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  • GC-Mitchell Field Secondary going bye bye???

  • Discussion of the past and present operations of the Long Island Rail Road.
Discussion of the past and present operations of the Long Island Rail Road.

Moderator: Liquidcamphor

 #2482  by NIMBYkiller
 
Got word today from a friend that a LIRR crew member workin on the circus train said the future of the secondary is grim. With all the rumors floating around the Ringling Bro's ditchin the train for trucks in the NYC area, this only seems like it's becomming more and more of a reality.

Anyone here know for sure or heard anything else regarding the secondary? It'd truely be a shame to lose any more of the old central. They already ripped out all but one track at the old yard at Stewart and Quentin Roosevelt.

 #2511  by Nasadowsk
 
Poor planning, IMHO. It brushes past Roosevelt Field, it goes pretty close to Hempstead. Cut it off from the LIRR, and you'd have a good amount of ROW for a somewhat useable LRT starter line.

Freight use? Why bother. It's an uphill battle, the LIRR's connections to everthing else suck, there's few (any?) real viable customers, and frankly, how many of them are NOT time sensitive - i.e., they can deal with the few extra weeks and unpredictability?

(Ditto for a freight terminal on the Cerro Wire site, which IMHO is just screaming to become a big park and ride facility, which if done right, could minimalize neighborhood impact, yet remove a good number of cars from the road)

The real trouble with the remaining stub on the line is it goes from somewhere to pretty much nowhere of any real use, unless you swing it up to Nassau Collusium / Hofstra, or to Roosevelt field, the later would be pretty useless for the LIRR (very expensive, questionable ridership potential), the former wouldn't really generate much traffic unless it was direct (read: electric) service from NYC to the ever exciting Islanders games, and typical events. Even then, it'd be limited in use - only able to capture a thin section of the potential LI market, and let's face it, the home teams aren't going to pull big City numbers anyway. It'd be a killer way to get students to Hofstra, though, and could run as a "Princton Shuttle", though really a DLRV would be better in that usage (much cheaper).

It's annoying, too, because it's quite a bit of track, it just has no real application that stands out and justifies the investment. IMHO, the Nassau Loop BS is just that - I don't get where the big number of riders for such a loop system would be - shoppers want their urban assault vehicles, I doubt the local population would have any real use for it either.

 #2563  by Knife-Switch
 
Actually, NYAR was interested in using that line for freight. I believe somehow it gets back to the Recycling Center by the Mall. However the efforts of some affluent Garden City neighbors put the Keebosh on that.

Seems Muffy and Buffy don't want those messy trains in their backyards and they got the lawyers to keep them out.

Now there is a story that a transportation editor could do some research on, since preventing the freight from hauling ash out of the recycle center only means more trucks on the local roads doing the same.

 #2617  by LI Loco
 
Do we really need to see that OBSCENE photo again? What point could you possibly be making with it?

 #2643  by JMBethpage
 
I agree, that photo has no business here. btw, the man with the gun was the police chief of Saigon and he presently owns a Vietnamese restaurant in Los Angeles.

 #2644  by NIMBYkiller
 
There are still quite a few areas that could recieve freight rail service.

And as far as passenger service go, this whole nassau hub study crap could definately use this line. As of now, all the plans are just for a system of people movers and w/e around the area near NCC, RFM, the Source, etc. The only major transit connection is at RFM. That has to be the worst planning ever. I've got an idea for a 2 rail line service. It'd require some new construction and w/e, but hey, it'd probaby be cheaper than a monorail or some of the other things they plannin on. Here:

Mineola-Stewart Av(Garden City)-Clinton Rd-Quentin Roosevelt BLVD-Mitchell Field-Hofstra University-EAB Plaza-Mariott Hotel/Nassau Collesium-NCC-Selfridge Av-Quentin Roosevelt BLVD-Clinton Rd-Stewart Av(Garden City)-Mineola

The above line would be sort of a loop service. The section between Mineola and Stewart Av(Garden City) would use the old ROW. Now, north of Old Country Rd, the ROW is blocked by a building. Since it's not too far of a distance, and I'm pretty sure the water table is pretty far below the surface in that area, going underground from there wouldn't be hard. It'd only be about 3 blocks. The only other major construction would be the loop from Endo BLVD, down to the EAB plaza, up to Mitchell Field, and back to the secondary at Quentin Roosevelt BLVD. Still, it's doable and cheaper than a monorail. Also, if the circus continues to come to Nassau Collesium via rail, a rail yard could be built for them at the collesium.

Hempstead-Country Life Press-Clinton Rd-Stewart Av(East Garden City)-Roosevelt Field Mall-Fortunoff-Ellison Av(Source Mall)-Merrick Av

Only major construction would be extending the line from East Gate to Merrick Av through a bunch of parking lots(I think they're pretty lightly used).

Passengers can transfer between lines at either Clinton Rd or at the Stewart Av(East Garden City) and Quentin Roosevelt BLVD stations(this is where the line splits, where the old yard used to be. A walkway would be constructed over the new tracks for the new yard).

