CP Draw River crossing-Photo

On Jan 18th I went and did some flying. It was about 5 degrees. Here is a photo that I took of CPDraw in Buffalo.

The elevator just to the left is the backside of Concrete Central. Just above that is a glimpse of the Child St elevator with several rail cars parked. There was hardly any train movements at the time. A couple of units moving boxcars [not in the photo] and thats it. The new business that's on the ex-B&S has rail service. They had 5 or 6 cars outside.

Despite the cold it was a beautiful day.

http://www.boatnerd.com/news/newsthumbs ... g-Iced.jpg

I get a blank page when I click the link. Is there an error perhaps on your part? Would love to see the shot as the Buffalo area is one of my favorite places.

I got it to load up just fine... what a great shot of DRAW and the surrounding area. What are the two NS engines off to the left doing? Enjoying the view?

Do boats still use this channel? Does DRAW still, um, draw?

-otto-

I would suspect that they are waiting to get over Draw and head to their yard thats about 1/2 mile east of Draw. I forget it's name. Or possibly heading to Frontier.

all I get is a weather report for detroit when I click the link.

Odd, the link works fine for me... And, yes, that's a fine shot.

The link worked fine for me. Refresh your browsers. Might help.

Dave Becker

No Otto, boats don't come down this way any more.

This is a great view of the supposed "Bottle Neck Of Buffalo". You have two or three railroads all using this one bridge. CSX, NS and I beleave the South Buffalo RR uses it. Can anyone confirm that?

I was out one day a few years ago with a friend of mine who used to work at Ohio Street yard, and we found some teenagers who actually climbed to the top of the bridge, and then had the nerve to flip us off. That was all we needed to call the police.

Anyway, as you can imagine, lots and lots of activity here!

Yes Otto, ships still use the channel on occasion.

The bridge is double track not single.

The bride was owned by the Buffalo Creek Railroad originally.

First bridge at the top is the Ex NYC Main Line River Bridge, now single track (Main line 3) , owned by CSX and in service. The raised bridge is the Ex NKP owned by NS and permenantly raised in the up position. The bridge that's next to it in the down position is CP Draw, dubble track (main line 1 & 2), and originally built by the Buffalo Creek RR and now owned by CSX and in service. The two NS Engines are in the Tift St. Yard and may be switching either their yard or the B&P Buffalo Creek Yard. They may also be waiting near the bridge for permission to cross East into Buffalo Junction Yard, or up the Bison Runner, back to Bison Yard. Hard to say.
River Bridge and Draw are both in operating condition and boats still go up above them to the Exxon-Mobil Elk St. Terminal from time to time. The Fireboat Edward M Cotter also goes up to break ice for flood control. I have many photos of boats up there for anyone interested, e-mail me at "[email protected]" and I'll send them to you.

-B in B

I have to ask this question, would lowering the Ex-Nickle Plate Bridge and putting train over it help to relieve the so-called bottle neck?

Brooks

Probably easier yet would be to restore double track to the River line. It was double track maybe 10 years ago. I thought the 3rd bridge either needed close to total re-building, and was raised in a semi-permanent state. I'm sure someone here knows more

After work today I drove down Katherine street today which is the closest to the River bridge. A train was crossing the bridge just then, and a local was snaking thru the residential areas there spotting like 15 hoppers at ADM and a single over-size box car at another business there

You can get a closer look at the bridges from the end of Smith St., off South Park. There's a fantastic view from the corner of the turn of the river with lift bridges on either side.

The NKP draw bridge needs major overhaul work. The NS wanted the state to fund a total rebuild and when Albany said no, they dropped the plans. The best thing to do would be to either rebuild or replace that bridge and then realign the mains with a swap between CSX and NS. That way the NS could come out of Bison, cross CP Draw, and be in Tift St. Yard or on their main heading south without having to cross the CSX mains. This would leave Buffalo Junction Yard on the wrong side of the tracks, but they are not using it to full capacity anyway and they could easily lay some more track at either Bison, or SK to compensate for what little they might loose at Buffalo Junction.

The CSX does not want another track restored on (NYC) River Bridge due to the speed restriction through the heavy curve at CP 1. Conrail used to run through there on dubble track before the track rationalization plans of the 1980's. They swung the mains over to the Buffalo Creek Bridge (CP Draw) for just that reason-to avoid the tight curve on River Bridge. They kept RB as a back up when Draw is clogged up with trains, or raised for a boat.

-B in B

One last question then, can boats go under the current River Bridge without it needing to be lifted? Is if a lift bridge, or is it high enough that boat traffic can cross under?

Brooks

I will assume we are looking north in this pic. In May 1996, I was on the LSL eastbound videoing out the window. We did not go to CP Draw. and instead must have been on the NYC main-it was a single track. We ended up at Depew station though. The other times I've been on the train, we went over CP Draw.