My PATH Pics from April 8th- PA5 Included

Discussion relating to the past and present operations of the NYC Subway, PATH, and Staten Island Railway (SIRT).

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FamousNYLover
Posts: 34
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2009 11:52 am

My PATH Pics from April 8th- PA5 Included

Post by FamousNYLover »


Allan
Posts: 421
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 7:10 am
Location: Bronx, NY

Re: My PATH Pics from April 8th- PA5 Included

Post by Allan »

Very, very nice photos, Yuki.

I just hope you know that it is illegal to photograph on PATH property (on platforms, inside the railcars etc) unless you have written permission from PATH and are accompanied by someone from the PATH main office. The rules are posted in each station.

Photos 1, 2, 6, 7, 8 and 9 were definitely taken on PATH property. (Don't worry - PATH won't hear about it from me)
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"IX. Photography and similar activity.
A. The taking or making of photographs of any portion of the PATH system is prohibited except as provided herein.

B. The taking or making of films, video recordings, and drawings or other visual depictions are subject to the same prohibitions, restrictions and procedures as are applicable to photography.

C. Photography which involves any of the following must comply with the requirements of the Extended Photography Policy and Procedures, in addition to these Rules:
1. Exclusive use of any area or any railcar or part of a railcar.
2. Exclusion of members of the public, PATH or Port Authority personnel, or PATH or Port Authority contractors from any area or any railcar or part of a railcar.
3. Use of equipment other than handheld equipment with self-contained power sources.

D.
1. No person may take a photograph of any portion of the PATH system unless he or she is accompanied by a representative of PATH.
2. No photograph shall be taken of any specific location, device or structure if such representative advises that such photography is prohibited because it will create an image which could be used to aid in the planning of an attempt to disable, destroy, avoid or circumvent any operational, safety, security, evacuation or emergency response device, structure or procedure, or which could be used in the planning of an attempt to commit an act of violence or intentionally cause disruption of rail service or public panic within the PATH system or a part thereof. If possible, a suggestion for alternative photography in PATH which would not have such an effect shall be made by the PATH representative.
3. A photographer and all members of his or her party shall follow the directions of such representative made for the purpose of preventing unreasonable interference with PATH operations, maintenance and construction, and to preserve the health and safety of the photographer or others.
4. A photographer may protest any direction made pursuant to paragraph (2) or (3) in the same manner as an appeal from the denial of a permit as set forth herein.

