Playing Trains With Tax Dollars

Really? No where does the article mention unionized lines. Guess you just "assumed" that, instead of reading it.

Feel free to "assume" what I might oppose, as you really have no clue.

The article does not mention unionized lines, but rather assumption is useful in debating an argument from both sides. Assumption allows us to look at a situation from various perspectives and to reach a conclusion regarding opinions and stances on that particular issue.

I always enjoy mature, thoughtful, and open debate. I believe that I do have a clue about the main issues being debated on this thread: First, there is the issue of whether or not spending tax money on the CMSL freight rehab is a prudent investment. Secondly, there is the broader issue of using tax money to fund non-union projects, and the harmful effects on the quantity and quality of jobs that often result from such funding arrangements.

I see three potential reasons to oppose the state funding that the CMSL is receiving:

The first, which is mentioned in the Atlantic City Press article, and is also argued very well on this thread, is the idea that public tax money would be better spent in other areas, such as Salem or more urbanized locations. According to predictions, the CMSL freight service has the potential to haul 3,000 cars annually. How does this compare to other freight services in the state? I would assume the union would also be against all other tax-funded freight services that haul less than the CMSL? A more difficult issue is also deciding where tax money is “needed.” Should money only be spent where there will be an instantly higher return? Or, should money be spent with the hope of future development and economic revitalization? The latter was a main justification for the RiverLine. There is certainly no easy answer to this question.

The second argument, although not said directly on this thread, is the stance that no tax money should be spent on non-union projects. If the CMSL were to become unionized would the union still be against investing more money in the CMSL? This is certainly an issue that extends beyond the railroad and the transportation industry. There has certainly been an effort to erode unions, both domestically and internationally, and we have seen working conditions and real wages decline proportionally during the past few decades. As a member of NJEA should I oppose all tax money spent on charter schools because all of their teachers are not union members?

The third argument is really a combination of the preceding two.

I don’t think that there is an easy answer to this question. We will see what happens…

Hello gentlemen...

OK, let's look at this from one very simple perspective: Annual carload movement. I'm going to go with a pretty conservative number on this, with my own initial estimate of annual movements on this newly reconditioned portion of the Cape May Branch (and this is my own estimate only, I am in no way relying on information from CMSL sources, or anyone else...all flames shall come flying at me, please), and that number is 1500. That means around 30 carloads per week over this portion of rail initially (this is supposed to be when service just starts out, not after any other hypothetical potential customers sign up). I know, that seems a bit low, but still...we're working conservatively here, remember. This is over a portion of railroad that is 5 miles in length.

Now, let's do a little factual comparison. The Salem Running Track, from Swedesboro to 29.96 and the Salem Industrial Track from 29.96 to Salem Yard is a total distance of 16.94 miles. Let's talk about how much money would be needed to turn this dilapidated, just under 17-mile, segment of steel and wood into a viable piece of railroad. I don't know about everyone else here, but I see a figure of 9 million dollars in that article. While we're accumulating some information here, just so we have all the facts and people can make a good and accurate decision for themselves on this issue, is anyone here able to provide us with an estimate of annual carloads moved over the SRNJ Salem Running Track annually by SRNJ?

What I'm attempting to do here is set aside all this union stuff, and help myself and everyone else decide where they stand on this issue based on pure fact and logical speculation. I've given you guys what I know and can safely assume, now I need you to fill in the gaps to help us all out. What I'm also trying to do is at least show everyone the potential of this CMSL operation, in relation to other shortline operations in the area. All of these shortlines that are in need of money have potential, and just because this CMSL freight operation has not yet begun does not mean that there is any less potential here than exists anywhere else along the rails in Southern New Jersey.

This is in no way a contest between local shortline railroads. At this time, the CMSL is attempting to restore significant freight railroad service to a portion of the state that has unbelievable economic potential, wheather those in opposition here can see that or not. While I cannot and would never dream of being able to speak for the individual railroads themselves, I am pretty sure that most if not all of the shortlines operating in southern New Jersey are at least in some way supportive of the CMSL's attempt to restore freight service to Woodbine. No, Ford is not going to build a plant there. But a company named Modern Gas (among others) is already there, currently relying entirely on truck transportation, and patiently waiting to move a significant quantity of LPG tanks in and out via the railroad. And that, my friends, is a fact.

Mike DiMunno
www.SJRail.com: All about South Jersey Railroads!

I am a little bit confused bythe whole situation here. The BLET has a ptoblem with the CMSL opening this line because they are not union? I was under the impression that Cape May county's political oficials were making an ffort to pressure NJT into retoring this line for service beacuse of the future of freight potential, as well as the possible future of a returned commuter line the the area. How much of this is true? I personally hope to see the line restored, as I favor restoration of any rail service in this state to take trucks off our roads. I just don't have a good understanding of why so many people seem to be against the reopening of the CM branch.

Ed

Elwood wrote:I am a little bit confused bythe whole situation here. The BLET has a ptoblem with the CMSL opening this line because they are not union? I was under the impression that Cape May county's political oficials were making an ffort to pressure NJT into retoring this line for service beacuse of the future of freight potential, as well as the possible future of a returned commuter line the the area. How much of this is true? I personally hope to see the line restored, as I favor restoration of any rail service in this state to take trucks off our roads. I just don't have a good understanding of why so many people seem to be against the reopening of the CM branch.

Ed

Well, the reason that most of these people are in opposition is because there is the argument that the state money being supplied to the CMSL at this time for their freight service rehabilitation could be better used elsewhere in the region, for other more "worthwhile" projects.

Mike DiMunno

Union or non-union has not entered into this equation at all. Both shortlines are non-union, and probably will remain that way forever.

The SRNJ is moving slightly over 2,000 cars a year on the Salem Branch, which provides jobs here in South Jersey (union and non-union) for more than 600 people. The branch needs repairs, and thus far, no money has been available from the state.

The CMSL is presently operating 0 cars per year on the Cape May Branch and providing 0 jobs for South Jersey. However, an UNBELIEVABLE potential (good choice, since it is hard to believe) for service and jobs exist, thus the money should go to this pie in the sky project.

Mike, expect Modern Gas to move 3 loads and 3 empties a week in and out of their facility. This leaves only 1,200 additional loads and empties to meet your projection.

Bob, If your worried about wasting your tax dollars you should be more worried about all the money be wasted on the Atlantic City line. The line will never make money and we'll pay more to keep this alive than about the money being used in Cape May or any other project in South Jersey. C.Weldon