Scollay/Brattle/Govy?...

Going back to when Government Center station was "Scollay Square", and the "Brattle Square" station was still in use, and the Adams Square station still existed.

What trains ran on the Brattle Square loop adjacent to the Scollay Square station? Where did they come from? I remember when I was little, there was fencing between the two stations (later replaced by a wall) and I think you had to pay another fare to move between them. I also remember 4 tracks running through the old Haymarket station, again with a fence between the inner and outer tracks. I know Adams Square was Northbound only, but I think I remember an inner loop there too. Were these used by MTA surface lines? Were they used by Eastern Mass trolleys?

I know the outer tracks that run through Boylston station are the remnant of the MTA trolleys that ran to South Boston and the South End, and they do connect to the inner tracks between Boylston and Park Street, but I don't think the loop tracks at Brattle Square and Adams Square connected to the MTA tracks to North Station and Lechmere (at least not back then).

IIRC, the old Haymarket station, just north of the existing platforms, had two inbound and two outbound tracks.

On the inbound side, I believe the inner tracks led to the Brattle/Adams loop, while the outer tracks went through to the Tremont St. Subway.

On the outbound side I think things changed over time as far as what cars used inner/outer tracks. I forget which tracks led to the viaduct and which led to the Canal St. loop/stub at North Station.

The current Haymarket platforms are where the inner tracks had been located, just south of the original station. The original station had two island platforms between the pairs of tracks.

The outer tracks were (and largely still are) continuous from the Haymarket Portal (where they connected to the East Cambridge Viaduct) to the Pleasant St Portal. Coming south from Haymarket, the inner track split, with one branch going to the Brattle Loop at Scollay Square, and the other going to a loop at Adams Sq. North of Haymarket, the inner tracks connected to the surface routes in the area. On either side of Haymarket were crossovers allowing movements between the inner and outer tracks, so a car could go anywhere regardless of what track it entered the subway on.

There was a period when Bay State cars ran through to either the Brattle Loop or Adams Sq (I can't recall which), but I don't think it lasted long.

This may help - it's a 1918 map that the Boston Transit Commission put out showing all of the various transit and rail lines in Boston (with individual tracks). It clearly shows all of the loops and platforms.

Very good reading there, but some notes:

The Mass Avenue Station on the Boylston Street Line (now Hynes) shows the now closed headhouse on Boylston.
When was 360 Newbury built? It also appears part of Public Alley 444 was built as part of the tunnel box structure.

Arlington was added as an infill station in 1921, but is not shown as proposed or under construction as of 1918.

The Huntington Avenue Subway was built under a WPA contract in 1941, where did the Huntington line enter
the subway?

Any details about the Milk Street Station in the Washington Street Subway between Winter (Downtown Crossing)
and State? Do any platform segments or remnants exist?

The Washington Street Subway moves off its namesake street onto to an incline to the el at the intersection of
Kneeland. Is that where the new (post-1987) routing splits off?

I assume the North Ferry to East Boston at Battery Street is the predecessor to the Sumner Tunnel (which ironically on the dedication plaque, reads as being built by the Transit Commission, despite a highway project).

360 Newbury was built in 1919. It held BERy offices from 1920 to 1926.

Arlington was approved in 1915, but didn't begin construction until the war ended.

The Huntington Avenue line entered the subway at the Boylston Street Incline, between Charles Street and Arlington Street. It was also used by other lines until 1930.

Milk is the southbound platform at what is now State station. It's still there, just renamed in 1967.

Correct, the modern tunnel splits off the former alignment at Kneeland. Tufts Medical Center station is on a diagonal west of Washington Street.

The North Ferry (Battery Street to Border Street) ended in 1938 after the 1934 opening of the Sumner Tunnel; the BRB&L ferry (Rowes Wharf to Jeffries Point) ended in 1940, while the South Ferry (Sargent's Wharf to Lewis Wharf) lasted until 1952.

When I was a kid in the 70s and 80s we could see the "other tunnels" from Orange Line trains just after we entered the tunnel or just before we left it. And then for the first few weeks or months that the SWC was open we could look out the end of the tunnel at the sky as the train was moving from the old to new tunnel. I THINK I remember seeing weeds growing up on the incline before they got the old tunnel walled off.

Adding to the above, the Boylston St Portal was located where the subway widens out west of Boylston. The rerailer LRV was kept on a siding there for many years.

The above-ground trolley shed that was Massachusetts Station still opened onto Newbury St. in the 1970s. It was fenced off and the MBTA appeared to park work trucks there. Everything beyond the south edge of the trolley "tunnel" box had been demolished when the Mass. Turnpike was built.

Aerie wrote: ↑Tue Aug 29, 2023 1:27 pm Going back to when Government Center station was "Scollay Square", and the "Brattle Square" station was still in use, and the Adams Square station still existed.
What trains ran on the Brattle Square loop adjacent to the Scollay Square station? Where did they come from?

Looking at a 1940 BERY system map, the trolley cars to and from Charlestown (Lines 89 and 90) ran in the Brattle Loop, terminating at the Scollay Square station. The trolley cars emerged from the tunnel at Causeway Street, and crossed the Charles River on the old Warren Street Bridge. Line 89 ran up Main Street, and line 90 ran up Chelsea Street and Bunker Hill Street. Both lines ended at Sullivan Square. In addition to those lines, I'm guessing that back in that era, trolley cars to Chelsea may have used the Brattle Loop as well. Those would have gone up Chelsea Street across the Mystic River to Chelsea.

Service from Brattle Loop to Chelsea ended with BERy's purchase of the Eastern Mass' Chelsea Division in 1936. The surviving lines in Chelsea were rerouted to Maverick Sq.

Not quite - service between Brattle Loop and Chelsea actually ended on January 14, 1935, when the Chelsea Bridge was closed for yearlong repairs. The Eastern Mass ran Chelsea-Haymarket bus service over the Meridian Street bridge and the Sumner Tunnel. The MTA took over the Chelsea Division on June 10, 1936; as you noted, the Revere Beach Loop via Revere Street (now 116) and Revere Beach Loop via Beach Street (117) were extended to Maverick at that time via Meridian Street. The Beachmont line (ancestor of today's 119) was extended to Day Square via Central Avenue. Bus service over the Chelsea Bridge began on July 2, 1936, when the MTA began a City Square - Chelsea Square routes (ancestor of today's 111).

caduceus wrote: ↑Tue Aug 29, 2023 2:34 pm IIRC, the old Haymarket station, just north of the existing platforms, had two inbound and two outbound tracks.
...

Why did they move the station? When one descends the steps, you're standing where the old station used to be. Then, one has to walk about 100m to get to the current station. I could save a lot of steps if I didn't have to walk to the new station. As they eliminated the two center tracks, just cover the center tracks and turn two platforms into one wide platform.

I always had the idea they relocated the Green Line's Haymarket platforms to make space for parking garage supports - the one whose demolition has been screwing up the area for years. I was young, but I think I recall Lechmere cars using the old Haymarket's outer tracks, and Canal St. Loop (North Station) cars using the inner tracks in the early 60s.

Yes, the 1971 platform relocation and new entrance were part of the garage project.

The last regular use of the inner tracks was a Causeway Street Terminal - Brattle Loop shuttle that ran until 1952. Shuttles for events at the Garden may have used them until the 60s, though.