CMSL in the news

rrbluesman wrote:The way it seems is that the CMSL made an agreement no to run trains until the signals are working, or at least that is what it seems like.

Do we know that as fact or is this conjecture?

That is my best conjecture from the articles from the newspapers and what was posted on the CMSL website.

On a somewhat related topic, apparently the last hurtles have been cleared for the rebuilding of the parkway through Cape May Court House and elimination of those well loved traffic signals.

From the Press of Atlantic City:

MIDDLE TOWNSHIP — The last big obstacle for the $125 million project to take out three traffic signals on the Garden State Parkway has been removed, state Sen. Jeff Van Drew announced Thursday.

Full story: http://www.pressofatlanticcity.com/comm ... 963f4.html

The reason I say "somewhat" related is that this work is now scheduled to start next year and run through at least two to three summer seasons with potential traffic nightmares as a result of the construction. It would be terrific if CMSL could somehow find a way to run from CMCH again (or someplace further north) from a park and ride for Cape May day trippers. While the traffic reduction from the GSP might be negligible, it would certainly provide a great alternative for those folks making the trip south.

I don't think its so much finding/showing a written agreement that they aren't going to run trains until the complete crossing protection is installed and working but rather the fact that its being used as an excuse for not having the trains running, and its not a valid excuse, at least "legally" with regard to railroad rules.

There are unprotected crossings on various lines of NJT property where they run trains multiple times faster than the CMSL will ever run. All that is there is a "Railroad Crossing" crossbucks - no lights, no gates. Of course, they are used on very lightly used or private crossings, but they exist never the less.

The CMSL doesn't brake any land/speed records down there, the lights and gates are very nice to have, but not having them is not a valid reason to not run trains.

The rails are so rusty anyway, and the service so infrequent that the crews would probably have to stop and flag the Xing anyway for a long time until the rails got polished up and the crossing circuits would operate reliably.

Now, IF they had an agreement with the town or NJT or someone else that they would NOT run until the Crossing protection was installed, then that reason for not running the trains would be valid (it would be kind of silly to enter an agreement like that in the first place, but whatever) but again, not having crossing protection sounds good, but it doesn't hold any water

The point about the rusty rail is well taken, exactly the reason they used PRR 9000 as the rust breaker for the first day or so when they ran in 2010.

Trainlawyer, the articles I speak of are attched to earlier posts on this thread from March about Mr. Voll and the effort made to look into expenditures regarding how CMSL was spending money towards MOW and the line. I am not sure how to post the links again, but they are already posted in earlier messages as I said, in combination with what the CMSL website had posted about operations. Again, I don't know how to post the link but the CMSL website is capemayseashorelines.org.

is Mr Voll getting credit for geting rid of thge lights? Seams like he would.

bystander wrote:is Mr Voll getting credit for geting rid of thge lights? Seams like he would.

Mike Voll will take credit for anything that makes his head swell, whether it's in the public interest or not.

Jtgshu wrote:I don't think its so much finding/showing a written agreement that they aren't going to run trains until the complete crossing protection is installed and working but rather the fact that its being used as an excuse for not having the trains running, and its not a valid excuse, at least "legally" with regard to railroad rules.

There are unprotected crossings on various lines of NJT property where they run trains multiple times faster than the CMSL will ever run. All that is there is a "Railroad Crossing" crossbucks - no lights, no gates. Of course, they are used on very lightly used or private crossings, but they exist never the less.

The CMSL doesn't brake any land/speed records down there, the lights and gates are very nice to have, but not having them is not a valid reason to not run trains.

The rails are so rusty anyway, and the service so infrequent that the crews would probably have to stop and flag the Xing anyway for a long time until the rails got polished up and the crossing circuits would operate reliably.

Now, IF they had an agreement with the town or NJT or someone else that they would NOT run until the Crossing protection was installed, then that reason for not running the trains would be valid (it would be kind of silly to enter an agreement like that in the first place, but whatever) but again, not having crossing protection sounds good, but it doesn't hold any water

Correct that the grade crossings are not a comparatively significant factor. That said, since some 6,000 feet of track had the spikes and tieplates removed by the thieves a few months ago, no equipment can be moved to the southern end. The cost to repair the 6,000 feet of track is immense compared to the financial resources of the railroad. This is the number one obstacle. Number two is that about 10 miles of track between Tuckahoe and Rio Grande is excepted so no revenue passenger trains can use it per FRA rules so Tuckahoe - Cape May can't be run. Excepted is OK for deadhead moves to Rio Grande, but the 6,000 feet would need to be repaired first. Again, the cost of bringing the 10 miles of track up to class one is substantial. These are very significant impediments to running passenger service.

Should the issues be remedied, service would most likely be Tuesday thru Friday during the beach summer season. Historically, ridership was very low Saturday thru Monday, and trains much better patronized the rest of the week.

