Amtrak Gateway Tunnels

Apparently NJ and NJ are willing to pick up half the cost ($10billion of the $20b they claim) if the feds pick up the other half: https://www.governor.ny.gov/sites/gover ... sident.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

srepetsk wrote:Apparently [NJ and NY] are willing to pick up half the cost ($10billion) if the feds pick up the other half: https://www.governor.ny.gov/sites/gover ... sident.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

At last:

We [Governors Christie and Cuomo] are writing jointly in an attempt to move the stalled project forward by putting a funding proposal on the table that we believe is realistic, appropriate and fair: split the responsibility for the cost. If the federal government will prove grants to pay for half of the cost of the project, the Port Authority, New York and New Jersey will take responsibility for developing a funding plan for the other half, convening all relevant agencies, and utilizing the proposed federal low-interest loan, local funding soruces, and other funding strategies necessary to complement the federal grant commitment. This funding framework is comparable to previous structures proposed for a new tunnel.

Due to the nature of this project and to makit a reality on a timely basis, we would also need the federal government to expedite all environmental and planning approvals, as we will on our side. New Jersey will also make available all the planning work accomplished during discussion on the ARC Tunnel.

At our direction, the Port Authority is prepared to take the lead in this effort and is prepared to take Senator Schumer's suggestion to create a dedicated staff and an entity within the Port Authority to develop such a plan and to get the right agencies and parties involved

I hate to seem cynical, but this comes just in time for Governor Christie to use it as an example of reaching across the aisle during his speaking time at the "adult table" debate on CNN.

I hope he's being sincere, I truly do, but I have my doubts.

SemperFidelis wrote:I hate to seem cynical, but this comes just in time for Governor Christie to use it as an example of reaching across the aisle during his speaking time at the "adult table" debate on CNN.

I hope he's being sincere, I truly do, but I have my doubts.

Maybe Mr. Trump could jump on the bandwagon and offer to build a hotel & casino in Weehawken?

I suspect you're right, but I'm not one to look a gift horse in the mouth. This would be a huge feather in the cap of both Christie and Cuomo, and would be a legacy for VP Biden (and President Obama) if he champions this project to Congress.

SemperFidelis wrote:I hate to seem cynical, but this comes just in time for Governor Christie to use it as an example of reaching across the aisle during his speaking time at the "adult table" debate on CNN.
I hope he's being sincere, I truly do, but I have my doubts.

Christie can sincerely notch this as a "win" (vs NY) and a "save" (vs "no ARC" and "Sandy").

There's no upside in being insincere about moving forward given even the tiniest bit of fig leaf cover from Gov Cuomo and given bipartisan panic in NJ that Christie's killing ARC in Oct 2010 was followed by inaction and, worse, Superstorm Sandy in Oct 2012 and its subsequent hassles (and threatened hell) for NJT.

The "win" vs NY is simply that Cuomo has put NY as much on the hook as NJ...not quite a promise to go halvsies, but Christie can at least say (and perhaps this part is insincere face-saving) that NJ will be less on-the-hook than it would have been under ARC. Still, Christie can spin this as a win only if it progresses. If this new deal fails to progress, even if it is no better than ARC was for NJ taxpayers, NJ (and primary voters everywhere) will be asking if NJ would've been better off with ARC despite its overruns.

And part of Christie's case to Republicans in the primary for president is that Christie can somehow put NJ "in play" (a hellish scenario electorally for Democrats), but that case is worthless (and Christie's case for himself is worthless) if NJ voters hate Christie for not delivering a tunnel plan.

The "save" is simply that he may have gotten Gateway back on track in time to not have Sandy damage cut from 24tph to 6tph, and in time that NJ primary and general voters will re-warm to him.

I certainly hope it's true. And if Cuomo and Christie want to make political hay, let them. That's what politicians do. If Christie has thoughts of backing out of the project, it will proceed slowly enough (even in the best case) so that he won't be governor long enough to cancel it.

NY and NJ offer to pay half cost of new Hudson tunnel.
https://www.governor.ny.gov/sites/gover ... sident.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Finally, a fair and realistic political approach to funding the new tunnels! The Port Authority was the answer to fund the local match I suggested months ago. Sandy funds should be used to repair and rework "existing" infrastructure, not expand or add to them.

mtuandrew wrote: Maybe Mr. Trump could jump on the bandwagon and offer to build a hotel & casino in Weehawken?

Was it Daniel Burnham who said "make no little plans"? Let Trump build the tunnels--we could name them the Trump Bores.

I think Mr. Trump is already identified as a certain kind of hole. Just ask Mrs. Megan Kelly.

Recently Amtrak showed the existing tunnels to a bunch of reporters. I have seen a few pictures online. Neither of them shows anything that I would expect to fail within 20 years as claimed by Amtrak.

I am interested however in pictures showing the leaks into the tunnels. Are there images in the public domain showing the leaks inside the tunnels? Pictures showing icicles from the roof/catenary could be very effective visual aid. Also has anyone seen pictures that a reasonable person with engineering background will interpret to show components likely to fail within 20 years?

EuroStar wrote:Recently Amtrak showed the existing tunnels to a bunch of reporters. I have seen a few pictures online. Neither of them shows anything that I would expect to fail within 20 years as claimed by Amtrak.

I am interested however in pictures showing the leaks into the tunnels. Are there images in the public domain showing the leaks inside the tunnels? Pictures showing icicles from the roof/catenary could be very effective visual aid. Also has anyone seen pictures that a reasonable person with engineering background will interpret to show components likely to fail within 20 years?

You haven't seen the confidential engineering report then (its not online). Its pretty shocking.... There are numerous longitudinal cracks, transverse cracks, spalling, exposed steel, damp incrustation and active moisture throughout.....

Gray Lady spoke today:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/17/opini ... start.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Fair Use:

Amtrak has already spent more than $300 million to begin designing Gateway and to preserve its right of way, including underground space beneath Manhattan’s booming West Side. Eventually, however, Congress must come through in a major way, increasing funds devoted to mass transit and allowing the rerouting of some of the resources the government devotes to roads to a project of vital importance to as many as 200,000 riders a day on Amtrak and New Jersey Transit.

Mr. Cuomo said this week, “We are already slow and we are already late,” and that the letter to Mr. Obama was “our way of trying to get things moving.” It is past time to do so.

Of course, we cannot lose sight that Chris has been more concerned with "job hunting" of late than he is with New Jersey affairs. Lest we forget when he diverted funds from ARC to highways, the vote getting reasoning was simple. Highways the voters see; so long as the train shows up at Penn more or less on time, the voters don't see.

"when he diverted funds from ARC to highways"

That sounds a lot better than he "re-allocated ARC funds to stop the Pulaski Skyway and Witt Penn Bridge from collapsing into the Hackensack River".

Don31 wrote: You haven't seen the confidential engineering report then (its not online). Its pretty shocking.... There are numerous longitudinal cracks, transverse cracks, spalling, exposed steel, damp incrustation and active moisture throughout.....

It might be confidential, but it is online.http://www.wnyc.org/story/amtrak-tunnels/ http://www.scribd.com/doc/241718975/NYC ... ent-Report