E. No person may take any photograph within PATH unless he or she has been issued a permit therefore by PATH as set forth herein.
1. A permit application shall be submitted in writing no later than thirty-six (36) hours preceding the commencement of the activities for which the permit is sought, and no earlier than seven (7) days preceding the commencement of the activities for which the permit is sought.
2. Permit application shall be submitted in person to the PATH Permit Administrator, or the designee thereof, during the hours of 9:00 AM to 10:30 AM and 1:30 PM to 3:30 PM, Monday through Friday, excluding holidays.
3. The permit application shall set forth the type, time, location and duration of activities to be conducted, and the name, address and telephone number of the person making the request (in the case of a group, it shall be sufficient to supply the name, address, and telephone number of the person who can be contacted if problems arise concerning the granting of the request). If a person making the application indicates an affiliation with an organization or group, the name and address of a local representative of the organization or group to act as a liaison will be requested; however, refusal to provide such information shall not be grounds for denial of a permit.
4. Permits will be granted on a first-come, first serve basis depending on the availability of escorts. An application will be denied in whole or in part only if: (a) the presence of visitors in a requested location would unreasonably interfere with PATH operations, maintenance and construction; (b) if the conduct cannot be performed without creating an image which could be used to aid in the planning of an attempt to disable, destroy, avoid or circumvent any operational, safety, security, evacuation or emergency response device, structure or procedure, or which could be used in the planning of an attempt to commit an act of violence or intentionally cause disruption of rail service or public panic within the PATH system or a part thereof; (c) if the location requested may not be visited safely by persons other than PATH or other operation, construction or maintenance personnel; (d) the application is incomplete; or, (e) the application discloses that the activities to be performed thereunder will violate these Rules.
5. A permit will be issued, or the application denied, by the PATH Permit Administrator or a designee thereof, no later than 5:00 PM of the day following submission of the application, excluding Saturdays, Sundays and holidays recognized by PATH. The reason for the denial of an application or any part thereof shall be set forth in writing.
6. (a) Upon the denial of any application for a permit, or the failure to issue a permit by 5:00 PM of the day following submission of the application, excluding Saturdays, Sundays and holidays recognized by PATH, the applicant may submit a written appeal to the PATH General Manager, or a designee thereof, setting forth the reasons why the application should be granted.
(b) An appeal shall be submitted in person to the PATH Permit Administrator, or a designee thereof, during the hours of 9:00 AM to 5:00 PM, Monday through Friday, excluding holidays. The PATH Permit Administrator, or the designee thereof, shall cause the appeal to be delivered to the General Manager, or a designee thereof.
7. A written decision denying the appeal, or issuing a permit, shall be made no later than 5:00 PM of the day following submission of the appeal, excluding Saturdays, Sundays and holidays recognized by PATH. If no decision is issued by 5:00 PM of the day following submission of the appeal, excluding Saturdays, Sundays and holidays recognized by PATH, the appeal shall be deemed to be denied on the basis of the original decision denying the application.
8. A decision made in response to an application for a permit or an appeal of a denial of a permit shall not disclose information which could be used to aid in the planning of an attempt to disable, destroy, avoid or circumvent any operational, safety, security, evacuation or emergency response device, structure or procedure, or which could be used in the planning of an attempt to commit an act of violence or intentionally cause disruption of rail service or a public panic within the PATH system or a part thereof.
9. Any person whose application for a permit has been denied may seek review of the final decision denying such application in a proceeding commenced pursuant to Article 78 of the Civil Practice Laws and Rules of the State of New York, or action in lieu of prerogative writ in the courts of the State of New Jersey.
10. The General Manager of PATH, or in his or her absence, the person designated to act in his or her stead for general management purposes, may withdraw or suspend a permit for photography in the event of, and during the pendency of, an emergency condition such as a snowstorm, fire, accident, power failure, transportation carrier schedule interruption, or other condition of such nature and character that the conduct of permitted activities would cause a danger to persons or property during the pendency of such emergency condition.
11. For the purpose of this regulation, "holidays" refers to the days set forth in VII (D) (13) above."

nyrmetros
Posts: 241
Joined: Mon Mar 24, 2008 9:59 am

Re: My PATH Pics from April 8th- PA5 Included

Post by nyrmetros »

I don't like the new PATH trains. They took away my front window viewing area. That's the enjoyment factor..........

Head-end View
Posts: 2702
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 10:00 pm
Location: The second row on a SEPTA Silverliner V

Re: My PATH Pics from April 8th- PA5 Included

Post by Head-end View »

Amen to that nyrmetros. They've absolutely ruined the ride. I even e-mailed the Port Authority about it thru their website. I pointed out that many riders, not just railfans, enjoyed the front view. They politely explained in their reply that they evaluated several different cab configurations and that this was the only one that worked in terms of mounting and installing necessary equipment. No explanantion offered why there couldn't have been a window in the door. I think the lack of a door window is Port Authority post-9/11 paranoia. Remember, they don't even have trash cans in their stations anymore.

lostsoul
Posts: 38
Joined: Sun Nov 01, 2009 10:25 am
Location: somewhere in nj

Re: My PATH Pics from April 8th- PA5 Included

Post by lostsoul »

why did they put the handicap area where the conductor stands?