One cannot remove 6,000 feet(well over a mile of track) in one night without some "Oceans 11 type" planning. This had to be a month long process, and I have NEVER in the United States heard of that much rail being stolen from an ACTIVE railway. I understand that its the police's responsibility to track down and apprehend thieves, but somebody at the CMSL really dropped the ball by not catching this while it was happening because it sure as hell wasn't a smash and grab.

I disagree with the suggestion made by Hawaiitiki that CMSL should have caught Dallin, Dallin and Camp while the track thefts were taking place. The thefts took place during the winter, when there was no real reason to inspect the track on a regular basis; there were no deadhead moves of passenger equipment planned, nor were there any storage cars in or out.

I'm not sure I've written this before, but this is a case where all the niceties of due process should be suspended. The three criminals cited above should immediately be held accountable for the damage they have done, and be made to pay for prompt repairs of that track. If it means they have to forfeit their cars, trucks, homes, boats, and whatever other possesions they may have, so be it.

Also, the scrap yard that purchased that much OTM should also be held responsible for repairs. A mile and a quarters worth of tie plates and spikes, even in small quantities, and over a period of days or weeks, should have raised eyebrows at a reputable scrap yard. (And that is not an oxymoron, there are some reputable yards out there). I'm sure that particular yard has far, far deeper pockets than the thieves that brought the material in.

CMSL certantly wasn't afforded due process here. Its high time that the legal system sets an example; this kind of crap has to stop!

Hawaiitiki wrote:One cannot remove 6,000 feet(well over a mile of track) in one night without some "Oceans 11 type" planning. This had to be a month long process, and I have NEVER in the United States heard of that much rail being stolen from an ACTIVE railway. I understand that its the police's responsibility to track down and apprehend thieves, but somebody at the CMSL really dropped the ball by not catching this while it was happening because it sure as hell wasn't a smash and grab.

Not to lessen the impact of the crime but for clarification purposes, what they stole was tie plates and spikes. Nonetheless, even though the rails are still there, they are useless without something to hold them in place. The report was that there was also significant tie damage so a good portion of the ties will also need replacement or remediation.

EDM5970 wrote:I disagree with the suggestion made by Hawaiitiki that CMSL should have caught Dallin, Dallin and Camp while the track thefts were taking place. The thefts took place during the winter, when there was no real reason to inspect the track on a regular basis; there were no deadhead moves of passenger equipment planned, nor were there any storage cars in or out.

I'm not sure I've written this before, but this is a case where all the niceties of due process should be suspended. The three criminals cited above should immediately be held accountable for the damage they have done, and be made to pay for prompt repairs of that track. If it means they have to forfeit their cars, trucks, homes, boats, and whatever other possesions they may have, so be it.

Also, the scrap yard that purchased that much OTM should also be held responsible for repairs. A mile and a quarters worth of tie plates and spikes, even in small quantities, and over a period of days or weeks, should have raised eyebrows at a reputable scrap yard. (And that is not an oxymoron, there are some reputable yards out there). I'm sure that particular yard has far, far deeper pockets than the thieves that brought the material in.

CMSL certantly wasn't afforded due process here. Its high time that the legal system sets an example; this kind of crap has to stop!

I suspect that restitution may well be part of a plea bargain. Based on my experience with same in relation to prosecution of thefts of natural gas and electricity, that process can drag out for a year or more. A scrapyard owner may well have the assets from which restitution could be received; highly unlikely individuals directly involved in removing the spikes and ties have any meaningful assets.

The key point is that Tony and his railroad are in a difficult situation largely out of their control and should not be faulted for the inability to operate trains.

glennk419 wrote:

Hawaiitiki wrote:One cannot remove 6,000 feet(well over a mile of track) in one night without some "Oceans 11 type" planning. This had to be a month long process, and I have NEVER in the United States heard of that much rail being stolen from an ACTIVE railway. I understand that its the police's responsibility to track down and apprehend thieves, but somebody at the CMSL really dropped the ball by not catching this while it was happening because it sure as hell wasn't a smash and grab.

Not to lessen the impact of the crime but for clarification purposes, what they stole was tie plates and spikes. Nonetheless, even though the rails are still there, they are useless without something to hold them in place. The report was that there was also significant tie damage so a good portion of the ties will also need replacement or remediation.

My understanding was the spikes were removed by hand. The "significant damage" to the ties was due to their poor condition prior to the theft. Supposedly, any ties in good condition where spike removal required tools were skipped. I'm sure this was done over a period of time and not in one night. Remember folks, we're talking crackheads here.

kilroy wrote: Remember folks, we're talking crackheads here.

Yes, sadly they seem to be a lot more prevalent today then they were 50+ years ago......

Off topic, I'm sorry, but here is another good example of what we are up against in today's society!!

http://www.wbtv.com/story/18095360/prot ... coal-plant#