• PanAm Train sat unlocked, idling for 15 hours in Manchester

  • Guilford Rail System changed its name to Pan Am Railways in 2006. Discussion relating to the current operations of the Boston & Maine, the Maine Central, and the Springfield Terminal railroads (as well as the Delaware & Hudson while it was under Guilford control until 1988). Official site can be found here: PANAMRAILWAYS.COM.
Guilford Rail System changed its name to Pan Am Railways in 2006. Discussion relating to the current operations of the Boston & Maine, the Maine Central, and the Springfield Terminal railroads (as well as the Delaware & Hudson while it was under Guilford control until 1988). Official site can be found here: PANAMRAILWAYS.COM.

Moderator: MEC407

  by conrail_engineer
 
b&m617 wrote:I really liked the first article that mentioned they had checked for excess carbon monoxide, and the tests were negative. For these Eiinsteins info, a diesel engine does not produce carbon monoxide, so...** HELLO**...there was none present when tested...yah, diesel fumes will make u sick and are considered a carcinogen, but you cannot get Carbon monoxide poisoning from them.....
Not exactly true.

http://www.vehicletest.state.ma.us/dieselbg.html
Health Effects Of Diesel Emissions

Diesel exhaust contains several pollutants that can be harmful to public health alone or in combination with other substances. These include hydrocarbons, nitrogen oxides, fine particulate matter, carbon monoxide, and toxic air contaminants known as hazardous air pollutants.

* Nitrogen oxides (NOx) are by-products of fuel combustion and contribute to the formation of ground-level ozone or "smog." Health effects include coughing, shortness of breath, and decreased lung function.

* Fine particulate matter (PM2.5) is the term used for the mixture of solid particles and liquid droplets in the air. Because of its small size, fine particulate matter can be deposited deep in the lungs, where it can cause health problems. Nitrogen oxides and sulfur dioxides are also major sources of fine particulate matter.

Recent studies have shown an association between particulate matter and premature mortality from respiratory and cardiovascular disease, and increased incidence of respiratory illness, particularly in children and the elderly. For adults with heart or lung conditions, exposure to fine particulate matter can cause more illness and in some cases premature death. More than 90 percent of the particulates found in diesel exhaust are fine particles.

* Hydrocarbons (HC) are formed by incomplete fuel combustion. When combined with NOx in the presence of sunlight, HC's produce ground-level ozone or "smog," which can irritate eyes, damage lungs, and aggravate respiratory problems. Symptoms include coughing, shortness of breath, and decreased lung function. Many hydrocarbons are also considered hazardous air pollutants.

* Carbon monoxide (CO) is formed by incomplete fuel combustion. Carbon monoxide reduces the flow of oxygen in the bloodstream and is of particular concern to people with heart disease.

* Hazardous Air Pollutants (HAPs) Diesel exhaust contains 40 substances that the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency lists as hazardous air pollutants-15 of these are considered probable or known human carcinogens. Of greatest concern are acetaldehyde, benzene, 1,3-butadiene, formaldehyde, and polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons (PAHs). Click here for more information on air toxics from motor vehicles (http://www.epa.gov/otaq/toxics.htm)

For additional information about health effects associated with emissions from diesel engines, you can consult the following sources:

Health Effects Institute (HEI) provides information about the health effects of pollutants from motor vehicles and other sources. The Institute is supported jointly by the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency and industry. The section of the HEI Web site highlighted below provides a summary of HEI research on diesel exhaust and other pollutants. (http://www.healtheffects.org/pubs-special.htm)

American Lung Association focuses on environmental health and on lung disease in all its forms. This section of the Association's Web site provides information about the health effects of diesel emissions. (http://www.lungusa.org/air/airout00_diesel.html)

For information about health effects associated with gasoline engine emissions, click here (http://www.epa.gov/otaq/rfgheal.htm.)

  by MEC407
 
The saga continues:

http://tinyurl.com/3a7s7v

  by Finch
 
Maybe I came across as too harsh on my last post. I do think 15 hours is a whole lot of idling. I'm not surprised that nearby residents were a bit put-off by that. My complaints rest more with the Union Leader for rather sensational reporting.

  by MEC407
 
I lost respect for that paper when they decided to invoke images of 9/11 just to get their point across regarding idling trains. Totally disrespectful and uncalled for.

  by johnpbarlow
 
I like this excerpt from the Hooksett article:
"The only difference in this is that the train was locked and in a secluded area," said O'Keefe, who said she's never seen a parked train in the 20 years she's worked at the plant. "A lot of weirdos," she noted, ply paths around the tracks.
Is she referring to us railfans? We don't get no respect!

  by conrail_engineer
 
Finch wrote:Maybe I came across as too harsh on my last post. I do think 15 hours is a whole lot of idling. I'm not surprised that nearby residents were a bit put-off by that. My complaints rest more with the Union Leader for rather sensational reporting.
You have to expect that from today's newspaper writers.

I kid you not. In a previous life, long ago...a kid who was me was attending the Kent State School of Journalism. There were a lot of reasons why I pulled the plug (I was on the Dean's List, but not for good grades. I was on his other list...) but not the least of them were disgust with the type of students getting into my field, and their outlook - dim, dizzy, naiive and incurious.

It's not surprising that this stellar example of today's newspapering, would be shocked, SHOCKED!! that locomotives are left running.

Nor surprising that she didn't bother to find out why. Incuriosity is another tradmark of today's reporters.

  by cpf354
 
conrail_engineer wrote:
Finch wrote:Maybe I came across as too harsh on my last post. I do think 15 hours is a whole lot of idling. I'm not surprised that nearby residents were a bit put-off by that. My complaints rest more with the Union Leader for rather sensational reporting.
You have to expect that from today's newspaper writers.

