• French Trains !

  • Discussion about railroad topics everywhere outside of Canada and the United States.
Discussion about railroad topics everywhere outside of Canada and the United States.

Moderators: Komachi, David Benton

  by 3rdrail
 
raphael wrote:@3rdrail :

Wow I'm curious to see it !! for the moment I can't help you but I'll find where come from this headlight, can you show me some pics of this one ?
Hi raphael-
I have been looking for a photo that I have of this lantern, but as of yet, cannot find it. I may have to wait as I am still in prehistoric camera with film mode. hahaha!!! I think that your offer to answer our questions is great, raphael, and want you to know that if there is anything that you would like to know, please do no hesitate to ask. (Guys, if raphael asks a question which we do no know, let's try to find the answer for him, ok ?)
  by raphael
 
@George : Cool !! you'll be my personnal english teacher !! lol

@David : Sometimes it could be very usefull to speak another language, before I found this forum I wasn't used to write in english, I know that I need to improve it, but it's cool to share something with another english people.

Have fun !!
  by raphael
 
3rdrail wrote:
raphael wrote:@3rdrail :

Wow I'm curious to see it !! for the moment I can't help you but I'll find where come from this headlight, can you show me some pics of this one ?
Hi raphael-
I have been looking for a photo that I have of this lantern, but as of yet, cannot find it. I may have to wait as I am still in prehistoric camera with film mode. hahaha!!! I think that your offer to answer our questions is great, raphael, and want you to know that if there is anything that you would like to know, please do no hesitate to ask. (Guys, if raphael asks a question which we do no know, let's try to find the answer for him, ok ?)
@3rdrail : Thank you very much ! I'll search a very hard question for you ! as much is hard to find some informations about your lantern !! ^^ so... I'm suppose that you "googlelized" your lantern but if you can find just one picture of it, it should be very good for my research, I found this french website with lot of SNCF lanterns, may be could you recognize your !!

http://lampterophiliste.free.fr/Lampe/Lampe3.htm

Good luck !!
  by raphael
 
My second house !!!

Saint Lazare Station ( in french the word for station is "Gare", Gare Saint Lazare)

La Gare Saint Lazare was the first station built in Paris under the reign of the King Louis Philippe 1st in 1837, initially this station was made only with wood !!

Today, Saint Lazare is the second largest station of France by its traffic (about 100 million passengers for a year) and the third in Europe. unfortunately we don't have any TGV (High speed train like the Acela Express in Usa) in this station, maximum speed autorized on their tracks is 200km/h around 125mph, on high speed tracks their trains are autorized to 300km/h around 186mph.

Image

PS: Acela Express is authorized to 240km/h around 150mph.
  by george matthews
 
I used to arrive at Gare St Lazare from Cherbourg (the ferry from Poole). But I haven't seen it since the tunnel opened (actionnaire). I remember hearing there was a fire there. Has the trainshed been rebuilt? I haven't seen it since the Cherbourg line was electrified.
  by raphael
 
george matthews wrote:I used to arrive at Gare St Lazare from Cherbourg (the ferry from Poole). But I haven't seen it since the tunnel opened (actionnaire). I remember hearing there was a fire there. Has the trainshed been rebuilt? I haven't seen it since the Cherbourg line was electrified.
Hello George !

Sorry I think I'am a little bit to young I never heard this story about this fire but there is not any traces of fire in the station nowaday , and the Cherbourg lines was electrified since Mai 1996 at this moment I was only 16 years old, I started my career in SNCF only in 2005.
  by ExCon90
 
Raphael,

I think St. Lazare is probably my favorite station in Paris for the constant train movements in and out on 10 main tracks (I think I read some time ago that there is on average an arrival or departure every 28 seconds in rush hours), and a great variety of equipment. The lack of TGVs doesn't bother me -- they all look alike. (I suppose Gare de Lyon is 1st in number of passengers, but so many of them are on TGVs.) I always liked standing on the platform at Pont Cardinet and watching the action.
  by raphael
 
ExCon90 wrote:Raphael,

I think St. Lazare is probably my favorite station in Paris for the constant train movements in and out on 10 main tracks (I think I read some time ago that there is on average an arrival or departure every 28 seconds in rush hours), and a great variety of equipment. The lack of TGVs doesn't bother me -- they all look alike. (I suppose Gare de Lyon is 1st in number of passengers, but so many of them are on TGVs.) I always liked standing on the platform at Pont Cardinet and watching the action.
@Excon90 : You're near of truth, in rush hours there are departure or arrival every 26 seconds ! with daily about 1700 trains, the biggest station of Paris is La gare du Nord (may be the 1st in Europe to, but I'm not sure) with Eurostar to London and Thalys to Belgium, Deutschland and Netherland and so many TGV to north of France.
  by AX-330
 
Hi Raphael,
raphael wrote:I'm a French train driver, I can answer everything you want to know about French trains, Rules on the French railroad, light, Diesel or electrical locomotive...
Thanks for your offer! If there's anything you (or anyone else, of course) would like to know about railroading in Germany, feel free to ask or send me a PM.