Also, where will the trains be stored? Simple. That old yard at the corner of Quentin Roosevelt BLVD and Stewart Av(the station mentioned above). The line would get light use, so probably only say about, 10 cars(2 cars on each train) would work. They could all fit in that yard. Also, only 2 trains per line would run, with one left over just in case(maybe a second trainset as well, idk).

It is the perfect area for a yard b/c it is more or less centraly located on the hub system, that way response time in case of a mechanical failure or w/e that takes one train OOS will not be longer at one end of the system than at the other.

 #2653  by LI Loco
 
>the man with the gun was the police chief of Saigon and he presently owns a Vietnamese restaurant in Los Angeles.

Well I certainly hope that photo isn't on display in his restaurant. It would make me ill.

When I was lived in South Carolina, there was a new Italian restaurant whose walls were decorated with photos of "mob hits." I never want back, and I don't think the place stayed open too long.

 #2735  by 9C1LT1
 
If you want a rail yard, the area just east of the Mariott Hotel is big enough. Its now a Nature Preserve, but it used to be part of Mitchell AFB. Problem is, I found out that area of the base was the old Weapons dump. Thats why it wasn't built on... Good Reason I think! It would be nice to see service restored to the line. But the way everyone sounds, I don't think its gonna happen.

 #2752  by NIMBYkiller
 
Ya mean for the circus train, or the hub system? The yard for the hub system is pretty much there and is almost a perfect spot.

As for the circus train yard, I think the closer to the collesium, the better. Instead of using a nature preserve or w/e, use part of the parking lot that is hardly used already.
 #2757  by JoeLIRR
 
EX. NIMBYKiller, it sounds like a good idea to restore the CRRLI. I totally agree with you on that. besides iv had my own plans that were reletivily similat to yours. how ever- my master plan would be to re-build the entire line out to Bethpage. Over time ie will dramatically reduce traffic on the main line. the CRRLI cauld handle all the NYA freight and the Greenport & Montauk trains.

Ofcourse there is no revenue and the revenue amount is going to be unshure of... but when the trains are stopping closer to home, the passengers (INClUDING THE NIMBY'S) will use the trains.

i.e. ALL THE NIMBY'S WILL MOAN & GRONE ABOUT THE NOISE, AND THE TRAFFIC. BUT AVTER THEY GROW A "BRASS SET" THEY WILL STOPING BITCHING AND USE THE TRAINS AS WELL...

(THEY WILL ALL BITCH IN THE BEGINNING, BUT IN THE END THEY WILL ALL COME TO THE SAME CONCLUSION, THE TRAINS REALLY HELP US )

 #2790  by thrdkilr
 
NIMBY, to be young is to dream.....the Mitchell hasn't been the same since it lost Newsday and the A&P, they were at least 50% of the frieght. You have to be honest, the NIMBY's didn't have anything to do with that. Ours seems to be a sad pursuit, lines go away and seldom new ones are added....NIMBY think of the stories you can tell people in this forum 30 years from now about the Circus Train!
 #2815  by Legio X
 
The chief of the Vietnamese National Police was executing a Viet Cong terrorist, who, along with the other members of his cell, had been caught after executing the family of the chief's deputy commander. They also raped his daughters, one of whom was 9, before executing them. This is'nt a case of an innocent person being killed by the police, but rather a terrorist getting what he deserved....unfortunately, it was'nt reported like this in the American and European press. I saw the photo used by Knife-Switch first on the LIRR forum in the "Newsday Lurker" topic. Knife-Switch's intention was to show the pernicious nature of the press, and their way of reporting things the way they want to, and not necessarily how they happened. Let's be careful with how we post on here, because this is obviously a resource for those with anti-rail agendas, in the press, community groups, etc. Let's not give them ammunition. Let's not cost any railroaders their jobs on NYA or LIRR. Let's stick to facts and not conjecture.

 #2820  by RRChef
 
I agree with Legio on this and to further drive home the point, everyone should take a look at the thread LIRR 160 NTSB Report which contains the report listed yesterday by the NTSB as while as an article written by the reporter in question about the report. Left quite a bit out, didn't he?

 #2879  by spiker 1
 
gc secondary should in use for many years not for freight, but for staging or storing M/W equiptment(ballast,concrete tie,rail cars) only because lower holban yard is at capacity. We have used it to yard our track machinery to do work on the Hempstead branch. Work trains might be stored there for the up coming work at Queens interlocking. Also crossings have been refurbished recently by the college and behind the post office.
 #2954  by JoeLIRR
 
spiker 1,

you're right about the crossing behind the college and the post office, also prior to the circus train ariving there has been some tie replacement in that area.

Over all the LIRR & MTA are loosing out on alot of potencial revenue by not re-activating the line to bethpage.
The MTA/LIRR are building a 3rd track on the main line, where it bairly fits, never mind increase the potencial for more accidents involving vehicles.

A new revitalized CRRLI would clearly solve the conjestion problem on the main. (as I said before, just build the damm thing and in due time the NIMBYS will get over it.) A new revitalized CRRLI would also bring several NEW stations to (i.e. clinton rd, NCC, Eisenhower pk, & Levittown, Just to name a few). im shure there could be a few more.

The central rail can handle all the Ronconkoma / Greenport trains + the NYA's freight.