Question about the Diesel lines

Why do the lines that run the diesel trains run at a top speed of 65mph? Is it because the old equipment could only top out at that speed? Or is it because of the track conditions?

Track conditions, fuel and equipment maintenance costs.

Back in the '50s, the maximum speed anywhere on the LIRR was 65, and some lines, like the Hempstead branch, had limits of 50 or less. The diesels in those days could do more, but the old MUs? The MP-54 family? Those things were lucky if they could get above 45 mph between stations in local service.

Many of the shorter branches have speed restrictions to this day. Port wash branch is still 65 I believe, I know I will be corrected if I am wrong.
If I recall correctly today on the hempstead branch, mas is 70 or 80 from stewart manor and just west of Garden city.
Pretty sure its 80.
Used to work an equipment train from Brooklyn to Hempstead during the morning rush, then turn and make a west bound rush hour train.
We used to take our time getting to garden city, because we were held there waiting for a westbound. ( goes to single track just east of garden city).
I said to the engineer one morning, lets do MAS just for the heck of it, see what if feels like, on this branch, since we are on a rare equipment train, and can get up to speed. ( MAS= Maximun authorized Speed).
Engineer said yeah that might be interesting. ( it was his call of course)
So... we did MAS from stewart Manor to just west of garden city, where the code drops.
It was amazing.. here we come, doing 70 or 80, and at nassau blvd all the people casually walking in front of us to make their westbounds suddenly realized how fast we were going, coffee cups went flying, people were diving out of the way.
Because most if not all hempstead trains are locals, no one had ever seen an M-1 stretch its legs on that branch.
The RR got calls of a train speeding, and the people were informed the train was not speeding, and they should not have been on the tracks, thats why the crossing gates were down.
Maybe it was not the best thing to do, but no rules were broken, and it was as fun as hell.
Imagine watching a train fly though nassau blvd at almost 80.
Funny thing was, the next morning..NO one walked in front of us at Nassau Blvd.
We did however get a few one finger salutes.

About the diesels and 65... back in the days before event recorders were put on the trains, 65 was exceeded on occasion to make up time.
The rail was pretty bad east of Patchougue in those days, so some engineers would make up time west of Y were it went to double track.
I know many will say, no way, but this did happen.
Was on a westbound from montauk and we wanted to make up time getting to jamaica, so "last train rules"
were in effect. ( Those who work for the RR know what Last train rules Mean)
After comming down the hill from hicksville, through westbury and carle place.. I would never admit... we did 100 mph.
That was with a G-P 38, on the west end, a power pack right behind the engine, and 8 mp-72's.
Im sure there are many others that know what the Gp-38's could do.
With todays event recorders and GPS I guess those days are probably over.
Some of the old timers that were still there when I hired on, told me they got the steam engines up to 100 when they had to.
Since I hired on 16 years after the last steam, there were still quite a few Engineers left at that time who had operated steam Engines.

Plus these days the ASC, when cut in and functioning properly, won't let you operate past MAS. I guess as far as the M3s go, I'm not sure if they've installed GPS in any of them yet...so theoretically one could cut out the ASC and go faster than 80 in an M3. Better hope nothing else goes wrong though which prompts the box to be downloaded. Reminds me of a story I was told.

Engineers will almost always get in trouble of they run a stop signal. But, one occasion where an engineer was excused after running a stop signal. He was operating west on the Long Beach branch, and came up to a stop signal at Valley, where he tried to stop, but slid on very slick rails and ended up sliding right through the stop signal. It was said that they would have let him go without getting in trouble for the stop signal since he tried to stop but encountered those extreme slippery conditions. The download of the box showed this. I forget if it was found that it was moisture on the rail, or an over active grease pot. The download revealed a couple of other things too that happened earlier in this engineer's trip. The MAS on the Long Beach branch is 60MPH. The data showed that he was speeding on the branch....it was something like doing 70 or 80MPH, and he served time for that.

