Proposed Reduced MARC service

<[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, October 16, 2008 3:31 PM
Subject: MTA: October 16, 2008 3:30 PM


Important Information for MARC Train and Commuter Bus Riders

The sources of revenue that support the operation of MTA’s MARC Train and Commuter Bus services have declined dramatically since the start of the fiscal year on July 1. Regrettably, MTA must reduce its budget, and while the majority of reductions are taking place in our administrative budget some MARC Train and Commuter Bus services are proposed for elimination. The proposed service reductions are listed below.

Service reductions are proposed to take effect on January 12, 2009 or sooner if the service reduction is based on a holiday.

MTA will hold public hearings throughout the State to receive public comments on these proposals. Click http://www.mtamaryland.com/Commuter_MARC_Hearings.cfm for a list of public hearings. Citizens may provide comments at any hearing that it is convenient, or may send comments directly to the MTA by mail or email. No matter how it is sent, any comment received by December 26, 2008 will be considered before proposals are finalized.

By mail, please address comments to:

Mr. Glenn Litsinger
MTA Office of Customer Information
6 St. Paul Street
Baltimore MD 21202

By email, address comments regarding Commuter Bus proposals to [email protected] with “Hearing Comments” as the subject heading. Address comments regarding MARC Train proposals to [email protected] with “Hearing Comments” as the subject heading.

The following services are proposed for elimination:

<delete Bus info>

MARC Train

· The last two evening round trip trains on the Penn Line (Trains #445, 446, 447 and 448)

· All service on Mondays through Thursdays on Brunswick Line train #871 (Friday service to continue)

· Termination of Brunswick Line train #883 at Brunswick

· All service on the mid-day bus shuttle between Odenton and Laurel

· In addition to these service reductions, MTA proposes, effective Veterans’ Day, to:

· Eliminate all holiday service on all lines (Columbus Day, Veterans’ Day and the day after Thanksgiving)

· Eliminate service on all lines on the day after Christmas

· Operate holiday service rather than full service on Christmas Eve and the week between Christmas and New Year’s Day

· Operate holiday service rather than full service on the day after New Year’s Day.

· The MTA also proposes to eliminate the MARC Ten-Trip Ticket.

yeah, I got this email yesterday and was shocked when I read how many services they're cutting. I'm not blind to th economy, but these seem to be some pretty drastic cuts, especially during a year when MARC has recorded its highest ridership ever. I think the MTA should at least consider moderate fare increases, but not as drastic as VRE's two fare increases.

MARC may be in for a bumpy ride. We may see a replay of what happened to public commuter railroads and transit systems in the mid-1970s. Rising gas prices boosted ridership but also helped push the economy into recession. Dependent on tax support, many of the lines saw their budgets cut at just the time more and more people were riding. No easy answer.

Sometimes, when faced with reduced tax support commuter agencies use the 'scare tactic' strategy. They propose cuts that are so severe as to outrage the riding public (e.g. Septa once 'proposed' ending weekend rail service) and scare legislators into providing them with more money. Sadly, at least to me, MARC's proposals look pretty real.

realtype wrote:I think the MTA should at least consider moderate fare increases, but not as drastic as VRE's two fare increases.

I certainly agree with that. My monthly ticket went up about a year ago when Metro raised their rates (I use the transit link card that gives me unlimited MARC and Metro service), but the MARC portion of the fare hasn't changed in quite some time.

I'm also surprised at the proposed elimination of the 10 trip ticket. For Odenton the price difference isn't all that great, but I suppose that the move could be to try and increase revenue by steering people to the monthly pass.

I think the holiday cuts are a good move (even though they would be a real PITA for me), when I rode in on Columbus day last week, the train was absolutely deserted. While I liked having the space, it seemed like a waste to operate the train for so few people.

HokieNav wrote:

realtype wrote:I think the MTA should at least consider moderate fare increases, but not as drastic as VRE's two fare increases.

I certainly agree with that. My monthly ticket went up about a year ago when Metro raised their rates (I use the transit link card that gives me unlimited MARC and Metro service), but the MARC portion of the fare hasn't changed in quite some time.

I'm also surprised at the proposed elimination of the 10 trip ticket. For Odenton the price difference isn't all that great, but I suppose that the move could be to try and increase revenue by steering people to the monthly pass.

I think the holiday cuts are a good move (even though they would be a real PITA for me), when I rode in on Columbus day last week, the train was absolutely deserted. While I liked having the space, it seemed like a waste to operate the train for so few people.

Interestingly the ten-trip ticket (and TLC) is probably the only ticket I have never used, but I see lots and lots of other passengers using them (somebody even gave me one with one ride left since he didn't need it), way more so than even the weekly. Guess the conductors are getting tired of punching them

I hear you on the holiday cuts, but I still think MARC should have some service those days. I don't get Columbus or Vet's day off, and it would be a major pain for me to take Metro both ways. The proposed S schedule around the Christmas/New Year's holiday, the cancellation of service after T'gving and Christmas, and the cancellation of the Odenton/Laurel bus are good ideas.