I kid you not. In a previous life, long ago...a kid who was me was attending the Kent State School of Journalism. There were a lot of reasons why I pulled the plug (I was on the Dean's List, but not for good grades. I was on his other list...) but not the least of them were disgust with the type of students getting into my field, and their outlook - dim, dizzy, naiive and incurious.

It's not surprising that this stellar example of today's newspapering, would be shocked, SHOCKED!! that locomotives are left running.

Nor surprising that she didn't bother to find out why. Incuriosity is another tradmark of today's reporters.
That's true of everyone in the news media. They're all stars, or want to be. In print journalism, you're working your way up to being editor or winning a Pulitzer. In the electronic media, it's all about the face on the screen, not the story. "Incuriosity" is a perfect description. Nobody on these smaller papers is there to do the job, just getting their resume padded out for a bigger job somewhere else.

  by bozotexino
 
Did anyone else notice that one of the reader comments at the bottom of the Exeter article is by none other than Debby Atwell of "Clean Air for Rockland"?

These people seem to be obsessed with "dirty old trains", as they call them. They've been harassing the Maine Eastern for months, and it now appears they're looking to spread the message far and wide.

It’s not going to be long before this kind of “thinking” is everywhere. It’s probably already more widespread than we think it is. Get your photos of steam locomotives and classic diesels ASAP!!! There may not be much time left…

bozo

  by emd_16645
 
bozotexino wrote:Did anyone else notice that one of the reader comments at the bottom of the Exeter article is by none other than Debby Atwell of "Clean Air for Rockland"?

These people seem to be obsessed with "dirty old trains", as they call them. They've been harassing the Maine Eastern for months, and it now appears they're looking to spread the message far and wide.

It’s not going to be long before this kind of “thinking” is everywhere. It’s probably already more widespread than we think it is. Get your photos of steam locomotives and classic diesels ASAP!!! There may not be much time left…

bozo
These are the same people who will try to chase trains off the face of the earth so that that trucks can take over. Most people fail to realize just how much cargo a single train carries.

  by bozotexino
 
emd_16645 wrote: These are the same people who will try to chase trains off the face of the earth so that that trucks can take over. Most people fail to realize just how much cargo a single train carries.
It's not just that. Read some of the comments they and their ilk have been making. They claim to have "no problem" with trains, as long as they're powered by brand-new multi-million dollar "green" locomotives and don't run near their houses. Oh, that isn't economically feasible? Guess what, they don't care! We must all fall into line and change the world so they can go about their daily lives without being offended by "polluting machines".

NIMBY? No, more like not in my backyard, not near my house, not in my town, out of my sight!!!

When they succeed in getting rid of all the "dirty old trains", I'm sure trucks will be next on their list. Once all the "dirty old machines" are banned, they'll start demonizing even the "green" machines. By the time they're done, we'll be living in mudhuts and eating leaves...

bozo

  by NRGeep
 
No doubt there are extremists on the Right and the Left but they are in the minority. Before we rush into Limbaughian paranoia it bears witness to remember that most mainstream environmentalists are pro-train and let's work together to increase rolling stock on our rails... http://www.trainchartering.com/news_environmental.html
:-D

  by Otto Vondrak
 
ahem... back to Guilford, not a critique of the media at large.

-otto-

  by BrianS
 
[quote="mick"]#2A train crew can work over the Hours of Service only in an emergency, or to secure equipment, and only if directed by a supervisor.

Uh, NO train service employees CANNOT work over 12 hours "on duty" time no matter what. Not even a supervisor can make them. I was told not to even tell the re-crew they had a good roll by once, because I was past my hours of service. I couldnt even talk on a radio. and NO no in an emergency can they make you work over 12 hours. That is an FRA thing, NOT a managment thing

Brian
NECR

  by mick
 
Uh,
Last edited by mick on Mon Apr 14, 2008 5:28 am, edited 1 time in total.

  by NV290
 
BrianS wrote:
mick wrote:#2A train crew can work over the Hours of Service only in an emergency, or to secure equipment, and only if directed by a supervisor.

Uh, NO train service employees CANNOT work over 12 hours "on duty" time no matter what. Not even a supervisor can make them. I was told not to even tell the re-crew they had a good roll by once, because I was past my hours of service. I couldnt even talk on a radio. and NO no in an emergency can they make you work over 12 hours. That is an FRA thing, NOT a managment thing

Brian
NECR
Your comparing two different issues. Sticking around for a roll by is not an emergency. Nor is a dispatcher asking you to (for example), move a hot car or engine to a another track, etc, But as said by Mick, if while you were getting in a taxi you saw a dangerous condition, you most certainly could and SHOULD report it and you will not be in any trouble with the FRA. Just as if you are deadheading in a locomotive and you have outlawed you could step in if an emergency arose.

A supervisor can order you to work over the HOS in an emergency. Just as a supervisor can order you to take a non complying locomotive. A perfect example of a situation where you could go over the 12 hour limit in an "emergency" would be (for example), stalling over a busy road crossing and you have to cut your train. A supervisor can order you to do so and they, not you are the ones liable with the FRA. So long as a supervisor ORDERS you to do something and gives their name on a recorded line, barring something that is outright dangerous, you can do it without fear of the FRA. That supervisor assumes the risk, not you. The vast majority of the railroads clearly have a rule that insubordination is a fireable offense. Always get a name and always have them say it over a radio.

I have spoken to the FRA first hand on this issue because i have been ordered to do things that the FRA does not allow. They told me what i said above. If you are ORDERED to do it, the person ordering you assumes the responsibility.