Please Help To Save The Bel Del

SO and Washington S;

I have the same concern. The B-D Rwy owns the line, not the Tech Society, correct? Is there perhaps a lease? Additionally, what recourse does the Society have if say in another year they stop running on that line alltogether? If a bunch of brand new ties have been installed through donations, who ends up with the new ties? Will they be left to rot? Does the property owner get them? I do agree that the most scenic part of the line is south of Carpentersville, and I think the Society is wise in trying to reach that end.

How about relay ties? The CNY just removed rail from the second track over Gulf Summit in NY and PA. Since the CNY is owned by the NYS&W, would the Society have an "in" to get the ties that were under that rail? Might be enough good used ties to replace every tie for the entire 15 miles and it would be a tax right off for the CNY as well as being environmentally friendly for them.

What about gov't grant money? The TEA-21 or whatever the new Fed money is called has applications available. Historic railroad oriented projects typically get a good ranking. It also helps that those towns along the line probably haven't gotten funding for historic rail projects before. You wouldn't get the funding right away, but it is another resource.

I will be glad to donate money for a tie or two as I think it is a rail line that should be kept in tact, but to me I need to know there will be a decent (lifetime) and secure return on my investment.

This also leaves me wondering about the BR&W mainline. The long term goal for the BR&W Historic Trust is the return of service to Lambertville. With two, or three including the NH&I, railroads competing in basically the same general area for the same passengers, someone is going to lose.

If it makes anyone feel better you can now go to the THS web site and make a donation with M/C or Visa if you would like to help.

(NYSWTHS.ORG) left side of the page, second item down.

Buy A Tie

Thank you!!

I don't know how many I'm speaking for, but I imagine I'm echoing the concern of quite a few. There are too many questions and technicalities involving a for profit company for me to "donate" any money.

I don't know how many I'm speaking for, but I imagine I'm echoing the concern of quite a few. There are too many questions and technicalities involving a for profit company for me to "donate" any money.

I think Donko142 missed the point. As a 501(c)3 non-profit you have a lot of legal obligations with what you do with tax-deductible money. No one has yet explained why you are giving tax exempt money to a for profit railroad. As it stands it could lead to the IRS investigating your tax-exempt status. Also NJ non-profits are regulated by a state charitible board that is looking to prevent donor fraud. Unless there is some "protection" mechanism or other isolation from benefiting a for-profit company, I believe this puts the organizations non-profit status in serious jeopardy.

Don, I'm bringing over a full 18` trailer of ties soon. I have a friend that is in charge with mow on the harrisburg division of NS. Theses ties were last on the blandon low grade for only like three years they are in tip top shape, the ties are on a person privet ground, plus the four I'm giving. The trailer can hold up to 7,000lbs.

Len.

That's great!!!!! Again walking the walk Len! Let me know what day is good for you? I got some more donation checks today.

Thank you very much!

I'll make my last comment about this tomorrow, good night.

Hi Don,
If next Sunday is clear I'll try to bring them over then, It will be sometime affter 12 noon. Where do you want them unloaded?

The PRR is my favorite railroad, I got to keep it alive some how. lol.

Len

Railroad Museum of Pennsylvania
http://www.rrmuseumpa.org

Don,
you might remeber me, if you don't I was the guy last year at Pete's photo shoot wearing the old time engineer out fit with the real PRR lanterns one Red glove and one clear grove. Both date back to the 1920's.

If everything goses well this year I'm hoping to put on your caboose a real PRR 4 chime whistle. the whistle came off a PRR business coach. My Father found it along the Schuylkill Division back in the 1940's.
I also sujested that he have an old time gandy dancer shoot. I own quite abit of old time mow tools. Including a Philadelphia & Reading Co. two wheel tool car from 1917 that rides on the one rail and a three wheel PRR track gage. I also own a PRR switch defector.

Len.

Steamtown Observer wrote:

I don't know how many I'm speaking for, but I imagine I'm echoing the concern of quite a few. There are too many questions and technicalities involving a for profit company for me to "donate" any money.

I think Donko142 missed the point. As a 501(c)3 non-profit you have a lot of legal obligations with what you do with tax-deductible money. No one has yet explained why you are giving tax exempt money to a for profit railroad. As it stands it could lead to the IRS investigating your tax-exempt status. Also NJ non-profits are regulated by a state charitible board that is looking to prevent donor fraud. Unless there is some "protection" mechanism or other isolation from benefiting a for-profit company, I believe this puts the organizations non-profit status in serious jeopardy.

It should be easy to resolve by entering into a lease for the use of the line. Simliar to a non-profit entering into a lease for a building and the non-profit effecting renovations to serve its purposes. The landlord is benefited indirectly, but so long as it is not a sham transaction, and the funds expended bear a reasonable relationship to the term of the lease, etc. there is no concern. Done all the time.