Allan
Posts: 421
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 2004 7:10 am
Location: Bronx, NY

Re: My PATH Pics from April 8th- PA5 Included

Post by Allan »

lostsoul wrote:why did they put the handicap area where the conductor stands?
To give people in wheelchairs a separate area from those who can walk. That way the wheelchairs are not blocking the doors of the aisle.

madcrow
Posts: 238
Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2005 11:45 am

Re: My PATH Pics from April 8th- PA5 Included

Post by madcrow »

Nice job documenting one of the most paranoid and least fan-friendly systems in the US!

R36 Combine Coach
Posts: 5493
Joined: Mon Jun 09, 2008 8:51 pm

Re: My PATH Pics from April 8th- PA5 Included

Post by R36 Combine Coach »

Allan wrote:
lostsoul wrote:why did they put the handicap area where the conductor stands?
To give people in wheelchairs a separate area from those who can walk. That way the wheelchairs are not blocking the doors of the aisle.
On the PA1/PA2/PA3s, they were added when overhauled by MK in 1987.
Since my friend continues to chain smoke nonstop, she is probably an Alco.

Head-end View
Posts: 2702
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 10:00 pm
Location: The second row on a SEPTA Silverliner V

Re: My PATH Pics from April 8th- PA5 Included

Post by Head-end View »

Madcrow, what you're saying about PATH being paranoid and railfan unfriendly might be true now in the post-9/11 era, but it wasn't always like that. I remember a day maybe 20 years ago when I was taking photos from the front window of the train and the PATH conductor approached me to inquire my reason for taking photos. When I explained about being a buff, he was very friendly and we had a good chat for a few minutes about the signal system, etc. Those were the days........

nyrmetros
Posts: 241
Joined: Mon Mar 24, 2008 9:59 am

Re: My PATH Pics from April 8th- PA5 Included

Post by nyrmetros »

The new trains are so damn boring not having a front window to look out of. dam it.

Head-end View
Posts: 2702
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 10:00 pm
Location: The second row on a SEPTA Silverliner V

Re: My PATH Pics from April 8th- PA5 Included

Post by Head-end View »

Yes, it is a real shame. Especially because they are otherwise nice trains. If they had the forward view I would think they were great trains. :(

Terry Kennedy
Posts: 143
Joined: Tue May 31, 2005 5:24 pm
Location: NYC

Re: My PATH Pics from April 8th- PA5 Included

Post by Terry Kennedy »

Head-end View wrote:Madcrow, what you're saying about PATH being paranoid and railfan unfriendly might be true now in the post-9/11 era, but it wasn't always like that. I remember a day maybe 20 years ago when I was taking photos from the front window of the train and the PATH conductor approached me to inquire my reason for taking photos. When I explained about being a buff, he was very friendly and we had a good chat for a few minutes about the signal system, etc. Those were the days........
It seems to depend on the particular crew. I've seen conductors tell people they can't take pictures, when the people were just taking pictures of each other (and just happened to be in a PATH car at the time). I've also seen people taking railfan pictures and not get hassled.

In general, I haven't had any problems getting officially permitted for photography. I've been in the fortunate situation of being able to answer "yup, got a permit" when asked by a conductor if I had one. I've found the crews to be generally quite cooperative in those cases - I've asked an engineer to run with the high beams on (generally a matter of individual engineer preference, as long as they drop them when within sight of another train). I've had a conductor drop the window sash on the end door so I wouldn't get reflections from the glass. I've been down at track level at diverging switch points and photographed trains going by - which requires the crews to be alerted, so they don't worry that someone is going to get run over, and so they don't have to worry about being blinded by some clown with a camera flash (having been on the receiving end, getting flashed is not fun).

The only time I've had a request denied was when I asked to shoot a video of the whole post-9/11 33RD/HOB run for my Hoboken Historical Museum H&M / PATH exhibition. I kept getting alternating yes / no answers depending on who was asked. But this was less than a year and a half after 9/11, so it was understandable.

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