When I still was a trainee, I went to Forbach (Alsace) with my instructor three times as we were the relief crew for a Veolia freight service bound to Germany. I asked way too little questions back then.

For a start, do you need a full-blown French license to operate on the short piece of track between Sarrebruck and Forbach or might a lesser license be sufficient? There's a similar situation between Basel (Badischer Bahnhof) which is on Swiss territory but operated by the DB under their rules and Muttenz, the freight yard in Basel which is run by the SBB. You only need to pass oral and written exams after a (rather dense) week of theoretical and practical training to get the Muttenz license, but you can't go anywhere else in Switzerland with it.

The next thing that got me thinking was the Alstom Prima locomotive. What a strange piece of kit it is (you'll surely say the same about our 185 I think :-)), but I quickly started to like her and got about six hours seat time. It was a bit anemic as it was the 4,2MW version, but extremely quiet, very comfortable and user-friendly. Loved the flip-out QUERTY keyboard and the tread brakes! But what made the question of who's driving (my instructor or me) most interesting was that the Prima only has one seat in the cab. Why is that? Is every French locomotive set up like this? Where shall I rest my feet on while standing in the siding and reading the newspaper? :)

And I wondered about the SNCF passenger train boys and gals that came into Forbach before our train arrived. None of them wore a uniform - is this standard?

One last question (for today ;)) regarding the KVB train protection. Let's assume it becomes inoperable on your loco while you're underway. How can you proceed then - with a written order, permission from operations control over the radio or something else? What kind of operational or speed limits will come into effect?

Looking forward to hearing from you, and have a nice day everybody -
Andreas
  by David Benton
 
Welcome to the worldwide forum Andreas . Good to have a engineer from Germany onboard as well .
Your use of "strange piece of kit " made me laugh . a very english saying , though usually they would say "a nice bit of kit" to describe a good piece of machinery , or maybe a good looking woman . but again , i admire all our european contributors command of english .
  by raphael
 
AX-330 wrote:Hi Raphael,
raphael wrote:I'm a French train driver, I can answer everything you want to know about French trains, Rules on the French railroad, light, Diesel or electrical locomotive...
Thanks for your offer! If there's anything you (or anyone else, of course) would like to know about railroading in Germany, feel free to ask or send me a PM.

When I still was a trainee, I went to Forbach (Alsace) with my instructor three times as we were the relief crew for a Veolia freight service bound to Germany...

Looking forward to hearing from you, and have a nice day everybody -
Andreas
Hello Andreas !!

wow !! what a wonderfull questions !!!

1- In France we have two kinds of engineers, local engineers and principal engineers, local engineers can't go on this track I think, principal engineers are allowed to go on this track but they must have a training for the German rules and pass a short exam. we have the same situation for the Eurostar track, Thalys Tracks (Belgium, netherland, Germany), engineers received aslo a language training.

2- Alstom Prima... I'll drive this locomotive this year !! for expending my tracks knowledges, this locomotive was made for the freight trafic but they turn into passenger traffic, but I can't respond on this point, why did they made it with only one sit it's not very comfortable for the second person in cab !! in France I think it's the only locomotive with this caracteristic, but when you're on the seat it's very cool, central position, very large windshield and it's a very powerfull locomotive !

3 - In France our conductors (controleurs) wear uniforms because they're in contact with the passenger they need to be recognize, but engineers don't need to be recognize we come at work in civil clothes.

4 - KVB !!! a German security system !!! I'm curious to know your rules in the same situation in Germany... here there are two possibility... depending of hour of the day, in rush hours we can keep on just with an oral order transmit by radio by the chief regulator without any restrictions of speed, in this situation we can stay with this locomotive during rush hours (6H9h/16H-19h). second possibility we're not in rush hours, we can keep on to the terminus (without any restrictions of speed) where the locomotive will be come back to the maintenance service, you're allowed to go to the maintenance service only with a written order in this case.

