New Jersey Seashore Lines: was CNJ being cleard Woodmansie>N

Just as a side note, My father has a part time co-worker who works for Conrail Shared Assets in the track maintenance department (locally). My father asks him regularly what he has heard on this subject and his response was and still is that he doesn't know anything about what is going on down there - and simply because past Lakehurst it is out of his hands. I just find it odd that even someone who works for the connecting line really doesn't know what is happening either! When asked about the southern secondary - he just says it is regular maintenance they are doing (like the LARGE pile of ties at the Sycamore Ave crossing in Shrewsberry they are slowly chipping away at).

The in service of the Southern Secondary is in service. Its not like maintenance is required for it to get "more in service" - the speeds might be reduced from their maximum but its still "in service" If Conrail decided to do more work ahead of time to get it in better shape for more traffic, thats their choice, but they don't have to. Of course, they would need to reattach that rail south of Lakewood, but thats not a big deal and can be done in literally a few minutes.

As for the weight of the cars, (and in turn, their effect on the track) they are going to be limited by the max weight allowed on the Coast Line by NJT, which i BELIEVE is 263,000, but I don't remember off hand. I don't think it was raised to 286,000 lbs, or at least not yet.

Jtgshu wrote:The in service of the Southern Secondary is in service. Its not like maintenance is required for it to get "more in service" - the speeds might be reduced from their maximum but its still "in service" If Conrail decided to do more work ahead of time to get it in better shape for more traffic, thats their choice, but they don't have to. Of course, they would need to reattach that rail south of Lakewood, but thats not a big deal and can be done in literally a few minutes.

As for the weight of the cars, (and in turn, their effect on the track) they are going to be limited by the max weight allowed on the Coast Line by NJT, which i BELIEVE is 263,000, but I don't remember off hand. I don't think it was raised to 286,000 lbs, or at least not yet.

Is that NJT limit governed by the weight of the rail or capacity of bridges? If so, NJT may not be in a position to modify it.

I wonder if it is just a limit so that the wear and tear on their line is not substantial - such as why trucks are not allow North of 105 on the parkway. If you think about it, 40 -50 years ago there were freight trains of all lengths going up and down that line on a daily basis. I would have to assume the line (NJCL that is) is in better shape now then when PC and CNJ maintained it with a skeleton or non-existent maintenance budget.

The Coast Line is probably in the best shape since it was built to be perfectly honest. I don't know if its bridges or track or just a paperwork restriction. Obviously the bridges and track can handle more weight, as diesel locos are heavier than that. but a passing diesel followed by lighter cars (both freight and passenger) is going to have much less affect on the track and structures than a diesel towing cars that have axle loadings nearly as much as the diesel.

Those "bad ol days" can't really be compared to present day, as the cars were limited to lower weights. 100 ton hoppers were the norm. Less than car load boxcars, etc. The trains were longer, but lighter. But everything was relative. The locos were lighter and less powerful, the cars had less capacity,and were lighter, but the rail and railroad was built to lighter standards (in many cases) as well.

Here is some eye candy:
New crossing gates on Wranglebrook road.

Sharp looking picture. Thanks.

Great looking picture! Thank you! I hope to see more crossings completed like that in the near future.

why would they need signals on this line if the rest of the has none futher north? would the signals be for clayton or for the railroad? great to see all this activaty! thanks

why would they have signals just on this end of the line? are they for clayton pit use or for the rail lines use? thanks

The entire rail line from rail junction at Union St, Lakehurst back to Woodmansie (13 miles) is an industial track owned by Clayton. Formerly, it was the main line for the CNJ Southern Division and Clayton only had a siding off this mainline until the 1980's (1986?) when he bought it. He stopped use in 1988 (?) after his previous subcontracted rail operator, Ashland Railway, derailed a couple of times and then shifted to all trucking. All the track signals and grading crossings that have been discussed here are in support of the rebuilding of that industrial line.

I apologize if I am off by a year or two. Please provide corrections.

Schmatzy wrote:I just look at diesel prices and think about what Clayton is paying to move his sand around and know that something awfully remunerative is on the end of this.

...

The fact that it is sand again is yet another indication that someone after all this time has decided the timing is right.

We were meeting with a customer in North Jersey, Cambridge Paving Stones, that uses a large number of truckloads a day of sand and they felt that diesel prices were the largest factor in their recent prices increases. Their relative proximity to the former DL&W line may make them an excellent prospective customer for Clayton if they are not already using their sand for production. If they are I wonder how feasible it is to convert them to rail.

CJPat wrote:The entire rail line from rail junction at Union St, Lakehurst back to Woodmansie (13 miles) is an industial track owned by Clayton. Formerly, it was the main line for the CNJ Southern Division and Clayton only had a siding off this mainline until the 1980's (1986?) when he bought it. He stopped use in 1988 (?) after his previous subcontracted rail operator, Ashland Railway, derailed a couple of times and then shifted to all trucking. All the track signals and grading crossings that have been discussed here are in support of the rebuilding of that industrial line.

I apologize if I am off by a year or two. Please provide corrections.

Interesting stuff, I was never aware of the contracted Ashland Railway service in the 1980's.
Does anyone here know the last time a train traversed the entire Southern Secondary between Winslow Junction and Red Bank? South of Clayton, the ROW appears to be nearly 100% overgrown in places.

The last revenue freight between Winslow and Woodmansie I show as August 3, 1978.

I am surprised it took Conrail 5+ years to figure out that the Southern Division was redundant. I wonder what changed to make them realize that. I thought there were only very few customers between Woodmansie and Winslow. Conrail was very quick to make those assessments elsewhere.