To me the worst possible proposal is the cancellation of 871 on everyday except Friday. I used to rely on that train almost daily when I first took MARC, and while it may not be as packed as the rush hour trains, it still is pretty full. Plus, you can't just look at the current ridership on 871 to see how many people will stop riding MARC, since its different people that use it everyday as a "go home early" train. I heard VRE once cancelled a midday train on one of their lines and they lost three times the number of riders they expected.

A couple years ago VRE had elminated holiday service - which was the "S" schedule to save money and now MARC is copying it.

However, VRE plans to offer the "S" schedule the Friday after Thanksgiving, Christmas & New Year's Day

As for the ten-trip ticket, VRE has kept it to it's popularity, although they've tyring to get more people to use the 5-day or Monthly ticket, which don't require validating everytime to reduce tear and wear on the TVM.

Tommy Meehan wrote:MARC may be in for a bumpy ride. We may see a replay of what happened to public commuter railroads and transit systems in the mid-1970s. Rising gas prices boosted ridership but also helped push the economy into recession. Dependent on tax support, many of the lines saw their budgets cut at just the time more and more people were riding. No easy answer.

Sometimes, when faced with reduced tax support commuter agencies use the 'scare tactic' strategy. They propose cuts that are so severe as to outrage the riding public (e.g. Septa once 'proposed' ending weekend rail service) and scare legislators into providing them with more money. Sadly, at least to me, MARC's proposals look pretty real.

Will the State of Maryland pay any attention to this scare tactic though? From my few rides on MARC it seems that its a relatively small skeletal service now (I'm only a college student in MD for the record, native of NJ) How much more can they really cut and still actually have a service that people are willing to use?

No my point was this doesn't seem like a scare tactic.

MARC is a part of the Maryland State Government, they're a state agency. Their problem is, as their statement explained, tax revenues are falling due to the sputtering economy. All state agencies will be -- or already are -- required to reduce expenses. That is why they are reducing service.

Ridership may begin to fall off too as gas prices ease and unemployment climbs. People out of work don't ride commuter trains. Not a very nice thought, is it?

rcarreras wrote:

Tommy Meehan wrote:MARC may be in for a bumpy ride. We may see a replay of what happened to public commuter railroads and transit systems in the mid-1970s. Rising gas prices boosted ridership but also helped push the economy into recession. Dependent on tax support, many of the lines saw their budgets cut at just the time more and more people were riding. No easy answer.

Sometimes, when faced with reduced tax support commuter agencies use the 'scare tactic' strategy. They propose cuts that are so severe as to outrage the riding public (e.g. Septa once 'proposed' ending weekend rail service) and scare legislators into providing them with more money. Sadly, at least to me, MARC's proposals look pretty real.

Will the State of Maryland pay any attention to this scare tactic though? From my few rides on MARC it seems that its a relatively small skeletal service now (I'm only a college student in MD for the record, native of NJ) How much more can they really cut and still actually have a service that people are willing to use?

Well, the MTA definitely won't introduce all of the reductions, regardless of the feedback. The hearings are just a way of allowing the MTA to see which services to cut. It's sort of like when a car salesman stickers a car at $50,000 when its only worth $40,000, but the customer manages to negotiate down to $42,000 thinking he's saving 8,000 and has a good deal, when actually the salesman is the one making 2K extra.

While the Camden and Brunswick Lines, are rush hour only, I wouldn't call the Penn Line skeletal. Trains run at least every hour during the day, and are much more frequent at rush hour. The Penn trains they are planning to cut are the two last roundtrips, which I think is way too extreme.

btw I'm a college student also (and use MARC to commute), nearly all our out-of-state students are from NJ or NY.
Here's a clue as to where: Terrapins>Tigers

realtype wrote:

rcarreras wrote:

Tommy Meehan wrote:MARC may be in for a bumpy ride. We may see a replay of what happened to public commuter railroads and transit systems in the mid-1970s. Rising gas prices boosted ridership but also helped push the economy into recession. Dependent on tax support, many of the lines saw their budgets cut at just the time more and more people were riding. No easy answer.

Sometimes, when faced with reduced tax support commuter agencies use the 'scare tactic' strategy. They propose cuts that are so severe as to outrage the riding public (e.g. Septa once 'proposed' ending weekend rail service) and scare legislators into providing them with more money. Sadly, at least to me, MARC's proposals look pretty real.

Will the State of Maryland pay any attention to this scare tactic though? From my few rides on MARC it seems that its a relatively small skeletal service now (I'm only a college student in MD for the record, native of NJ) How much more can they really cut and still actually have a service that people are willing to use?

Well, the MTA definitely won't introduce all of the reductions, regardless of the feedback. The hearings are just a way of allowing the MTA to see which services to cut. It's sort of like when a car salesman stickers a car at $50,000 when its only worth $40,000, but the customer manages to negotiate down to $42,000 thinking he's saving 8,000 and has a good deal, when actually the salesman is the one making 2K extra.

