Wdobner wrote:Of course of the UCHS or the UCD can get this Historic trolley idea off the ground then that'd possibly be the best thing for the neighborhood since Penn started subsidizing the housing around their campus.
That is a subject in and of itself and you would be wise to "feel out" the company you are in before you say it around here (here refering to west philly). There is a fairly large group of people in the neighborhood who are more than a little bit wary about PENNs intentions and remind us all of the promises that have been made and broken by the university to the neighborhood over the years. Not everybody here agrees that the universitys new found interest in the neighborhood is benign.
Wdobner wrote:(eliminate a parking lane and it's easily done)
not so easily done. People love their parking and it will be hard to convince the food vendors up and down 38th street that giving up thier space that they park their food truck in is good for the public when it forces them out of a location that they have been in for years. Not an insurmountable problem, mind you, but not so easily done.
Wdobner wrote:It'd be even better to see either UCD buy or lease SEPTA's PCCs and the single original Peter Witt, 8534 for service on the loop.
As I understand it, the Peter Witt trolley is not owned by SEPTA and is therefore probably not for sale/lease/use by a potential UC Loop. In any case, whatever trolleys serve this loop, they
must be fully ADA compliant and have modern conveniences that people expect (by which I mean Air Conditioning) if they are to generate any serious ridership. The remaining PCCs are beat to hell and just about used up. They are not fit for service in their present condition and the
nouveau riche in my neighborhood are not interested in their transportaion needs being provided by a rolling relic, no matter what their interest in a historic district may suggest. This may be part of why the UCD decided to wait until PCC IIs were available to run this "demonstrator".
Wdobner wrote: Five Milan Cars from Gomaco, along with three PCCs (assuming we have 6 PCCs in the historic fleet now, and SEPTA gives UCD half) and the single PTC Peter Witt making occasional appearances would really create a unique service.
It would not be attractive, however, from a management standpoint as those dis-similar vehicles would all have their own maintanance needs and would all have separate stockpiles of spare parts to keep them in service. Workers would have to be trained in the operation and service of three very small, unique fleets of vehicles in addition to the K cars that currently serve West Philadelphia.
My real hope is that if this loop were to be started, SEPTA would exercise their option for the 8 additional PCC rebuilds
a la route 15 to supply this service with vehicles. That assumes, of course, that there are 8 additional vehicles anywhere on the property suitable for rebuild.
Wdobner wrote:If UCD tried to push for a historic trolley, SEPTA would fear their territory being treaded on, and would either attempt to kill the Subway-Surface...or try to force UCD off their tracks, no matter how much they were willing to pay SEPTA for them.
I'm not so sure. SEPTA is always interested in new revenue streams and I'm not convinced that they would shoot this down out of hand. If it were presented in the right way, SEPTA might very well agree to create new trolley service. The right way, in this case, is for the UCD in its role of advocate for the local merchants requested the service and identified a source of funding to pay for, or at least offset the cost of, the operation. How much do trolley rebuilds cost? And this would require six or eight? Plus the new track, switches, junctions, overhead and a layover loop all cost money before the first trolley rolls.
I was told by the author of this proposal that they got a lot of people interested in it some time around 1999 and brought it to SEPTA who said something to the effect of "we could run another LUCY bus for you". The trick is not to show how useful the line is; to get this thing running, you have to convince people outside of SEPTA to invest dollars to procure rolling stock and perhaps even subsidize the operation. When that happens, then the loop stands a some sort of chance of being created.
In the meantime, come out and visit our neighborhood tomorrow. Visit the UCD website and download their tourist maps. See the sights. Spend some dollars. And write UCD later on telling them how you come to our neighborhood and enjoyed yourself one fine saturday afternoon because of the trolleys.