Hope you enjoy !!
  by george matthews
 
I have a question. Is there going to be a second LGV Nord to supplement the existing line, and will it connect with Amiens? I believe that the mayors of Lille and Amiens disputed which city should get the original LGV Nord. Lille has greatly benefitted whereas Amiens may have stagnated (but I like the town as it is).
  by AX-330
 
Hi Raphael,
raphael wrote:2- Alstom Prima... I'll drive this locomotive this year !! for expending my tracks knowledges, this locomotive was made for the freight trafic but they turn into passenger traffic, but I can't respond on this point, why did they made it with only one sit it's not very comfortable for the second person in cab !! in France I think it's the only locomotive with this caracteristic, but when you're on the seat it's very cool, central position, very large windshield and it's a very powerfull locomotive !
Yep, cool it is, especially if you're suited to driving on the right side. The Prima certainly offers a - let's call it "commanding" - view and position for the driver, but it's all nonsense if there's no seat at all for the guy who's riding along with you.
raphael wrote:3 - In France our conductors (controleurs) wear uniforms because they're in contact with the passenger they need to be recognize, but engineers don't need to be recognize we come at work in civil clothes.
Has this ever been this way?

Certain engineers here, even if they are with private companys now, still take their pride in wearing the uniform the Deutsche Bundesbahn (West) or Deutsche Reichsbahn (East) gave them, meaning they will wear jackets, insignia, and caps as ushered to them once. If you're still employed by Deutsche Bahn, you'll better wear their current kind of uniform, which looks like a bad caricature of a pilot's uniform. There's even a number of shoulder stripes (called "Pommes", "french fries") you'll have to wear, distingushing between "Bereitstellungslokführer" and "Streckenlokführer'" which means - if you abbreviate it - you're either driving the trains from the depot to the terminus station (like Munich, Frankfurt, Hamburg) or you are actually operating them. Not wearing the company dress may result in discharge. Let's just say that engineers are very well in the public deception here, and everybody wants them dressed up. Might be very German.

You are relieved of this circus stuff if you are not in the perception of the public - meaning, if you drive freighters. I'm not with DB and I drive freighters, which means that I can dress whichever way I want at work :-)
raphael wrote:4 - KVB !!! a German security system !!!
KVB is genuinely French, I thought?
raphael wrote:I'm curious to know your rules in the same situation in Germany... here there are two possibility... depending of hour of the day, in rush hours we can keep on just with an oral order transmit by radio by the chief regulator without any restrictions of speed, in this situation we can stay with this locomotive during rush hours (6H9h/16H-19h). second possibility we're not in rush hours, we can keep on to the terminus (without any restrictions of speed) where the locomotive will be come back to the maintenance service, you're allowed to go to the maintenance service only with a written order in this case.
Do you really couple your procedures regarding a non-functional KVB equipment on your train to the time of the day that malfunction happens? What's the point of that? Commuters first, safety second?

We've got two stages of PZB (our take on the KVB) malfunction. I've yet to find a guy who had to employ it, but the first stage is "abschalten", which literally means to switch it off. It's not gone, it's only in trouble mode. To do so, you will have to check back with operations center, and they will have to give you their go ahead. Your top speed will be limited to 100 km/h with a 5 km/h threshold, if you'll exceed it, you'll get a penalty brake application. Doesn't matter what kind of train you are, freight or ICE, the rules are the same, and you will only do so if you're really troubled. It's absolutely rare, but there are no sealed switches, it's merely the press of a button away.

The second stage is ausschalten of the PZB, which means you'll kill it with several fuses. It's the last resort. There will be no protection at all. You'll never do this in your career. It's only a theoretical exercise. Even now there aren't any seals to be broken, but on most locomotives, it'll be recorded if you'll flip-da-switch.
  by AX-330
 
David Benton wrote:Your use of "strange piece of kit " made me laugh . a very english saying , though usually they would say "a nice bit of kit" to describe a good piece of machinery , or maybe a good looking woman . but again , i admire all our european contributors command of english .
Well, I used it to intentionally describe a very debatable kind of kit, at least from the user's point of view. My intention to make it sound strange has obviously succeeded ;)

Let's just say that I watched an awful lot of Top Gear in the early 2000s and my english teacher in Gymnasium hailed from Sacramento, CA. And I may still remind you down there that the English language still is a street-dog (as my word might have been censored) mixture of Plattdeutsch and vulgar Latin.

Or that I was taught. ;)
  by Jeff Smith
 
raphael wrote:@George : Cool !! you'll be my personnal english teacher !! lol

@David : Sometimes it could be very usefull to speak another language, before I found this forum I wasn't used to write in english, I know that I need to improve it, but it's cool to share something with another english people.

Have fun !!
Your English is terrific, and welcome to the forum! I wish my German was as good. I know very little French I'm afraid. I've been to Paris once (1981), but am afraid I did not ride any trains while there. I am very familiar with the German train system, but haven't been back there since 1991.

In any case, welcome, and thank you for providing your insight and sharing your knowledge. It's a wonderful resource to the board.