexible than rail. Transloading also adds the cost of trucking the materials from the transloading site to the consignee location.

The Raritan Central's days are numbered. The number of cars moving between Oak Island and Metuchen have be on the decline. Their idea of an intermodal facility at their "port" sounds nice on paper. Throw in the costs of running a port facility and see how business does. From what my guys told me, the owner of Raritan Central is extremely anti-union. These longshoremen that work these port jobs start out making over $100k a year with extremelygood union representation. A Raritan Central crew member makes under $60k a year with no representation.

As for the John Blewitt business. When scoping out the area prior to C&D takeover we saw this junk yard. They may have a contract with SIMS to move their material. SIMS has many agreements such as these. Such agreements work for smaller businesses.

Finally, the mystical sand trains. Hasn't this prank gone on long enough? Also, consider that the competition has the advantage. Lakewood to Lakehurst most likely will not be returned to service while the Cape May Lines has any stake.

AMEN

@jdh what was that other spur they rehabbed? The one track that branches off before metuchen yard?