Cardinal discussion

As someone said, the Cardinal's market is really West Virginia and the midwest. I think it does a decent job of serving West Virginia. It could do a lot more for the midwest. If you were going from the NEC to Chicago (assuming you're not a railfan): 16 hours on the Capitol, 23 on the Cardinal. It also probably serves a purpose Indianapolis to Chicago but the state should pay for a daily train, although the slow schedule is terrible.

I believe a lot more could be done to serve the midwest by combining the train with the Palmetto NYP-WAS. The earlier departure and later arrival would put arrival into Huntington or Ashland, KY at much better times to have Thruway buses connect to Columbus and Louisville (both about 2.5 hours by road). A midnight arrival in Cinci and 6am return would help attract riders from that large city and may provide a Thruway connection to Dayton, if not on to Indianapolis. I'm not sure the train serves a useful purpose beyond Cinci, especially on a tri weekly schedule. The mileage saved by combining it with the Palmetto NY-WAS and making it a Cincinnati daytime trains would enable a daily operation. Use the sleepers (plus some of the new ones) on the Pennsylvanian for a CL connection at Pittsburgh, assuming the funds could be found to make the necessary track changes in Pittsburgh.

It needs to serve its key market well rather than trying to do all things poorly.

As I have stated before the whole point of the Cardinal is to service West Virginia and the Ohio River valley. It does not need to service the NEC into NYP. Terminate it at Washington. If Charleston really needs NYP single seat rides, then West Virginia should fund it.

If you want more more efficient NYC - CHI service, you don't go thru DC or Albany. You go through PHI, limit the stops and help NS upgrade the track west of Harrisburg. Whether you call it the Broadway Limited or the Three Rivers is immaterial.

But as a railfan I would prefer the scenery through Western Virginia, West Virginia and along the Ohio River on the Cardinal to the other routes and time is not an issue. If I gotta take a NE Regional to Washington to catch Cardinal so be it.

Cardinal ridership stats,
https://www.railpassengers.org/site/ass ... 448/18.pdf" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Surprisingly , West Virginia cities may not have as high a ridership as you would think. Only Charleston makes an appearance in both the top ten tables. Charlottesville is the real surprise. I think the Cardinal should be daily to there, same day turn on the days the full Cardinal doesn't run.

Palmetto connections at WASH may have merit. Once again quit trying to make the Cardinal an end to end train. Passengers from Indianapolis to Charlottesville need the connections at WASH and CHI.

east point wrote:Palmetto connections at WASH may have merit. Once again quit trying to make the Cardinal an end to end train. Passengers from Indianapolis to Charlottesville need the connections at WASH and CHI.

This gives me an idea. I wonder if this change could be in preparation for an additional NEC Regional to Roanoke.

The Palmetto is packed with its dual purpose. It doesn't need a triple purpose which is why the connecting train is 111. There is a valid case for utilizing Superliner equipment. The accident in Cayce has eliminated a single level set of equipment. Even the equipment that was salvageable will not be available for quite some time.

While David Benton posted the top 10 city pairs, when you get to the top 20 revenue generating pairs, you now see the impact of letting this train traverse the corridor. This also the many, many riders in the other markets (such as Staunton) that are contributing to the bottom line without going to a major city pair.

However, if I had to pick a train to break up into regional service, this would be it. Unfortunately, the states may not fund it and it would be lost. Contrary to popular (and misguided) opinions, losing the Cardinal would not make the Broadway Limited magically reappear. We'll see what Amtrak2.0 holds.

ThirdRail7: if WV’s senators have any pull (and in this neverending Infrastructure Week they may have more pull than under a Democratic Congress) they might be able to get Appalachian Development dollars to pay for their state share of a NYC - Charleston Train. At least, I’d angle for them.

I was researching a Cardinal trip for late April or early May and found out the #50 will terminate at WAS due to track work beginning 3/30/21018. What is this work that requires 6 trains per week be eliminated but not the hundreds of others on the NEC?

NYP track work. Amazing isn't it that work 249 miles away affects service ? Cardinal's late arrival especially if delayed would interfere with that NYP track work.

Five NEC trains per day are skipping NYP.

R&DB wrote:I was researching a Cardinal trip for late April or early May and found out the #50 will terminate at WAS due to track work beginning 3/30/21018. What is this work that requires 6 trains per week be eliminated but not the hundreds of others on the NEC?

Well, for one thing it's probably less work to terminate a train which otherwise requires an engine change vs something that does. Presumably not so much capacity is needed during that time that it is necessary to run the train north and terminate it at PHL or elsewhere.

chuchubob wrote:Five NEC trains per day are skipping NYP.

Well that is a 5 to 1 ratio seems about right ? Are the 5 NER trains all originating / terminating NYP ?i

The Cardinals eastbound service would start eating into nite worktime, if running late , which it is prone to do .
Also , I think someone mentioned a single level car shortage after the Star crash , this setup allows the Cardinal to use superliner cars if necessary.

By now the undamaged cars on that ill fated star consist should be able to be used,unless there were injuries in every car of that consist,
then the legal beagles have the cars on legal hold untill everything settles,in or out of court.