Tool's Disability Outrage

Tool, thanks for your usual concise explanation of the facts. I look forward to your continued updates on this topic.

These people are like the ones who scam the disability insurance in what ever job they did. My back is out so I cant lift anything but the investigators find them moving furniture or changing the flat tire on their car with no problem.
It's sad to say but thats how some people operate. They will try to game the system at the expense of legitimate claims.

Tool I read all 74 pages and I'm sure you did too. What does this all boil down too. Are they saying all employes that are on disability are dirt bag fakes?

The Daily News is reporting 11 arrests. These people scammed the system big time. I dont think the report will say every one on disability is a scammer. It appears its too easy to get on disability and they scammed the system because the Dr's ,etc. give out disability claims loosely. They then collect money and worked other jobs or did other activities which shouldnt' be done by "disabled" people. Here is a quote from the paper and I left out the employees name. "The former executive - who claimed she had trouble walking stairs - was spotted at a two-hour gym class that included step aerobics."
Heres another one. "The sixth LIRR worker, one-time director of employee services XXXXXXXX, was caught shoveling snow for 90 minutes and walking with a baby stroller despite "severe legs pains" caused by her desk job."

So they deserved to get caught! The system was broke and they found a way to gain from it. I'm sure not everyone was like that on disability.

Coments Tool?

A famous judge whose name escapes me , did say this "you can indict a ham sandwich " . Stay tuned boys and girls .

No, not all LIRR employees retiring on 'Disability" Pensions were lying - but there is ABSOLUTELY NO DOUBT that the vast majority of them were. Just compare to Metro-North, same type of employees, same service performed, a small fraction retire on 'Disability.' And no one would ever argue that the LIRR is run on a level with Metro North's. That would be ludicrous.

The difference: the Disability Mills the LI Doctors and their Bureaucratic cronies ran/run. There is no excuse for this illegal, reprehensible behavior, and my hope is that all cases are re-opened and re-analyzed, so this theft of my tax dollars and monthly pass fees will be discontinued, in as much as a top-to-bottom incompetent and corrupt LIRR business model can be, no matter how its apologists and entrenched, protected Union workers spin things.

Here's the Criminal Complaint filed in federal court:
http://videos.news12.com/AjemianComplaint.pdf

I had posted this earlier but was compelled to delete the link until after the press conference.

The complaint names seven former LIRR employees, two doctors, a medical employee and a former Railroad Retirement office manager turned "retirement adviser".

Each of the retirees named allegedly engaged in activities that would violate the law. Several were earning money while collecting their disability annuities. Others were engaged in physical activity that was clearly contraindicated in the statements they presented when seeking their disability annuities.

Let's call them "Low hanging fruit". This is the stuff that makes headlines. String them up!

The cases against the doctors are much more circumstantial. The Complaint seeks to indicate a pattern of behavior that perpetrated fraud. Allegedly the physicians were aware of the "loose" Federal qualification requirements of the Law and encouraged, coaxed and advised patients on their qualifying. The Complaint also alleges somehow that payments made to them by patients to prepare narrative discussions of their ailments were somehow immoral or illegal.

The case against the "retirement adviser" appears to be even more circumstantial. She is accused of taking charging to advise retirees on filing forms that requested benefits. Seems to me to be what a tax preparer does for taxpayers.

Meanwhile, a press conference called for "neighbors to turn in retirees who are breaking the law."

Tool is prepared for the headlines, the class-envy op-ed pieces and the insulting comments that are sure to be generated by the analytical media circus that is certain to ensue.

Where will this all go as the years pass? There are always a certain number of bad apples who break the law. More will be caught. More will be paraded in 4 AM "perp-walks" on News12. Legislation may be tightened. Neighbors will turn in neighbors and fewer retirees will qualify for disability annuities.

Once again, the present administration demonizes the working class.

Sure, let's purge the system of the bad apples. But let's not implicate an entire class of professionals to do that.

LongIslandTool wrote:Here's the Criminal Complaint filed in federal court:
http://videos.news12.com/AjemianComplaint.pdf

I had posted this earlier but was compelled to delete the link until after the press conference.

The complaint names seven former LIRR employees, two doctors, a medical employee and a former Railroad Retirement office manager turned "retirement adviser".

Each of the retirees named allegedly engaged in activities that would violate the law. Several were earning money while collecting their disability annuities. Others were engaged in physical activity that was clearly contraindicated in the statements they presented when seeking their disability annuities. This is the stuff that makes headlines. String them up!

The cases against the doctors are much more circumstantial. The Complaint seeks to indicate a pattern of behavior that perpetrated fraud. Allegedly the physicians were aware of the "loose" Federal qualification requirements of the Law and encouraged, coaxed and advised patients on their qualifying. The Complaint also alleges somehow that payments made to them by patients to prepare narrative discussions of their ailments were somehow immoral or illegal.

The case against the "retirement adviser" appears to be even more circumstantial. She is accused of taking charging to advise retirees on filing forms that requested benefits. Seems to me to be what a tax preparer does for taxpayers.

Meanwhile, a press conference called for "neighbors to turn in retirees who are breaking the law."

Tool is prepared for the headlines, the class-envy op-ed pieces and the insulting comments that are sure to be generated by the analytical media circus that is certain to ensue.

Where will this all go as the years pass? There are always a certain number of bad apples who break the law. More will be caught. More will be paraded in 4 AM "perp-walks" on News12. Legislation may be tightened. Neighbors will turn in neighbors and fewer retirees will qualify for disability annuities.

Once again, the present administration demonizes the working class.

