Oopsie on the R5 Doylestown

This happened Tuesday morning and Channel 3 is JUST getting to this report?

Despite the OVER-HYPE that the report puts on it, there is a simple cut-and-dry answer to how this happened:

Someone forgot to apply the handbrakes, and when the power was turned off to the catenary, the air eventually bled off, the brakes released, and the train rolled out the yard.

http://kyw.com/topstories/local_story_293191603.html

If I may borrow this analytical response from another poster on another forum on the report:

(Begin Quote)
Ordeal
1 : a primitive means used to determine guilt or innocence by submitting the accused to dangerous or painful tests believed to be under supernatural control <ordeal by fire>
2 : a severe trial or experience

An empty train rolling through the woods at 1:00 AM on a weekday? Would you call this an ordeal? Not exactly "Silver Streak"! There are three sparsely traveled grade crossings and one station at the college. There is a very good chance that no one actually even saw it, let alone were endangered by it.

What went wrong? They tell you at least a couple times in the story. Power brakes were set, hand brakes were not. Someone forgot. Power cut off, brakes gone. Mystery solved. Now they just need to find out who did it and nail him or her to a cross as an example of how good they are doing their job.

Also, several miles in three minutes? To roll six miles in three minutes, the train would have to be going 120 MPH from a dead stop! It is actually only 3 miles, so even 60 MPH from a dead stop would take 3 minutes. The elapsed time was probably more in the 5-10 minute neighborhood, with speeds topping out at 30 MPH.

A runaway train? To quote the SEPTA rider, "Astonishing?" " Amazing?" Never heard of this before? New to this planet? Forgot to set the brakes? That has never happened before? Where did they find this guy?

Investigators working overtime? SEPTA must have money to burn.
(End Quote)

Slightly O/T...

I remember when an Amfleet coach got loose in Penn Station (NYP). No one set the hand brakes, or at least enough of the ONE that it has, the air eventually bled off and it rolled south out of the station and in to the Hudson River Tube. Straight through the yard, over all the preset puzzle switches and right into the tube.

Well, as we all know, the tubes are downhill until the middle where they go uphill. Duh. It rocked back and forth for some time before they could safely get the switcher in there to 'gently' couple up to it.

A mistake? You sure bet! Never been done before... not really.

And yes, SEPTA has money to BUUUURRRNNN.

SEPTA seems to be pretty good at making runaway trains. Only a few months ago, a Acela set rolled out of Frazer yard and down the Harrisburg line for a few miles. Stopped somewhere near Downingtown.

No wonder SEPTA is the laughing stock of Northeastern Railroads. I get a kick when I see that new ad on the MFL of the conductor saying "This is an eatin' town, and I'm a eatin' man". No disrespect to the guy, but kinda shows the mentality of our railroad.

jfrey40535 wrote:SEPTA seems to be pretty good at making runaway trains. Only a few months ago, a Acela set rolled out of Frazer yard and down the Harrisburg line for a few miles. Stopped somewhere near Downingtown.

No wonder SEPTA is the laughing stock of Northeastern Railroads. I get a kick when I see that new ad on the MFL of the conductor saying "This is an eatin' town, and I'm a eatin' man". No disrespect to the guy, but kinda shows the mentality of our railroad.

And in that Acela case, it was someone failing to properly chock the cars, since they don't have handbrakes. Good thing Track #2 out of Frazer is nothing more than a super-long yard lead to Downs.

Is the grade really steep enough to get it up to even 30 MPH? Also, what's the track speed on that stretch of track?

This is another example of sensationalist news. Anymore, all news is sensationalist. I work at home, and I leave CNN or CNBC on in the background. Guess what: nothing happens, so they find something and call it "breaking news" and make a big deal out of nothing. All day, every day. Huge earthshaking news stories about nothing. What a waste. Somebody at SEPTA made a mistake, and they should be reprimanded according to company policy.

As far as the Acela rolling out of the west end of Frazer Yard, SEPTA has since mandated that the derail on the west end lead remain in the derailing position. Regarding the grade and speed of the Doylestown incident, the grade from Doylestown south is mostly downhill (obviously) until about New Britain station, then it slowly goes upgrade to Rt. 202, which is a fairly good stretch, considering numerous road crossings and a couple stations. The maximum authorized passenger speed is 40mph from Lansdale to Doylestown on the single track. I find it strange that SEPTA is advertising itself now just weeks before an imminent work stoppage on a large part of their system. SEPTA true to form, backwards as usual.

PARailWiz wrote:Is the grade really steep enough to get it up to even 30 MPH? Also, what's the track speed on that stretch of track?

Not that steep a grade, but long enough. Passenger speed on the branch is 40mph, not counting restrictions around Forest siding and in Lansdale.

Passenger speed on the branch is 40mph

Ich, that sucks. How come upgrading this line's power system and rails isn't in the plans? The trains are always packed from what I see at Market East, Suburban, and 30th street.

And the current power system does not let them run the P/P's to Doylestown, correct?

I would think this line would be a good candidate for a P/P set as the line is always crowded during rush hour. In fact, it would make sense to run an early P/P set in from Doylestown, then express it to Thorndale and run it back in again during the morning if time permits. At least that way they'd get a few more runs in with these sets, and give people a little breathing room instead of being packed like sardines.

At one point P/P's were on the Doylestown branch. The problem was storage, the yard tracks aren't long enough to store them. SEPTA used to store them on the south end of Long siding, but between the kids graffiti and the neighbors complaining about the engine noise overnight, they nixed the idea. Besides, it really isn't that practical to run thoses AEM-7's at 40mph for a few local stops when you could just as well run MU's.

SCB2525 wrote:

Passenger speed on the branch is 40mph

Ich, that sucks. How come upgrading this line's power system and rails isn't in the plans? The trains are always packed from what I see at Market East, Suburban, and 30th street.

The rails were replaced on the entire branch back in the summer of 1984 when welded rail was first installed. As for power upgrades, that would require repair of the Doylestown substation, which has been pretty much dead since a lightning strike years ago.

whovian wrote:At one point P/P's were on the Doylestown branch. The problem was storage, the yard tracks aren't long enough to store them. SEPTA used to store them on the south end of Long siding, but between the kids graffiti and the neighbors complaining about the engine noise overnight, they nixed the idea. Besides, it really isn't that practical to run thoses AEM-7's at 40mph for a few local stops when you could just as well run MU's.

And yet, while they complained about the sound of ONE AEM-7 running in layover mode....they didn't mind a dozen Silverliners parked there overnight with all the noise they make. One loco is a lot quieter than a dozen MU's.

But other than that, I agree....stops too close together at 40mph, and add in that one AEM-7 draws almost as much power as 8 Silverliners...the dead substation at Doylestown ever since the lightning strike (IIRC, a special instruction prohibits drawing power over the P2 position on the branch)...it's not practical for Bombers to run up there.

I agree with previous posts. CBS should not have made it sound as though a train grew a brain and started "running away" and then "stopped on its own" like this is Shining time station or something. Oh no! Sir Toppam Hat! Find out who didn't set the brakes! Naughty train! Good train!
It's easy to understand the downgrade and upgrade is what caused the starting and stopping.

There's no mystery to be solved, except how SEPTA has been in business this long.