our transit history preserved - in SAN FRANCISCO

check out this site:

http://www.streetcar.org/mim/streetcars ... index.html

quite a few ex philly PCCs in service

http://www.streetcar.org/mim/streetcars ... index.html

seems like a place that is worth a visit

anyone ever been?

Yes, many times:

Silver PTC

Same silver one, from back

With a yellow and blue one

Brooklyn colors

Red Arrow Lines colors

SF Muni colors

That Red Arrow painted car is MUNI No. 1007. I believe it is a "true" PCC car ( unlike the Red Arrow Cars which it represents). Unlike the single ended PCC's, that car did not actually run in Philly, but was always a MUNI car. One other difference is the full ( double wide) doors behind the operator's platform. The Red Arrow Cars had ( have) a single door in that position.

Amazing how another city can turn something that SEPTA could do nothing with into something so successful. Another classic example of colossal mismanagement and ineptness at 1234. I'm still in amazement that the 15 came back to life with PCC cars painted in PTC colors, but then you ride the line (like when trying to get to work as opposed to railfanning) and you realize you're in Philly on SEPTA.

What do they (San FRancisco) do about handicapped access
on these old car?.

My guess is it's impossible to retrofit in these cars

San Francisco is usually pretty progressive on these kind of
things (or are forced to be by their citizens) -- what do they do in this case? Just ignore it?

Dont' get me wrong -- I love seeing these cars -- just wondering
if it was an issue and how it was resolved. I could imagine it being
an issue driving the scrapping of the old cars here.

JS

I love this city and it's the streetcars that keep me going out there. My two daughters who live in the Bay Area think I am a devoted father for coming out there so frequently to visit them but it's really those PCC's that I rode on as a kid that I go to see, along with BART, Caltrain, Calif. Amtrak, MUNI, and UP. As for the handicap ( can you say that anymore, ? )compliance it's been no problem. The stops have access ramps and the cars have platforms at the doors that lower into position when needed. For anyone who wants to see what it was like 60 years ago when streetcars ruled the roadways go to SF. You can even get from the airport by rail, BART, and get off at Montgomery St and see MUNI modern light rail, the cable cars and the PCC's on Market St all at the same stop. It will be the best rail fan trip of your life. For NJ rail fans it's a shame but the one PCC in the Public Service Newark livery was wrecked in a collision a few years ago but maybe one of the newly arrived Newark cars will be repainted in the original paint scheme.

jfrey40535 wrote:Amazing how another city can turn something that SEPTA could do nothing with into something so successful. Another classic example of colossal mismanagement and ineptness at 1234. I'm still in amazement that the 15 came back to life with PCC cars painted in PTC colors, but then you ride the line (like when trying to get to work as opposed to railfanning) and you realize you're in Philly on SEPTA.

agreed

how great would those pccs look near independence hall, in fairmount park, on the parkway, on penn's landing or by the stadiums

or even better yet, in revenue service on the 23 and/or 56

we stink!!!

^What, you only just reached that conclusion?

I'm glad to hear someone's been able to do something good with the old PCC cars. Better to have them running in another city than rusting away in this one.

check out this site

http://www.heritagetrolley.org/ExistingSystems.htm

note the six large scale systems at the top includes philadelphia

note 5 of them have this distinction
* Systems actively planning/building significant extensions.

guess who doesn't

What I find remarkable about the surface streetcar operations in San Francisco is the degree of cooperation between Muni (the local transit agency) and the volunteers of the Market Street Railway. It stands in marked contrast to SEPTA's attitude towards outside groups like DVARP, even when we're trying to support their efforts in one area or another.

Sometimes SEPTA is its own worst enemy.

"This job would be great if it weren't for the customers." --from the movie Clerks.

Sometimes the riders are SEPTA's own worst enemy, if you consider that while there are some riders who like the trolley, others hate it when it gets stuck behind a truck unloading in front of a business or a double-parked car. Or the riders who complain when SEPTA moves or eliminates bus stops to speed up the ride, while other complain about how slow it is.