CSX B40-8s converted to B20-8s?

[MEC407]

That's why I thought the V8 GEVO would be appealing because it's only slightly more than half the length of the original V16 FDL, which would give you extra room for a separate HEP motor and the associated cooling systems.

As for the noise, I guess anything is quieter than an F40. At least GE puts the exhaust stack toward the rear of the unit, rather than directly behind your head.

[DutchRailnut]

your configuration would seriously upset weight balance between front and rear truck.
and with no room for ballast this would be mayor problem.

[Super Seis]

Anyone know how many repower kits has GE sold ?
Z-E-R-O

Unlike the EMD ECO mod, the GE repower involves substantial modifications above the platform.

B-20-8 ?? Remove half the PA's and maintain an even fire ordering order with what is left...there you go.

SS

[D.Carleton]

Maybe they're cutting the block in half and creating a V8...?

I'm guessing GE will steer clear of a V8 GEVO; medium size V8 diesels are rather complicated. The V8 251 has two "balance shafts" driven off the main lube oil pump gear. The engine "requires a rotating balancing force in addition to the rotating counterweights on the crankshaft to balance the engine dynamically during operation." I believe the V8 FDL has something similar. In-line six-cylinder engines work very well in the RS-1 and T-6 and the same should be expected from an in-line six GEVO.

I am curious as to why they would re-engine a B40-8 instead of an older B36-7 but I'm sure they have good reasons. Ja'ap's pet project of replacing the P40’s FDL-16 with an in-line six is most intriguing. One slight issue: the shallow sump GEVO is about one foot taller than the FDL. Maybe they could raise the roof like on the FL-9AC's? That alone could send shivers up the spines of the mechanical dept.

[v8interceptor]

GE document promoting the GEVO repower package:
http://www.fasterfreightcleanerair.com/ ... Lawson.pdf
As to the question of why CSX wouldn't rebuilt Dash 7's, they only have a handful still on the roster...

[D.Carleton]

As to the question of why CSX wouldn't rebuilt Dash 7's, they only have a handful still on the roster...

I didn't realize that. Just checking the Bullsheet there are only four active B36-7's left with sixteen being retired this month. Ouch. It seems like yesterday they were delivered and handling crack assignments through central Florida. I was envisioning something along the lines of the Super Seven rebuilds but using dash 7's as the cores. But with the depressed economy I'm sure there are a surplus of older dash 8's available.

[RickRackstop]

As to the question of why CSX wouldn't rebuilt Dash 7's, they only have a handful still on the roster...

I didn't realize that. Just checking the Bullsheet there are only four active B36-7's left with sixteen being retired this month. Ouch. It seems like yesterday they were delivered and handling crack assignments through central Florida. I was envisioning something along the lines of the Super Seven rebuilds but using dash 7's as the cores. But with the depressed economy I'm sure there are a surplus of older dash 8's available.

You would think that GE has an opportunity to take a couple of those retired B36-7's and build ES23DC prototype demonstrators on their own dime. EMD has a pretty good little sideline going with re-powering with Tier 2 engines on old 40 series locomotive and nearly new Caltans, and some (UP I think) SD60's getting new 12-710 engines replacing early 16-710 engines. the 710 eco demonstrator gave potential customers something to look at at least.

[D.Carleton]

You would think that GE has an opportunity to take a couple of those retired B36-7's and build ES23DC prototype demonstrators on their own dime. EMD has a pretty good little sideline going with re-powering with Tier 2 engines on old 40 series locomotive and nearly new Caltans, and some (UP I think) SD60's getting new 12-710 engines replacing early 16-710 engines. the 710 eco demonstrator gave potential customers something to look at at least.

Too true. Considering the success of the U23B/B23-7 production, combined over 1000 built, there would appear to be an untapped market. I would think the fuel economy of an in-line six would be superior over a roots blown V-16 of a GP38.

Speaking of the SD60/ECO rebuilds, our favourite cousins to the north have posted some pics of these in prep for the conversion. So much for a simple engine swap.

[MEC407]

I would think the fuel economy of an in-line six would be superior over a roots blown V-12 of a GP38.

True... and maintenance costs would be lower... especially since the GP38 is a V16. You'd have 10 fewer power assemblies to maintain with the GEVO-6.

Now, in regards to re-engining U23Bs and B23-7s, my concern/question is whether or not the GEVO-6 would fit. I know that the FDL-12 has six cylinders on each side, so theoretically the length of the two engines shouldn't be vastly different, but we have to remember that GEVO cylinders are considerably larger than FDL cylinders. Exactly how much larger, and how that translates into the length of the complete engine package, is still a mystery to me.

[D.Carleton]

Well whoops. So noted and corrected.

As for potential rebuild donor cores, the U23B shared the same overall length as other B trucked GE's, 60' 2". The B23-7 was the same as other B trucked dash 7's, 62' 2". As seen with the ECO rebuilding of the UP SD60's this is more than just an engine swap. That's why, at least in my mind, this would more resemble the Super Seven program; save what you can but ultimately you have a new locomotive.

One other necessary change, with a vee engine heads and power assemblies are removed at an angle so side doors are acceptable. With an in-line everything comes out going straight up. The RS-1 was built with roof hatches to facilitate this and any potential future ES32 with have to emulate this.

FYI: the in-line GEVO 6 is 200" long, the V-12 is roughly 180", the V-16 is roughly 220".

[D.Carleton]

It took a couple glasses of vino to realize that link provided by Ja'ap of the in-line engine shows it to have the generator and the turbo on the same end of the engine. If applied to a locomotive this would put the exhaust right behind the cab just like an (gasp) EMD.

[DutchRailnut]

The link provided is for Marine version of the inline 6 or 8 engine.
there are several other differences including a much bigger oil pan.

[v8interceptor]

You would think that GE has an opportunity to take a couple of those retired B36-7's and build ES23DC prototype demonstrators on their own dime. EMD has a pretty good little sideline going with re-powering with Tier 2 engines on old 40 series locomotive and nearly new Caltans, and some (UP I think) SD60's getting new 12-710 engines replacing early 16-710 engines. the 710 eco demonstrator gave potential customers something to look at at least.

Too true. Considering the success of the U23B/B23-7 production, combined over 1000 built, there would appear to be an untapped market. I would think the fuel economy of an in-line six would be superior over a roots blown V-16 of a GP38.

Speaking of the SD60/ECO rebuilds, our favourite cousins to the north have posted some pics of these in prep for the conversion. So much for a simple engine swap.

There are very few U23B/B23-7s remaining, unlike 4 axle EMD's of the same vintage..

[RickRackstop]

Well a decent amount of time has gone by, did CSX do anything about this idea or did they discover they have plenty of GP38's around that would be more satisfactory in switching service.

[DutchRailnut]

GP38 will be hard to make Tier 2 compliant, when it comes to overhauling.