While the Camden and Brunswick Lines, are rush hour only, I wouldn't call the Penn Line skeletal. Trains run at least every hour during the day, and are much more frequent at rush hour. The Penn trains they are planning to cut are the two last roundtrips, which I think is way too extreme.

btw I'm a college student also (and use MARC to commute), nearly all our out-of-state students are from NJ or NY.
Here's a clue as to where: Terrapins>Tigers

I didn't think of it that way at first. Kind of makes sense if people really oppose any of the plans, which most likely they will.

I think the Penn Line during the day between both rush hours is pretty good, I was referring more to the whole system with the 3 lines, of which only one provides any service outside of the rush hours. I agree with you on the two night trips, In Jan a few friends and I were thinking of taking a MARC train to DC for a Wizards game only to discover we wouldn't have a way back because the last train left before the game ended. The 11pm train had it been running at that point would have worked but it looks like that might get pulled now. As I have said before I'm only a student here so I don't know if people stay late for dinners or anything else in DC but it seems like this cut could possibly eliminate them as riders, which seems like a step backwards.

Haha, I'm actually a Goucher student, not Towson so I dont really have any say in that. But you are right, there are alot of people from NJ and NY here.

These service cuts would also mean that those passengers who use the MARC on such situations would then have to use WMATA MEtro Subway and get it from Greenbelt, Glenmont and Shady Grove, and this means more packed WMATA trains

This is not right either, since I also like to Railfan MARC especially the Brunswick Line, and this means I may be out of luck, I hope these service cuts never happen.........

From what I've heard from my Amtrak associates, MARC and Amtrak are in conflicts about the funding for the service. MARC usually pays Amtrak 26 million to run their trains, service the equipment, and storage during the day. I heard MARC only paid up 15 million of the 26. The problem is that because of this disagreement, MARC commuters have been getting the toll of the situation with the upcoming service cuts and reductions that impact alot of commuters. It's bad enough that we have shoddy equipment that we hope and pray makes it for the full trip and then to have MTA just shove these cuts in our faces just leaves a sour taste in my mouth. I know the state of the economy has a role in this, but MTA just wants to take drastic measures without trying to audit their practices to see what economical ways they can operate without hemorrhaging money.

The MARC trains recover 54% of the money invested in them, while the commuter buses recover 30-35% of the money invested in them.

It's amazing to see how quickly MARC went from this great 20 year expansion plan to this. Something def needs to be done.

Maryland MTA wrote:The sources of revenue that support the operation of MTA’s MARC Train and Commuter Bus services have declined dramatically since the start of the fiscal year on July 1.

Here's the problem. Where does MTA/MARC find the money to make up for the decline in tax money without reducing their spending? And with unemployment increasing and gas prices dropping dramatically, it's probably going to get worse before it gets better.

As for Amtrak, I looked on the MARC site, but couldn't find-

On one of the sites MARC or VRE or someone mentioned that Amtrak employees won a wage increase this summer that contained retroactive payments. MARC has a lot of Amtrak employees. So obviously MARC had to find a fairly large chunk of money quickly. This may be what someone's Amtrak friends meant??

As for MARC trains recovering 54% of investment, isn't it actually 54% of operating costs they recover? That's a big difference. To recover over half of the billions of dollars invested in them would mean MARC trains were producing a huge cash flow. No commuter road I'm aware of does that.

Tommy Meehan wrote:

Maryland MTA wrote:The sources of revenue that support the operation of MTA’s MARC Train and Commuter Bus services have declined dramatically since the start of the fiscal year on July 1.

Here's the problem. Where does MTA/MARC find the money to make up for the decline in tax money without reducing their spending? And with unemployment increasing and gas prices dropping dramatically, it's probably going to get worse before it gets better.

As for Amtrak, I looked on the MARC site, but couldn't find-

On one of the sites MARC or VRE or someone mentioned that Amtrak employees won a wage increase this summer that contained retroactive payments. MARC has a lot of Amtrak employees. So obviously MARC had to find a fairly large chunk of money quickly. This may be what someone's Amtrak friends meant??

As for MARC trains recovering 54% of investment, isn't it actually 54% of operating costs they recover? That's a big difference. To recover over half of the billions of dollars invested in them would mean MARC trains were producing a huge cash flow. No commuter road I'm aware of does that.

Yeah, I;m pretty sure he meant operating cost recovery. I've seen MTA documents that show that MARC recovers more of the operating cost than any other service they operate (light rail, commuter bus which was second, or local bus). Very interesting info about the Amtrak wages. This will probably also negatively impact the start weekend Penn Line service.

I think MARC was recently reviewing the benefits of having Amtrak and CSX run their trains. I really hope they don't contract out to Veolia or Herzog, whose performance on other rr's seem to be less than stellar. I think the current MARC employees do any excellent job, especially the CSX guys, who are very professional.