Sure, let's purge the system of the bad apples. But let's not implicate an entire class of professionals to do that.

Thanks tool. The voice of reason.

Well said Tool.

LongIslandTool wrote:
"Let's call them "Low hanging fruit". This is the stuff that makes headlines. String them up!

According to the complaint, all 869 of the workers between 50 and 55 who retired during a five-year period ending in 2008 got disability awards. All 869? Does this strike anybody else besides me as an incredible percentage? And amazingly, they were able to do their jobs until they retired. Maybe this SHOULD be getting headlines. Nobody is "demonizing" the working class. I think some of you guys lose credibility when you fail to acknowledge that the possibility exists that the charges may actually be true, though it's also possible that the evidence is thin and nothing will come of it. Too early to tell, but please stop the martyrdom and the whole "the entire world is against the poor LIRR worker".

Johnny, you are either reading something incorrectly or the complaint is in error. Obviously all retirees during that period did not receive disability annuities.

Those of us inside the system clearly have more information than those gleaning their information from the media, so we certainly view the entire exercise differently.

As explained elsewhere in this thread, the Railroad Retirement system's qualifications for an occupational disability annuity differ considerably from what most casual readers would assume them should be. They was based, up until three years ago, upon an extensive listing of ailments. A person possessing an ailment on the list was entitled to an annuity. This was law.

Obviously there are those who feel this was a bad law, and those who feel it was a good law, and few who understand the history of and the events that brought about this legislation in the 1940's. This criteria has since been changed, and employees hired after 1988 are not eligible for similar benefits.

Those indited in today's complaint appear to have been accused of working and not reporting their work to the Board or not reporting an improvement in their medical condition which was indicated by extraordinary physical accomplishments.

A court will determine if they are guilty. Some probably are indeed. Of a cast of 6,000 LIRR retirees, it's common sense to expect a certain portion of them to be scammers and cheats. It would be nice if the ranks could police themselves or if the Agency could do it in a manner that didn't demean an entire population.

Another thing nobody has mentioned is, this is not a lifetime disability. This is a benefit for those who have 30 years of service and have not reached the retirement age of 60. Those with less then 30, age 62.
Most if not all had over 30 years service and were in their mid 50's. its a benefit that ends at 60 when regular railroad retirement kicks in, 62 for those with less then 30.
The billion dollar figure posted by some news sources is a total fabrication.
In essense, they recieved their RR retirement benefits a few years shy of 60.
If one has certain conditions they qualify for an occupational disability.
This is the Law, and MRI's and X rays do not lie.
The evidence is submitted to the railroad retirement board who makes the final determination based on the evidence.
One Cannot get a disability without evidence, the evidence must be to the satisfaction of the RR retirement board, no matter what the chosen doctor says.
In addition, after 2 years, the Board must make a determination as to continuing the disability till age 60 or 62. Some have been called in for examinations by the board, and approved for what they call permanent disability. At that point we are put on medicare.
Can only speak for myself, in my case they reviewed my case and sent me the medicare card.
They did not require me to come in because of the overwhelming evidence.
Railroad retirement sends a letter each year, to those under 60, reminding them that if we worked any month in that year, and our total income was over a set amount in that month, we were to forfeit the disability for that month.
I recieved the letter last week.
The fact of the matter is, anyone bouncing around trains for over 30 years will have many medical conditions caused by wear and tear.
Bulging disks, herniated disks, arthritis, nerve damage, flat feet, the list goes on.
Most train and Engine service personal also suffer hearing loss, especially Engineers.
We will see how this all plays out, to me its much ado about nothing.
Again once one is over 60 its not a disability anymore, its Railroad retirement.
I know some who were mentioned are over 60.

To all rail fans that are bitching about this, this does not come out of your tax dollar, it comes out of hard worker railroaders. KNOW your facts before you bitch. Railroad retirement disability is paid for out of the pockets from working railroaders. Not one red cent comes from your pocket. However, those NYC welfare mothers that scam the system and collects Social Security payments or welfare fraudulently does come from YOUR tax dollars, not mine. I pay into RRB, i don't pay a dime in Social Security. Do you know how much of my hard earned cash went to this fraud, every penny i paid into RRB. Know how much your cash contributed to it ZERO. Do you know how much money i paid into the scum bag that scam NEW YORK STATE disability, ZERO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Do you know how much money you paid into that scum bag, well check your pay stub because your giving money away to those scum bags. Know your facts before you grip!!!!!

Chicagorail, on a railroad such as the Long Island, it most certainly is paid for in part, by the taxpayer. The LIRR is a subsidized road, therefore, the employer contributions into the RRB are derived from the operating subsidies and grants it receives from NYS and the Federal Gov't. (taxpayers), as well as the farebox revenue. Employer contributions were actually raised for 2011. They are in the range of 15% of an employees gross wages. In comparison to a non-railroad employer, the maximum an employer pays into Social Security is 6.2%. Due to being a railroad employer paying into the RRB, the cost to the LIRR is in the range of $75,000,000 more per year than they would pay to Social Security. Where do you think this money comes from on a railroad that covers only 48% of its operating cost from the farebox?

Call me crazy!! two weeks ago we had the meltdown in Jamaica then the RR says we found the problem it was the guy in the orange vest. he pushed the wrong button and caused the whole mess. So you see Management did a good job and capital did a great job!! it was the union worker in th orange vest. By the way did you know they are all crooks? Do you think a phone call could have been made to the feds to time this just right so as to change the subject away from managerial incompetence? I would bet six months to a year most of the charges will be quietly dropped.