Plus in Manual Block territory there is no ASC, so before the event recorders, there was no way to tell if one had speeded.
There was even a formula in the timetable or book of rules, I forget which, to tell an Engineer how fast he was going by timing the mileposts with his watch.
Probably was in the timetable, that makes more sense.
( 60 seconds between mileposts=60 mph and so forth)
This was in the event of a speedometer failure, which at the time was NOT Considered an ASC failure.
As far as I know a speedometer faliure is still not considered an ASC faillure, but Im not privy to that info anymore.
I thought about saving my timetable and keeping it up to date after retireing, as some Employees do, but I though nah, not worth the trouble, and whats the point especially since I dont live in NY.
I remember Grover W. Coming to Jamaica on a regular basis to get the general orders and notices to keep his timetable up to date.
I guess to some if was a hobby and a way of keeping connected. I understand it, but was not for me.
Another true story was the Engineer who ran the AM Greenport Scoot.
He was one of the top senior engineers, so the employee newsletter, "Along The track" did a story on him, and what it was like operating the train to greenport.
It was a very nice article, about how the farmers would wave to him and he would ans with the horn, things like that.
Nice Railroad story.
In the story he admitted to the writer that sometimes he would have to make up time, to keep the train on schedule.
You guessed it, management read the article and downloaded his event recorder, and nailed him for excessive speed.
Tool will verify this is a true story, no joke.

It's really great to hear from Conductors and Trainmen about Engineers breaking the rules.

Ed

Ed that was not the intent of the conversations, did not even cross my mind, was just talking about general RR things, and how things have changed over the years.
The purpose of the story was the way the RR Handles things and the implied unfairness of it.
I cant ans for slack, but I think that was his intent also.
im sorry if I offended anyone, that was honestly not my intent.
I was on The Engineers side in all this, and the point of the story was the company going after him for an innocent comment made in an along the track article, and what employees have to deal with now.

choochoo,

I can see your point, do a degree.


But unless you've never ever gone 1 MPH over the speed limit, including that 20mph posted limit near schools, then....

no throwing stones.

Back to diesels.
I prefered the GP-38s over the current fleet.
Seemed to me they were better Engines.
Being a Conductor my first hand knowledge of them is limited since I did not operate them.
Just throwing out a question, which diesels were your favorite?
Be interesting to hear the pro's and cons of each of them, especially the Engineers who operated them.

Speaking not as a railroad crewman, but just as a former "Dashing Dan," I always liked the RS-3's the best. Struck me as a real workhorse of an engine; liked the way they looked, smelled, and sounded.

First train I ever worked was pulled by an RS-3 they would be my second choice and the alco centuries 3rd.
I believe it was 1553.. word is she still exists, and is for sale..
what she looked like in 2002.
She was built in 1954 from what I have read, and was delivered to the LIRR in 1955.
If thats true she is the same age as me.

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.p ... 460&nseq=0

I never worked a GM engine, I thought the 1600 Fairbanks was the best accelerating. The Fairbanks used Super Chargers and the Alcos used Turbo Chargers. The Alcos didn't get the boost until the engine was running really fast. The Fairbanks had the boost, from the minute you opened the throttle.
I've always liked GM diesels, but don't know a thing about them.

Ed

In line with Wilson, I didn't intend to tarnish anyone's image or break anyone's trust. I think we all know that in any organization, there will be some bad apples. That usually doesn't represent the majority of the workforce, and it's the same on the LIRR. The LIRR has a pretty good, honest, and hard working group these days, and I don't have any doubts of the safety of the service provided. The incident I referred to was in the past, maybe 10-15 years ago? My intent was to illustrate that if any employee does intend to bend the rules, they will get caught and serve time for it. This engineer exceeded the speed limit, got caught, and served time on the street for it. Additionally, road foremen and other bosses, as well as the occasional FRA inspector will do random radar checks to check speed compliance. These days more than ever, folks know they are to be on their best behavior, because of the budget problems I'm sure the railroad would use any chance you give them to get rid of you.

SlackControl wrote:In line with Wilson, I didn't intend to tarnish anyone's image or break anyone's trust. I think we all know that in any organization, there will be some bad apples. That usually doesn't represent the majority of the workforce, and it's the same on the LIRR. The LIRR has a pretty good, honest, and hard working group these days, and I don't have any doubts of the safety of the service provided. The incident I referred to was in the past, maybe 10-15 years ago? My intent was to illustrate that if any employee does intend to bend the rules, they will get caught and serve time for it. This engineer exceeded the speed limit, got caught, and served time on the street for it. Additionally, road foremen and other bosses, as well as the occasional FRA inspector will do random radar checks to check speed compliance. These days more than ever, folks know they are to be on their best behavior, because of the budget problems I'm sure the railroad would use any chance you give them to get rid of you.

This is another example on the LIRR forum of a "highjacked" thread again being turned into a craft war. Why can't there be an interesting discussion about something on here without throwing darts?
It only takes one or two to ruin something for everybody else.
Noel Weaver