Whats with this "walking the walk" nonsence? Lets put this in prospective.. Its a railroad... Not needy children, not hurricane vicitims... Talk about walking the walk when it involves something other then a forgotten railroad and a steam engine, then I'll be impressed.

Washington, the fact it isn't a for gotten railroad nore a for gotten steam engine The 142 is about as famus as the Reading T-1 was when it was running the rails of eastern cost of the US. The Bel Del was a branch of the Pennsylvania Railroad, you know the stander railroad of the world. What their trying to do is preseve a pice of New Jersey history. The Belvidere Delaware Railroad Company was known as the Backdoor Freight line to bypass heavy traffic in the New York City area. It went from Trenton to Belvidere.

There were names of train that rode the rails like.

Train 355 Trenton Local, Weekday at 4:07a.m.
Train 357 Pocono Limited to Philadelphia, Sundays only 7:58 p.m.
Train 359 Trenton Express, Daily to Philadelphia, June 27 - September 12th. 6:25 a.m.
Train 365 Philadelphia Express, Weekdays 9:56 a.m.

And the list goses on and on.

Len.

Wow, and you completly missed my point...

And the next upgrade this forum gets should be a spell check option.

Hi Len

I was the engineer that night for the photo freight. This will be my last quote for this site, I don’t know what to make of it? I never thought I would fined so much negative feed back about anything to do with railroads here. You missed the point Len that’s O.K. I must have missed the point at the same time! Talk the talk there is lots of it here, I walk the walk in many cases, were you in New Orleans last summer helping tons of Americans Washington, doubt it! So don’t go there! Lots of walking the walk at the same time (Thank you VERY much people, received 4 more checks today) Look were all professionals and adults here (for the most part) lets all act like it. Non-profit//// Profit, what profit?? The section of the railroad were talking about has been out of service since 2004 ( I think I dropped the last cars at CPG July 04) The big customer in Milford (the paper mill) has been gone for years and the condo’s are coming.
The railroad and the THX have a good deal going I don’t know where the line in the sand is, the partnership and the relationships with the local towns down the R.R. is looking better every day. But what do you think the future holds for a section of railroad that has no freight customers and Rails to Trails knocking on the railhead at the end of the line? If any of you guys with the negative postings were writing a check for $5000.00 (your acting like it )I would totally 100% understand why you would want more details, I don’t think any of you or myself are writing that check! Is there a 1% chance the Bel-Del (and any other R.R .for that matter) won’t be there in five years, YES I can’t see the future. What’s important to me is trying to do what ever I can to save this historic piece of railroad at the moment. What if nothing is done? In five years you’re on this site saying we should have helped out, one more piece gone for good, maybe or maybe not. I donated $250.00 out of my pocket, the first time I look out the window and see a father and his kids looking up at the engine with a big smile, that’s when I get my $250.00’s worth. (where was I going with $250.00, Florida for a month or something. ya) Knowing I help buy 8 ties and got us that much further south, plus all the people that will take that ride and have that same smile on there face makes it worth it to me. If you don’t want to donate YOUR money, don’t it’s as simple as that. But please be professional and don’t discredit, insult or make negative comments about what were doing here every weekend. (Trying to save a piece of great American railroad for the people to enjoy). Just like last weekend we have a bunch of American’s here volunteering there time, working on a engine that is in the middle of a five year in a cold shop ( o.k. it’s 50 once and a while if were lucky ), or inspecting the track ( like last Sunday when I was out there in the cold and wind instead of making $60.00 a hour working a O.T. job) for ZERO, that’s what we get ZERO, no gas money, not even free lunch. It’s a labor of love that’s all. So don’t cut on it and insult us by implying were trying to rip someone off or something! All I ask for is do what all our mother’s taught us, if you can’t say something nice don’t say anything at all!
For all you Walkers, thanks again for your support the project is going well and we have three more weeks to go. If you would like you can donate over the net with MC or Visa at (NYSWTHS.ORG) in the left column, second one down Buy-A-Tie, it doesn’t get easier then that. Please if you are down at the railroad this summer don’t hesitate to come talk to one of the crew and tell them you donated to the BUY -A- TIE program, we’ll be proud to have you aboard.
Last, lets all remember what’s really important here, our families and our health that’s all and number one!!!
I wish everyone and their families a happy & healthy year! ( even you Washington )

Take care

Len e-mail me your # so we can set up the tie drop, Thanks

Len
The tie's will go to the siding at Kent

Gentleman---After reviewing all that has been said, I have come to a decision. The ones that are trying to obtain donations for the Bel-Del repairs have explained their purpose well and I believe no more needs to be explained as to what needs to be done or how in that area. All should consider donating, however, there are some that are unhappy with the rhetoric that is used with this process. I do not want to see anyone insulted here or feelings hurt and I see that might be close. Therefore, I will lock this thread for a period of time I feel necessary to "settle" everyone's anguish. Any arrangements that need to be made about tie distribution, please do so by private e-mail. Thank you.